I keep getting my ass kicked, not even reaching the enemy, tanks wiping me out 😭

I have 3 exalted sorcerers, 8 rubric flamers, 8 rubric Bolters, 2 devaster cannon rubrics, 2 aspiring sorcerers, 1 helbrute, 5 terminators, Ahriman and a rhino

Was reading the transport rules yesterday and saw an FAQ explaining that you can use firing deck to shoot a units weapons even if they embarked after falling back or advancing.

This seems like a pretty powerful interaction if you can make it work, but I’ve never seen anyone use it. Seems like a great way to get some extra value out of a unit

Is there a play style or faction where people use this rule regularly? Have any of you ever gotten use out of it?

So here’s the list I was thinking of bringing to my next tournament. I’m a little Concerned about scoring action secondaries.

Through sagi splitting I got two units of warriors (one for home, one for secondaries), two units of bikes for scoring and shooting, potentially two units of berserk’s if really needed. In my opinion I don’t think it will make sense to use the 6 man bike unit for or the berserks.

I was thinking about splitting the 6 man bike into 2 units to enable some more potential scoring but I do kind of like the killing potential of the 6 man unit but that being said I could probably just move 2 3 mans together and have them act like a 6 man.

So I guess my question is do I have enough for secondaries? Any other list feed back?

My meta is pretty good mix of everything tbh so kind of need an all comers.

Here’s my list

Einhyr Champion (80 Points) • 1x Autoch-pattern combi-bolter • 1x Mass hammer • 1x Weavefield Crest • Enhancements: Grim Demeanour

Kâhl (70 Points) • Warlord • 1x Autoch-pattern combi-bolter • 1x Forgewrought plasma axe • 1x Rampart Crest

BATTLELINE

Hearthkyn Warriors (100 Points) • 1x Theyn ◦ 1x Autoch-pattern bolt pistol ◦ 1x Autoch-pattern bolter ◦ 1x Close combat weapon ◦ 1x Weavefield Crest • 9x Hearthkyn Warrior ◦ 9x Autoch-pattern bolt pistol ◦ 9x Autoch-pattern bolter ◦ 9x Close combat weapon

DEDICATED TRANSPORTS

Sagitaur (115 Points) • 1x Armoured wheels • 1x HYLas beam cannon • 1x Twin bolt cannon

Sagitaur (115 Points) • 1x Armoured wheels • 1x HYLas beam cannon • 1x Twin bolt cannon

Sagitaur (115 Points) • 1x Armoured wheels • 1x HYLas beam cannon • 1x Twin bolt cannon

OTHER DATASHEETS

Cthonian Beserks (100 Points) • 5x Cthonian Beserk ◦ 5x Concussion maul ◦ 1x Mole grenade launcher

Cthonian Beserks (100 Points) • 5x Cthonian Beserk ◦ 5x Concussion maul ◦ 1x Mole grenade launcher

Einhyr Hearthguard (150 Points) • 1x Hesyr ◦ 1x Concussion hammer ◦ 1x Exo-armour grenade launcher ◦ 1x Volkanite disintegrator ◦ 1x Weavefield Crest • 4x Einhyr Hearthguard ◦ 4x Concussion gauntlet ◦ 4x Exo-armour grenade launcher ◦ 4x Volkanite disintegrator

Einhyr Hearthguard (150 Points) • 1x Hesyr ◦ 1x Concussion hammer ◦ 1x Exo-armour grenade launcher ◦ 1x Volkanite disintegrator ◦ 1x Weavefield Crest • 4x Einhyr Hearthguard ◦ 4x Concussion gauntlet ◦ 4x Exo-armour grenade launcher ◦ 4x Volkanite disintegrator

Hekaton Land Fortress (225 Points) • 1x Armoured wheels • 1x MATR autocannon • 1x Pan Spectral Scanner • 1x SP heavy conversion beamer • 2x Twin bolt cannon

Hekaton Land Fortress (225 Points) • 1x Armoured wheels • 1x MATR autocannon • 1x Pan Spectral Scanner • 1x SP heavy conversion beamer • 2x Twin bolt cannon

