/r/OpenChristian

Photograph via snooOG

This is a community for progressive Christians and friends to discuss our faith, support each other, and share inspiration for our spiritual journeys. We seek God's message of Peace, Love, and Grace through following the Spirit of Christ.

About

This is a community for progressive Christians and friends to discuss our faith, support each other, and share inspiration for our spiritual journeys. We seek God's message of Peace, Love, and Grace through following the Spirit of Christ.

Notice

We welcome those of any ethnicity, nationality, gender expression and identity, or sexual orientation. OpenChristian is pro-feminist, pro-queer, anti-racist and anti-oppression. This space is Open and Affirming, but we welcome Christians who have chosen celibacy. If you are a ‘Side B’ Christian, please respect Rule 1, but know that you belong here and we want you to participate.

If you have questions about progressive Christianity or Christian affirmation of LGBTQ+ people please see our FAQ.

Please note that as a progressive Christian sub, we are explicitly followers of Christ, as well as LGBTQ+ affirming, anti-racist, feminist, and egalitarian. Friends are very welcome to participate, no matter what you believe. But this is not the place for questioning or debating these positions (it’s not wrong to ask questions but there are many other subs that are overflowing with such posts already).

Do not post or comment about how you believe homosexuality is a sin. We have heard this a thousand times, and you have nothing new to contribute to the conversation. If you do this, you will be banned.

Rules

If you see a post or comment that violates one of the rules below, please help us out by reporting it!

1. No bigotry or oppressive rhetoric. All misogyny, racism, antisemitism, LGBTQ+phobia, etc. will result in removal and a permanent ban. This includes commenting that LGBTQ+ love or relationships are sinful. Be aware that using “Pharisee” as a negative slur is considered anti-Semitic.

1b. Side B folks are welcome, but follow Rule 1. This space is Open and Affirming, but we welcome Christians who have chosen celibacy. If you are a Side B Christian, please respect Rule 1 above, but know that you belong here and we want you to participate.

2. Do not promote oppressive/harmful ideology. This includes all attempts to promote or normalise hate, shame, or fear within Christianity (e.g. purity culture, scaremongering against gender-transitioning, “complementarianism”, or “demonic” attacks).

3. No sectarianism. Legitimate criticism of other Christians/faiths is allowed but refrain from prejudice against entire denominations/groups, and against other religions (e.g. Islamophobia).

4. No disparaging Christianity. This is primarily a supportive space for anyone who identifies as Christian. While everyone is welcome to participate we ask that no one disparages Christianity.

5. Be respectful and polite. No personal attacks or accusations, harassment, misrepresentation of others, or insults. This also includes forcing debate, gatekeeping, and denying the validity of another’s faith.

6. Don’t be a troll or a jerk. Don't concern troll, play devil's advocate, or pretend to be confused when you really just want to start a debate. This Rule will be interpreted at the moderators’ discretion.

7. No spamming or proselytizing. Don't post here if you're mass posting to other subreddits. Don't post here for self-promotion unless it's particularly relevant to this subreddit. This is not your soapbox, and we are not here for you to preach at us. If you want to promote your media please ask permission from the mods.

8. Be sensitive about linking to triggering content. Because we want this space to be as safe as possible, we discourage posting images or links to oppressive rhetoric from others. However, we do understand that venting is important sometimes. If you must post something potentially triggering, mark it nsfw or use spoiler tags, and censor any identifying information.

9. Discussion of the ongoing Israeli-Palestinian conflict is temporarily prohibited. This topic has proven to be too divisive to discuss without consistently violating this subreddit’s rules. In order to maintain peace and to continue supporting one another, content regarding the ongoing Israel-Palestinian conflict is not permitted at this time.

Related Subreddits

General Subreddits (warning - may contain nuts)

For other subreddits about Christianity and religion, please see the Index maintained on the wiki.

To chat with other OpenChristians, join one of the following discord communities (note we have no control over their content or direct affiliation):

/r/OpenChristian

53,405 Subscribers

6

"Speaking the truth in love"...

How do you respond when a homophobic Christian claims that they are not homophobic because they feel morally obligated to "speak the truth in love"? The type of Christian who says, "I don't hate gay people. I love them enough to warn them about their sin and the danger of going to Hell..."?

I know you can tell them that the clobber passages have been misinterpreted and need to be read within their cultural context, etc. But how do you show them that they are actually acting upon homophobic prejudice, and not simply "being faithful to God's word" and "following their conscience" in warning other people about what they sincerely believe will ultimately damn them to Hell?

I am convinced that even if they genuinely believe that the Bible condemns homosexuality, their hermeneutic is still influenced by culturally ingrained prejudice, and they are therefore being disingenuous in claiming not to be homophobic. And just so you know, I'm actually straight.

