It has been suggested that every week or two I should post a harm reduction story about a different drug; to convey safety information, invoke discussion and field any questions that anyone may have. This post covers mad honey (ref rhododendron).

The following was taken word for word from The Drug Users Bible, where you will find more data and more detail. Remember that you can download a free PDF copy via any of the links in the following post: https://www.reddit.com/r/harmreduction/comments/14ldqyp/download\_the\_drug\_users\_bible\_from\_here/

Stay safe. Don’t make the same mistakes I did.

SUBJECTIVE EXPERIENCE

Some years ago I watched a YouTube documentary titled “Hallucinogen Honey Hunters - Hunting Mad Honey”. This presented an adventure in the mountains of Nepal to retrieve honey produced by giant bees, which contains a substance called grayanotoxin (from rhododendron flowers). This reputedly carries medicinal, aphrodisiacal and hallucinogenic properties.

The documentary was compelling, and it was clear that this stuff packed a punch, not least because the translator (Deepak) ate too much, had convulsions, vomited, and lost consciousness. He had to be carried back down, and looked in a really bad way. Fortunately he survived, but the warning this presented was clear enough.

Unfortunately, I was unaware of mad honey when I visited Nepal, where I sampled only the exquisite hash sold in Kathmandu. I therefore had to track some down and import to the UK a few years later.

This was quite expensive, and largely a shot in the dark regarding its authenticity, but certainly, the small 115 gram jar looked promising, referring to both the giant bees and rhododendron on its label.

Mad Honey - Label

Having acquired the honey, the tricky question of dose now arises. The vendor, who does seem to be genuine, and claims to have collected it himself from the same region the documentary was filmed in, suggests “one to two spoon”. This probably means teaspoon, as thedrugclassroom.com states that:

“For traditional medical reasons, around 1 teaspoon is a fairly common dose. More than 1 tablespoon is associated with more overt symptoms, including recreational ones. Yet even 1 tablespoon has the potential to be dangerous.”

This website also contains a significant number of alarming medical case studies, and also explains that the recreational effect is generally intoxication rather than hallucination.

For obvious reasons I elect to tread carefully, going for two teaspoons on my first experiment (1.20pm). The honey is dark and runny as I stir it, but it tastes rather nice. Note that I've seen reports citing onset time from half an hour to four hours, so I will not allow impatience to seduce me into double dosing.

An hour in I feel a little heady; perhaps slightly dazed. This could be a bit of a sugar rush or simply light headedness due to my empty stomach, or it could be a minor inebriation. It is impossible to call at this stage, but there has certainly been a change in my disposition.

After two hours, although I remain more or less in the same place, I am now convinced that this is psychoactive. I am in half a pint to a pint of beer territory, which is a fair analogy; given that the intoxication has an alcohol type of feel to it. I experience a sort of head sedation but without a euphoric warmth, and with a relative clarity of vision when I choose to focus. Broadly speaking I drift into states of not being quite with it, accompanied by a faintly strange headspace.

Mad Honey

I note that my blood pressure and heart rate are both slightly lower than usual. I also sense some discomfort and potential for palpitations, which is why I performed the tests. This thought tempers the entire ride.

Over the next few hours I gradually return to what passes for normal, although there does remain a sort of background presence. In the evening I experience a mild headache, which could be unconnected, but may not be, particularly given that the subsequent night’s sleep was somewhat disturbed and I felt a general malaise and something of a body ache.

I should stress that all these symptoms were indeed mild, but if linked, do suggest that higher doses could quickly lead to something more serious. Of concern is also that the concentration of grayanotoxins is known to vary from batch to batch, meaning that I could well have a particularly strong sample.

I had planned to repeat the exercise with a higher dose some weeks later, but given this scenario, and that the intoxication wasn’t particularly wonderful in nature, I have decided to skip this. The idea that I have essentially poisoned myself has occurred and it is hard to shake off. I could be misrepresenting it somewhat, but it did have the feel of a deliriant, the edge of illness and a touch of weirdness about it.

Finally, I will end with another quote from thedrugclassroom.com:

"Most of the concerning effects involve the cardiovascular system. It very often results in significantly low heart rate (bradycardia) and low blood pressure (hypotension.) With the conduction disorders arising from the toxins, it can lead to 1st to 3rd-degree heart block, asystole, and myocardial infarction."

On reflection, this may be a psychoactive which you wish to skip.

I’m making elderberry syrup with a range of other herbs in the mix and I’m curious if I should be adding more distilled water to the batch when processing to compensate for the added herbs?

I’ve also seen a wide range of recommendations for amount of water to dried elderberries. What do you use?

I've done my fair share of beers, meads, and ciders etc. I'm moving into Gruit territory now and I was just seeing if anyone had any pointers as it is primarily herbs.

In case anyone is unfamiliar with the term, Gruit is kind of a catch all term used to describe fermented ales/lagers that use herbs (or even trees) instead of Hops as their primary bittering agent. Prior to the protestant reformation, this was pretty much the norm for a good long time. However, the church and local historic bodies enacted what was essentially the first war on drugs and volleyed for Hops to be used as the primary bittering agent due to their "preservative qualities". (They just so happened to be a natural sedative and an-aphrodisiac as well, not to mention the most common herbs used prior had just as many preservative properties also... they just weren't as "virtuous"). But that's a whole other rabbit hole.

In short, Gruits use mainly Yarrow, Myrica Gale, and Wild Rosemary as the most common ingredients, but vary greatly depending on the taste and medicinal qualities desired. The more typical ingredients usually had some type of narcotic or psychotropic effect alongside their usual medicinal qualities when brewed and drank in an ale.