Hernkyn Pioneers (90 Points) • 3x Hernkyn Pioneer ◦ 3x Bolt revolver ◦ 3x Bolt shotgun ◦ 1x HYLas rotary cannon ◦ 3x Magna-coil autocannon ◦ 1x Pan Spectral Scanner ◦ 3x Plasma knife ◦ 1x Rollbar Searchlight

Hernkyn Pioneers (180 Points) • 6x Hernkyn Pioneer ◦ 6x Bolt revolver ◦ 6x Bolt shotgun ◦ 1x Comms Array ◦ 2x HYLas rotary cannon ◦ 6x Magna-coil autocannon ◦ 1x Pan Spectral Scanner ◦ 6x Plasma knife ◦ 1x Rollbar Searchlight

Hernkyn Pioneers (90 Points) • 3x Hernkyn Pioneer ◦ 3x Bolt revolver ◦ 3x Bolt shotgun ◦ 1x HYLas rotary cannon ◦ 3x Magna-coil autocannon ◦ 1x Pan Spectral Scanner ◦ 3x Plasma knife ◦ 1x Rollbar Searchlight

Hernkyn Yaegirs (90 Points) • 1x Yaegir Theyn ◦ 1x Bolt revolver ◦ 1x Close combat weapon ◦ 1x Plasma knife • 9x Hernkyn Yaegir ◦ 1x APM launcher ◦ 8x Bolt revolver ◦ 9x Close combat weapon ◦ 8x Plasma knife

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The not so humble Gretchin serves largely as homefield objective holders, disposable meat shields or action monkeys. They're weak, cheap and funny. But what if we make them scary/ridiculous/both?

Consider the following. You pay the 80pts for a max size unit of Grots. That nets you 20 Gretchin and 2 Runtherds. You pay the additional 80pts for Zodgrod Wartsnagga and stick him with them. You pay a further 160pts for a Battlewagon to bring the lot of them - save the one grot who had to give up his seat so Zodgrod could bring his enormous, stupid hairdo onboard. You now have 19 Gretchin, 2 Runtherds and Zodgrod Wartsnagga inside of a Battlewagon, for the princely sum of 320pts.

Depending on the distance to a NML-objective, you could be able to tag two whole objectives with this unit before the first battle round using their 9" scout move, giving you the possibility of rolling 2 dice for the 4+ CP gain on round 1 with just these boys. This may or may not disrupt the coming game plan, depending on terrain and deployment.

Then consider the following game plan. You start the lot outside of the Battlewagon, on the homefield objective. This lets you roll for the 4+ CP gain at the start of the movement phase before you pop them inside the Battlewagon and move up 10" + Advance. This is the setup for a go-turn which I think might have the potential to be so incredibly disruptive to the opponent's game plan, that the rest of your army would largely have free rein to do whatever they want!

You pop the Waagh! at the start of the next battle round. After the most recent update, Zodgrod's ability specifically allows for his +6" Movement buff to happen after his unit disembarks from a transport. So you can disembark the Gretchin Gigablob from the Battlewagon, Adv+Charge and - considering the frankly ridiculous footprint of such a unit - you might be able to tag upwards of 3-4 enemy units with a single charge move (depending on the opponent, obviously).

If you're playing War Horde, your Gretchin can get 'Ere we go! for an additional +4" of threat range during the Waagh!, making them a ridiculous little horde of idiots with a 3"+12"+D6+2"+2D6+2" missile if they disembark from the wagon on the Waagh!. The average threat range should come out to the tune of 30", with a technical 40" + D6" threat range if we're gonna be pedantic and include the movement of the Battlewagon on the previous turn. Spike a single one of the Advance/Charge dice, and you're much closer to a minimum of 40" threat range. To add insult to not very serious injury, you could also give them Unbridled Carnage for a 5+ Crit. The frankly staggering amount of Sustains + Lethals (because of course Makari is within 12" of them, are you kidding?) these guys could put out might be worth to try just for the fun of it. Plotting the numbers into UnitCrunch puts the Grots at doing an average of 9 wounds to a Drukhari Ravager alone, and that's before taking into account Zodgrod and the Runtherds. A Redemptor Dreadnought takes an average of 6 wounds, and they clear an average of 4 Bullgryn. I don't think that's half bad!