2 Comments
2024/12/03
19:15 UTC

10

The bible says that when Jesus rose from the dead and appeared to his disciples, they didn't recognize him. It says that several times. How do you explain this to non-believers, when they say "it clearly wasn't Jesus that rose from the dead, if people didn't even recognize him".

23 Comments
2024/12/03
17:54 UTC

2

Aside of praying, any tips on how to find my purpose in life, what God is calling me to do?

2 Comments
2024/12/03
17:32 UTC

1

In prayer. Have you ever heard jesus voice. Or felt his touch . Or even seem him

1 Comment
2024/12/03
17:06 UTC

1

My heart's aflame my body's strained but God I like it! My mind has changed my body's frame, but, God, I like it

Burned down their hanging trees

It's hot, hot, hot, hot here

Got a curse we cannot lift

Thinking about the song Wolf Like Me by TV on the Radio.

Commit yourself to the renewing of you mind.
It is a transformation.

I think about the Body. I was taught growing up that the body is super important to Christianity. I heard that the body was a good thing like food was a good thing like love was a good thing. It is where we experience God's world. Bodies are good things. That's why the resurrection matters. Now that I've grown up I hear all sorts of things regarding the body and Christianity but I always am biased to this way of thinking because it is the one I heard first.

I love the idea of howling forever about Jesus. But not just howling forever, but being about it. Living about it. There is a place for singing songs of praise and getting really stoked. There is also a place for being transformed.

"Feel me, completer
Down to my core
Open my heart and let it
Bleed onto yours"

It's a beautiful thing. I guess recently realizing that the song Wolf Like Me is not necessarily about being transformed by the renewing of the mind but it's actually about being a werewolf.

I think there is still something great about that. Animals are really cool. We live with animals together on planet earth. This is our home. The earth is good. That's what I heard growing up.

Jesus walked on the earth. He wasn't a ghost. He really died. But his death I don't get it because it is different than everyone else because everyone else seems dead but Jesus was dead for like a day which is different. SO I don't get that.

But I think that I relate to this song a lot not just because I'm a furry, but also because I am a Christian. This is a great song. it seems fairly unambiguously about my faith journey.

Tell your gra'ma and your mama too
It's true, true, true, true
We're howling forever, oh, oh
We're howling forever, oh, oh

0 Comments
2024/12/03
17:06 UTC

7

How exactly does one give their life to jesus

9 Comments
2024/12/03
16:35 UTC

10

Healing from church hurt

If you read this or write some advice I’d really appreciate it.
I went to a (sort of?) conservative church back home (I am currently in the US, but home is in another country for me). There was someone there who is an elder at my home church (60-ish M), American person. This person has probably been an elder for years, as he has been living there for 30+ years. I’m gonna list all the things he did here, because I want honest feedback on this. Ever since around the time I turned 18 (currently 20F) he acted weird and it was a red flag, but of course I ignored them. It started with him sending my own social media post to me (pictures of me were in the post) and saying “Beautiful.” I don’t why he had to text me just to tell me that. Then a relative of mine told me that there were some instances where he would say suggestive/ gross things to women in the church, or give unwanted “hugs”. He would even do it to underage girls sometimes. But anyways, he started “hugging” me sometimes which made me uncomfortable. It was like a very tight hug where the whole body touches, or a side hug where his whole arm touched you-know-where. He also would like, leer (?) at me and smile and stuff. And he would wait until my husband (bf at the time) wasn’t around to approach me. After I came home from my honeymoon, he came up to me from behind and whispered in my ear, “how was your honeymoon??”. Don’t honeymoons have a reputation for lots of sex or am I wrong? Maybe I read into it. But it was gross. I would even sit in my father in law’s office (he works there) to avoid this dude and he’d still come in and make conversation with me, right in front of him. He would always tell me he was so happy to see me every week, and then follow it up with “the friendship my wife and I have with you and your husband’s families means so much to me”. Almost like a reminder. And then one time he came up to me and insisted on taking a picture of my face even though I said no multiple times. He took the picture anyways and laughed in my face when I asked him to delete it. I know that he has said weird things before about pictures of women, so it made me think about what was being done with those photos which made me feel very out of control and scared. Overall, the whole thing never escalated beyond that, so I think many people outside of it don’t understand why I got so freaked out or scared. I felt so weak. My husband told him off for it the same day it happened, which was a relief (he agreed to delete the picture). He also texted that he was “sorry”, again mentioning how much he “valued” his friendship with both our families (both of our parents are only friends with him in passing, nothing more). Since then, up until I moved, he tried to say hi to me every week, and I ignored him every time until he finally stopped. Anyways… I am moving back in a year, but because this man is at MY home church in MY home, I feel like I can’t return there. I am feeling frustrated because I can’t expect him to be stripped of his position as an elder. But I know for a fact he will harass other people because he knows he can get away with it. My father in law is a very good person; he sympathized with me when I told him about it. But he doesn’t have control over this thing and I have just avoided the topic with him because I don’t want him to think I resent him.