For instance, the Pictish people made a beer primarily with heather tips, among other suspected herbs, that was known for not only its anti inflammatory aspects but it was said to be highly inebriating when fermented. There is also a moss (or perhaps fungi) that grows on the heather flower called Fogg moss that is said to be a mild hallucinogenic as well. There's a fun (Perhaps the wrong word here) legend about a father who would sooner kill himself and his son than give up the recipe to invading romans.

Anyway, this has been my ted talk on gruits. Any pointers before I dive in?

Here is a good starting point I found and have been slowly editing in terms of how much/when to boil each herb and any warnings/side effects it might have as well as tasting notes. Feel free to add anything you can think of as I haven't gotten to try a good bit, and save for your own use!!

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1HFUdyyFnkCiZG4dXgLU26OnlfHnGa-KJ/edit?usp=sharing&ouid=104688026660726677483&rtpof=true&sd=true

Title, can someone help me get more info on this and it’s uses?

So i purchased P. incarnata after reading it only has harmine harmaline and i think 1 or 2 other active alkaloids in it, thinking there were be atleast one in depth extraction since theres tons for syrian rue.

but alas, the SINGULAR extraction of it posted to the dmt nexus, has been edited by the author who says it doesn't work. so to avoid wasting my money i decided to throw all 50g into a blender, turn it to powder, then i soaked it in water with about 4 capfuls of vinegar and maybe a ml or 2 of 85% ethanol for about 30 mins, then i boiled it for an hour, adding water as needed. (harmine and harmaline dont vaporize till your around like 250 celsius, and water boils at 100).

then i filtered it with a funnel and 2 coffee filters and the liquid was almost black, i thought i got alot of chlorophyll (oh how i was wrong) i poured some into a smaller container and it was DARK orange, like syrian rue but way more clear. Added some basic solution just to see if anything would happen, i mean after all if theres no MAOI's then there shouldnt really be any alkaloids to base right? well precipitate began forming and i've now scraped the bright yellow residue onto a razor, once it dries more i shall try smoking it and i will re update this post, though the filters i used got stained bright yellow, and my fingers glow bright blue under blacklight now

​

*edit* ITS ACTIVE i just smoked a very small piece (eyeballed 30-50mg estimate) on top of weed and tobacco in a bong and it had mild activity while making the smoke smoother and giving a light visual effect (just a potentiation of my HPPD static, and more saturation) there needs to be more extraction teks done with this plant

Please note that botanicals (80 in total) are covered in the second half of the book (Section 3).

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THE DRUG USERS BIBLE: DOWNLOAD IT FREE OF CHARGE HERE

This was always the plan. My book, all 636 pages of The Drug Users Bible, is now FREE to download as a PDF. To get your copy… please read this: ===>

1. WHAT IS IT?

In a nutshell, it’s a harm reduction reference tome. From Amazon:

“Over a 12 year period the author of this book self-administered over 180 psychoactive substances; both chemicals and plants. For each he recorded the life-sensitive safety data, including the anticipated onset times, the common threshold doses, the routes of administration, and the expected duration of the experience. In addition, for every compound he also produced a trip report, detailing the qualitative experience itself. This delivered another invaluable insight, enabling, for example, an objective assessment of the extent of any loss of judgement and self-control.”

2. WHY IS IT NOW FREE?

It was written to make a difference: to get critical harm reduction and safety data into the hands of as many people as possible, whatever their drug of choice.

The starting point was that I’m old and I like to read my books on paper. Hence, I wrote it for paper and always visualised it as the real physical book it became. That’s how it has always been sold, and still is. I know it has already helped a significant number.

HOWEVER, on paper it does cost $$$. I can’t change that, but what I can do, finally, is provide it for free as a PDF. So if you are happy with a non-paper version, and not too frustrated with this sort of navigation, you can now download it without charge.

You can have it on your phone, your PC, your laptop, or anywhere else you want it.

3. HOW YOU CAN HELP OTHERS

It really is vital that we make harm reduction information ubiquitous within our community. It really is ignorance that kills so many of us. We really really must do our best as a community to make safety practices second nature, and get the essential data to everyone who needs it.

You can help with this project. Please do help.

If you are able, please download it and re-upload it to wherever is appropriate: to anywhere from which anyone who uses drugs may see it, and be able to download it themselves for free. Or alternatively just share the download link.

Ignorance kills, but I hope that some of you will help to save some of those lives. The portability of a PDF may help to at least put the idea of harm reduction on the agenda where it was previously overlooked.

4. WHERE CAN I GET IT?

The various links are as follows:

• Download from my Google Drive: https://bit.ly/3L2gCDH [Low Resolution 12MB]
• Download from my Google Drive: http://bit.ly/3LfpDvb [Standard Resolution 60MB]
• Download from Microsoft One Drive: https://bit.ly/40DlchA
• Download from Apple iCloud: https://bit.ly/44aGKoW
• The physical book (+info) is on Amazon here: https://www.amazon.com/dp/0995593698/

A complete and growing list of download locations will be maintained on the following page: https://www.drugusersbible.com/2018/01/pdf.html

As it is a drug book it could be banned by any of the clearnet hosts at any time, so it is probably a good idea to download it sooner rather than later.

5. FINALLY

Thank you for all your help and support with this project over the years. It would not have been possible without you.

Together, let’s try to make a difference. If you have any questions, at all, please don’t hesitate to ask.

When the temperature goes up 2 degrees, this persons body acts like its gone up 10 degrees, sweating so much sometimes they cant stop for an hour. Sometimes at night too.

Other symptoms: excessive pulse at solar plexus and jugular area during these hot episodes, occasional regurgitation reflex after meals, eye floaters, joint hypermobility esp in ankle and hips, soreness in liver area, sports injury in upper left chest / shoulder joint - (restricted) deep belly breathing stretches it and makes this area uncomfortable

Any help would be welcome