If you're playing Bully Boyz then this tactic could buy you a whole battle round of waiting before you pop your second Waagh!. The effective threat range is likely a lot less, but buying yourself time with the Bully Boyz is all the more effective, I think, as your opponent would be forced to shake around their forces, and maybe even do some Fall Back moves just to get out of the Grotblob. And enemy Fall Back moves are the Bully Boyz' best friend.

For the sake of discussion, this idea gets even more stupid in Dread Mob, as you can do a normal move when your opponent makes a fall back move within 9" of them, when using Conniving Runts. During the Waagh!, these dudes have 12" of movement, so you have practically free rein to move them where ever you want while also maybe dealing some mortals to them at the same time.

Thinkin's and Opinjunz? This all started as a thought experiment to brainstorm ideas on how to have a less bad time against my friend's Drukhari, and I figured a big ol' brick of +1 to hit and +1 to wound models with high mobility might be my best shot at getting that dumb stupid Incubi-brick out of their Raider sooner rather than later.

Hi everyone,

There was a question on the Discord of my local players group where one asked about the latest Necron meta since the points update. I pointed that person to Meta Monday but was told that since we (in France) play WTC and that almost nobody else does, the stats reported were pretty much useless (for us).

My question therefore is, how much does terrain layout (WTC vs UKTC vs ITC vs GW) really affect Meta lists and winrates? I imagine lighter terrains, in theory, favor shooting armies and heavier terrain favor melee armies. But everything considered, is it to say that the meta from one system will vary much from another system?

Hey guys, i have just recently turned back to playing and got only 1 game so far. Then i made this list and hopefully soon i will be trying it. But first i would like to take your opinion about. My biggest concern is hellblasters, with pariah nexus dense terrain, do you think they do their job or struggle? Should i consider putting a darkshroud to keep them and gladiator lancers safe but what to drop then? With new mortal rules they seem better to stay alive along with Lion's mortal save aura after hazardous tests but do you think this justify their place in army? Thanks.

Space Marines Dark Angels Gladius Task Force Strike Force (2000 Points)

Azrael

Lieutenant

Lion El’Jonson

Intercessors x5

Assault Intercessors with Jump Packs x 5

3x DWK with maces

2x Gladiator Lancer

Hellblasters x 10

Scouts x 5

Hi! I have been playing WH for a while now and I have access to a laser CNC, a filament and a resin printer. I'm wondering if anyone knows a website where you can buy terrain set files for CNC or perchance a good terrain set which I can print and build at home. If anyone has any opinions on where to buy cheap terrain I will gladly listen. IMO I think it's best to have all the terrain foldable or in separate blocks to ease transport but I will hear anyone out. :)

Any Warhammer fans in KY? New KY Warhammer group: https://www.reddit.com/r/KentuckyWarhammer/

I’ve got a small casual 1,000 pt tournament tomorrow and wanted to get y’all’s opinion on a war gear choice I’ve been mulling over for this tournament and generally.

I’m playing GSC (Hosts of Ascension) and I’ve got some, but not much, anti tank capabilities in my infantry units, split between two single shot mining lasers (that get substantial buffs when dropped out of deep strike) and three anti-vehicle melee weapons in a unit of melee infantry.

My best anti-tank option is an Achilles ridge runner which gives me a heavy mining laser (lascannon profile D3+blast hitting on 3+).

Important note is that if a ridge runner scores a hit on a unit, for the rest of the turn my army gets -1AP against that unit.

Currently I’ve got two of those in my list, both with mining lasers.

The other wargear option for the ridge runner is a heavy mortar, which has indirect (S6 0AP, hitting on 4+ if there’s no line of site) and which gives the same AP boost to the rest of my army.

Generally, my strategy for this army is appearing from deep strike and trying to clear units off of the lesser defended objectives, particularly my opponents home objective.

Given this approach but my general lack of good AT (and that nothing T12+ can be brought in anyone’s list) am I better off running two mining laser ridgerunners or one mining laser and one mortar.

I think my primary deep strike units can clear most 3+ save smaller units on sheer volume of fire. obviously the extra AP helps and a mortar lets me get this bonus against otherwise hidden units.

That being said, I can see myself having issues hurting a vehicle heavy list without the extra D3 las shots.

Do you think sacrificing upfront lethality against high toughness/armor targets is worth buffing my ability to cripple my opponent’s rearguard?

Edit:

Based on your comments I’m going to go with one mortar and one heavy mining laser.

I’m also swapping out two of my lone op characters for a Goliath rock grinder which should give me good durability and solid damage against anything up to T10.

Why do most people prefer shield host over talons? To me talons helps mitigate alot of the issues facing custodes like the lack of durability with its enhancements and gives us the 2nd strongest reactive move in the game letting us do it on 2 units for 1 cp. All shield host does it let the units hit harder which I've found not to be an issue in talons barring a few extreme examples.

Noticed there were two different categories in ranking. Just curious what makes the Hobby different?

Been reading a couple of posts on here about competing 10th edition to previous editions, and while there are a few things raised as changes for the worse that I agree with (bring back the psychic phase!), there is one thing take being trotted out that is so egregious that I feel it needs to be properly debunked.

The take? That 10th is ‘more lethal’ than 9th edition.

I wonder if the people saying 10th is more lethal actually played in 9th edition?

I started playing at the end of 9th, after all the properly broken stuff had been fixed. And it was still absolutely off the scale with lethality.

For those of you not there, some examples-

Firstly, toughness was effectively capped at 8, but strength of weapons was the same (or better) - see below, so it was extremely rare to be wounding on worse than 5’s into anything, and most combat infantry (power fists, Tyranid warriors, etc.) would be wounding great unclean ones on 4’s and more likely 3’s with a detachment bonus.

Secondly - mortal wounds given out like candy. Yes, tank shock and grenades are a thing in 10th, but they require unit positioning and, crucially, are once per turn. In 9th the combination of psychic phase plus specific relics (looking at you reaper of obliterax) meant some armies could essentially ignore the damage rules of the game consistently, without sacrificing any power.

Talking of not sacrificing power, let’s talk about the issues 9th had applying universal weapons. A power fist made you stronger but was hard to use. Great - let’s make it x2 strength and -1 to hit. Except these are implemented as modifiers, so guess what, decent combat detachments can boost strength before doubling, and stack hit bonuses and re-rolls (from auras so leaders could buff multiple units at once) to avoid the downside. And the fact that these weapons already have -1 to hit baked in means that anyone relying on -1 to hit as a defence suddenly finds their power irreverent.

Until you have seen 5 wolfen destroying a Tervigon (with maximal defensive buffs on it) like tissue paper it is impossible to understand how lethal infantry combat was in 9th

Oh, and AP was off the charts (with no AoC) but presumably we all know that as everyone moans that AP is too low in 10th, so it must be ‘low’ in comparison to 9th, which is therefore ‘high’.

….

So what did GW do to try and counter this? When they ran out of ways to make defence actually work within the rules they introduced 2 horrendous rules that broke the game as the only way to actually keep units alive in the face of the onslaught:

• transhuman (wound rolls of 1-3 always fail)
• Phase capped wounds (a model can only take 1/3 on 1/2 of its wounds in a single phase (combat/shooting/pyschic)

These rules were super non-interactive, but without them the biggest and baddest units (Ghaz, Abbadon, Ctan) would get totally wrecked. But trying to introduce these immovable objects made people search for even more lethality. So if you did not have access to the rules you were even more in trouble than before.

(And it’s worth considering that in 9th Ctan we’re only able to take 1/3 of their wounds per phase, but most armies could and would consider them something that was very killable in 1 turn. Compare to Ctan in 10th which can die in 1 phase, but do pose many armies a problem. But I guess that is nothing to do with general lethality)

So anyway- the next time you see someone trot out “10th is more lethal than 9th” please direct them this way so they can see the error of their ways.

Thanks for reading!

Now I know on the books of course 3rd party bits are completely banned unless you modeled and created the bits yourself, but I'm curious if anyone actually has any stories of being called out, or seeing someone else called out for using 3rd party bits, and what happened to the player in question? It just seems like an incredibly hard rule to enforce, so I was curious how it worked in practice. like if someone kit bashed their model and sculpted extra bits onto those kitbashed pieces with greenstuff, after the whole things painted how is someone gonna distinguish that from a 3d painted bit? Or like what if someone lobbed off an entire section of an arm, glued some other piece to it, filled the gaps with greenstuff and then painted over it? If someone's dedicated enough to put a ton of work into their model to the point of kit bashing, I feel like the really good ones are going to be nearly indistinguishable from using 3d printed bits after the paint job is done, and with that in mind how on earth does GW enforce the rule?

Hi guys! I’m back! And I finally managed to make a 2k pt list! I’ve been trying to change my list up and see what works best. The previous iteration of my list had 1 squad of Assault Intercessors to be a cheap trading unit for the mid field objectives and a squad of termies with captain for deep strike and free/cheap strats. My current list is more focused on elites and honestly the only reason I’m running Guilliman is because I love his model 😂

So my concept behind the list is I wanted to have the 6 bladeguard vets and chaplain in the impulsor so I can rush them up the board to clear up mid field objectives and kind of open a path for guilliman and the big guns. Deploy the Repulsor Executioner right away for anti-tank and then keep the Eradicators and Redemptor Dread in reserves for a possible turn 2 rapid ingress or walk-on damage. Infiltrators to screen out any deep strike in ny deployment zone with my regular intercessors stickying the objective and then moving out to take other objectives on the board or screen for my other units and then 2 scout squads to do secondaries. My Calgar brick is a huge and spicy meatball so I’m honestly pretty lost as to how to deploy them without them getting possibly shot up on turn 1 if I end up going second 💦

Here’s my current list! Please let me know what you think and feel free to comment any advice or changes that you would make to my list!

Guilliman Ultramarines (1995 Points)

Space Marines Ultramarines Gladius Task Force Strike Force (2000 Points)

CHARACTERS

Apothecary Biologis (110 Points) • 1x Absolvor bolt pistol • 1x Close combat weapon • Enhancements: Fire Discipline

Chaplain (75 Points) • 1x Absolvor bolt pistol • 1x Crozius arcanum • Enhancements: The Honour Vehement

Marneus Calgar (185 Points) • 1x Marneus Calgar ◦ 1x Gauntlets of Ultramar • 2x Victrix Honour Guard ◦ 2x Victrix power sword

Roboute Guilliman (285 Points) • Warlord • 1x Emperor’s Sword • 1x Hand of Dominion

BATTLELINE

Intercessor Squad (80 Points) • 1x Intercessor Sergeant ◦ 1x Astartes grenade launcher ◦ 1x Bolt pistol ◦ 1x Bolt rifle ◦ 1x Power fist • 4x Intercessor ◦ 4x Bolt pistol ◦ 4x Bolt rifle ◦ 4x Close combat weapon

DEDICATED TRANSPORTS

Impulsor (80 Points) • 1x Armoured hull • 1x Bellicatus missile array • 2x Fragstorm grenade launcher • 1x Ironhail heavy stubber

OTHER DATASHEETS

Aggressor Squad (240 Points) • 1x Aggressor Sergeant ◦ 1x Auto boltstorm gauntlets ◦ 1x Fragstorm grenade launcher ◦ 1x Twin power fists • 5x Aggressor ◦ 5x Auto boltstorm gauntlets ◦ 5x Fragstorm grenade launcher ◦ 5x Twin power fists

Bladeguard Veteran Squad (180 Points) • 1x Bladeguard Veteran Sergeant ◦ 1x Master-crafted power weapon ◦ 1x Plasma pistol • 5x Bladeguard Veteran ◦ 5x Heavy bolt pistol ◦ 5x Master-crafted power weapon

Eradicator Squad (100 Points) • 1x Eradicator Sergeant ◦ 1x Bolt pistol ◦ 1x Close combat weapon ◦ 1x Melta rifle • 2x Eradicator ◦ 2x Bolt pistol ◦ 2x Close combat weapon ◦ 1x Melta rifle ◦ 1x Multi-melta

Infiltrator Squad (100 Points) • 1x Infiltrator Sergeant ◦ 1x Bolt pistol ◦ 1x Close combat weapon ◦ 1x Marksman bolt carbine • 4x Infiltrator ◦ 4x Bolt pistol ◦ 4x Close combat weapon ◦ 1x Helix Gauntlet ◦ 1x Infiltrator Comms Array ◦ 4x Marksman bolt carbine

Redemptor Dreadnought (210 Points) • 1x Icarus rocket pod • 1x Macro plasma incinerator • 1x Onslaught gatling cannon • 1x Redemptor fist • 1x Twin fragstorm grenade launcher

Repulsor Executioner (220 Points) • 1x Armoured hull • 1x Heavy onslaught gatling cannon • 1x Macro plasma incinerator • 1x Repulsor Executioner defensive array • 1x Twin Icarus ironhail heavy stubber • 1x Twin heavy bolter

Scout Squad (65 Points) • 1x Scout Sergeant ◦ 1x Astartes chainsword ◦ 1x Bolt pistol ◦ 1x Close combat weapon • 4x Scout ◦ 4x Bolt pistol ◦ 2x Boltgun ◦ 4x Close combat weapon ◦ 1x Missile launcher ◦ 1x Scout sniper rifle

Scout Squad (65 Points) • 1x Scout Sergeant ◦ 1x Astartes chainsword ◦ 1x Bolt pistol ◦ 1x Close combat weapon • 4x Scout ◦ 4x Bolt pistol ◦ 2x Boltgun ◦ 4x Close combat weapon ◦ 1x Missile launcher ◦ 1x Scout sniper rifle

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I‘ve found a very good offer on ebay (2 chaos knights and 8 wardogs) for round about 300 EUR.

4 of those wardogs are the imperial equivalent.

Is it common to use those as a proxy for chaos wardogs? Am i able to use them?

Thanks

Im about to play in my first ever team tournament this weekend, playing custodes (my list below). Id like to get some tips and tricks from experienced team event or custodes players about how to adjust my playstyle coming from the singles environment. Additionally, I havent played into about half the armies in the game with custodes as ive only been playing them for about 4 months, as such, im having a bit of trouble predicting my game outcomes. Any advice there would also be appreciated.

My List: Shield Host, Trajan, 2x BC, Draxus, Callidus, 4 guard, 15 wardens (5 with axes), 2x3 venetari, 2x4 witchseekers, 1 sisters rhino

My Team: Vanguard Tyranids, Wraith Eldar, Custodes, Tsons, Dark Angels Gladius, Classic Deathguard, Awakened Necrons, World Eater Terminator spam

Here are my matchup predictions right now:
Win: Orks, Space Wolves, Votann, World Eaters, Imperial Knights, TAU (retaliation), Gladius Marines, Grey Knights (DK spam), CSM classic
Close Game: Dark Angels, Deathguard, Chaos Knights, Awakened Necrons, GSC (broodsurge), TAU (kauyon/montka), Tyranids, CSM horde
Lose: Tsons, Eldar, Sisters, Guard, Hypercrypt Necrons, GSC (not broodsurge), CSM gunline/demon engines, Blood Angels, GK (Termi spam)
No Idea: Imp Agents, AdMech

Hello Warhammer Competitive community. I’m really trying to push into the tournament scene of 40k and found some minor success in less than a few local RTTs. It may be a jump, but I registered for an GT and I’m now trying to strategize how I should play against every faction that I will likely play against. The thing I’m scratching my head over is that I find myself unfamiliar with a lot of factions play styles due to lack of games against them. If anyone could give me a rundown of each Faction’s weaknesses and threats, or how I should strategize my models against theirs I’d greatly appreciate it.

For reference I’ll be bringing Sisters to this GT

In terms of prize pool, format, rules, etc.

I figured I should be the change I want to see the in world and help host one

I played a 2k game recently against dark angels with iron storm with my GS Cult HOA detachment and I feel kinda annoyed by it slightly. (PS this is on TTS)

His list was a bunch of tanks and 2 squads of infiltrators with librarians.

Game started and I went first and he picked the map and I couldn’t really move anywhere without getting absolutely blasted with his actual 9 tanks on board. So I sat still and the one unit i moved up he killed it immediately. He went and didn’t move at all, my turn and I deepstriked my demo charge acolytes 3” away & one shotted his executioner and he didn’t like how i “gotcha” him because i didn’t explain the rule to him (which is fair). then he proceeded to say it was a “dick move” how I didn’t move at all on my turn and I argued back saying how could I move if i’m just gonna get shot off the board. and he said you would get kicked out of any WTC if you did that on the first turn which I get but i firmly believe that the terrain he provided wasn’t sufficient enough. So he wanted another game where I didn’t “gotcha” him while also being 25 points ahead.

This is what got me though he deepstriked some stormspeeder vehicles and I thought you had to deepstrike more than 9” and he was arguing that he can get the melta ability since it’s in 9 inches. But I told him thats impossible because you have to deepstrike ‘more than 9’ and he kept going on about its 9 or more and GW is always literal about their rules so I called his bullshit, maybe I am in the wrong.

TLDR: guy says dick move on my part for not moving on my first turn but imo there wasn’t enough terrain for me to move in cover. and deepstriking 9” can grant you the melta ability for being at half range doesnt seem right to me.

Once you actually start playing a game of 40k 10th edition, it's loads of fun.

There's definitely a learning curve to figure out how to build an army that can handle the vehicle skew nature of 10th, but once you get past that and understand the basics of how every army plays, the actual games themselves are a tense, tactical and very rewarding experience.

Just consider the movement phase and how incredibly impactful it is. What units you expose to shoot and be shot, what units try to take objectives, how you stage to project threat or accomplish objectives the following turns, all of that really determines who wins or loses the game, and that's fun.

Every game I play I feel like there was a play I could have done differently and improved my chances of winning* and that's what keeps bringing me back out to tournaments.

(* Except that one game where I handed a custodes 24 Ap3 D2 saves and he made 18 of them. 4++s as a standard save is duuuuuumb)

TL;DR: is the best csm detachment Renegade Raiders or Pactbound Zealots?

Hey all,

I've been doing some prep work for a local tournament in a couple of weeks, and I've been trying to make a strong list. I'm torn, however, between Renegade Raiders or Pactbound Zealots.

On the one hand RR is a very fast and aggressive with, imo, one of the best detachment rules in the codex but the stratagems i find lacking (Chaos armor of contempt the exemption) with it ranging from a very good stratagem with very specific requirements to almost useless. In practice, RR is a very pressure heavy detachment, making your opponent less likely to get on an objective and heavily punishing them for playing primary

PBZ, on the other hand, is another very flexible detachment as it should be the index detachment. The stratagems are pretty good all around, but the only marks that are worthwhile are Slaanesh and Nurgle, and the Enhancements are all based on Chaos marks, leaving out Undivided entirely. But playing PBZ is good although it suffers from not having a armor of contempt effect hurts it defensively but crits on 5+ makes up on the offensive side and has some good flexibility that really makes me think when building a list.

Other detachments have their problems

Dread Talons: Battle shock is hard to make work, especially against space marines and other high leadership armies. Unlike knights, who don't have to use a stratagem to get the battle shock bonus to attacks.

Fellhammer: Good on paper, bad in practice needs you to target already weakened units or take hits for the stratagems to work, and the army rule is meaningless against melee armies

Veterans of the Long War: We have space marines at home. Full hit rerolls are really good with dark pacts, but not good enough.

Deceptors: filled with a lot of tricks, but nothing too standout infiltrate is nice, but doesn't bring enough to the table to make it worth more than other detachments

Chaos cult: No comment haven't played

Soulforged Warpack: No comment haven't played