What do I do when I go back? How do I move past this without feeling weak or helpless? Do I have to forgive him? I know he’s not sorry. Am I wrong for feeling disgusted with this person? I know that I am a sinner too, and Jesus calls us to forgive. But forgiving feels like being okay with this. Why isn’t there any accountability? I feel like no one other than my husband really cares that he is the way he is. My brother and sister in law were supportive of me, too, but none of these people have the ability to make it go away. How do I act towards this person when I return?

TLDR, someone at my church sexually harassed me multiple times over months and I don’t know how to move past it.

0 Comments
2024/12/03
15:05 UTC

3

Need some prayer, please.

After attempting reconciliation with my fiancé and partner/bestfriend of 6 years, we have determined it to not be. While I would absolutely love for things to have worked out and the relationship to have prevailed, it seems that is not what God has in mind.

However, I am struggling mentally, emotionally, and physically. It has become a very difficult for me to see the path forward. I am breaking down every day, the tears sting and are painful and my heart is broken. I am feeling abandoned, lost, and devastated by things outside of my control. I have to leave behind my home, pets, safety, and peace.

May I please request prayers for peace, joy, patience, and love?

5 Comments
2024/12/03
12:32 UTC

1

Feeling trapped in a body with natural sexual desires

I've been unsuccessful in asking women out due to a relative shortage of available women at my church and because many women don't click with me.

I wonder why God gave me sexual desires. I suppose it's because He didn't want me missing out on having such normal human desires, whether or not He'll let me be successful in finding a girlfriend.

For context, I'm by definition a high functioning autistic individual. This means that I'm slightly socially different to average people. People think I'm sociable but women just don't seem interested in me.

I've tried many things but they're not working.

I suppose possibly women are waiting for me to approach them, not the other way around. There are a couple of women I know from church whom I like but they don't seem to click with me. They get along fine with me but we don't have chemistry. 😕

I'm very sad. I'm 27 and many people my age have either a girlfriend or a spouse.

On the other hand, I'm wondering if it's worth getting married. Many who are married wish they were single and people claim that marriage is stressful and hard. This is why many people divorce.

I don't know what to do. All I can do is try to ask women out and if I'm unsuccessful, at least I can tell God on the day of judgement that I tried.

I can safely say after I die that I tried to ask women out even though I was unsuccessful. I've ticked off the bucket list and the situations are out of my control.

7 Comments
2024/12/03
11:08 UTC

5

Baptism Tomorrow

I grew up in church, in a Muslim-majority country, where I'm an expat and 99% percent of my classmates in school and college were Muslims. I was young and my closest friends were Muslims too. My first and second boyfriends were Muslims too.

I was away from the Christian lifestyle for many many years, and although my Muslim friends and partners were very convincing, I continued to save myself for marriage and had a good foundation in core Christian belief, so I never got swayed. In my mind things were simple - I chose love, peace, kindness and understanding.

I went to church again for the first time in Nov 2023 after 20 something years - the church here is in a far away isolated location and the reason for going to church was there was a special man of God who was here for a short while and my mom had come into the country just to attend - I didn't want her to take an Uber all the way. So I went with her - complete rebel, nicotine pouch in my mouth and a half-way atheist. (I did take the pouch out while entering the room - I felt guilty). The 3-4 day event ended and I went back to my ways.

Then 2024 happened. I started getting closer to God - praying (sometimes). I stopped drinking and smoking around May - I didn't stop cold turkey, I just didn't feel like doing it anymore. I lost my friends one by one in 2024, all of them. My Muslim partner Z, of 14 years (we were in the same country for the first 12 years) started having feelings for someone overseas in October. We broke up. We were both virgins at 35 and he slept with that girl three times. I went through the worst pain of my life.

I started going to church more. Z got in touch again that he was lost and wanted to continue our relationship, the years invested and he has left the girl. He was going through pain too. I helped him heal and we still talk. But I can't get past the fact that he chose someone else after all these years. I can't entirely let him go either as he had a great job here and I had pushed him to travel, I was going to join him in a few months. If I completely stop talking to him, he might just leave the dream and go sit in his country, completely lost and in depression. I would feel responsible and everyone we know would blame me. I can't let that happen.

I must also say I'm a hopeless introvert with extreme social anxiety. i perhaps held on to my relationship with Z all these years because I was lonely and he was a straight arrow, as clean as they come. I worry I might not feel like/can get into a relationship again. All this time invested with 1 person - we share so much history! How do I do that with someone else?

Last week in church they talked about Baptism and I signed up for it. I felt led to do it. Tomorrow is baptism day.

I'm still addicted to nicotine pouches, which I use when I have extreme anxiety. I suddenly feel doubts - am I ready for baptism? Why can't I let Z go, I still got feelings even though we don't see eye-to-eye on certain things. What if I feel like using the pouches again after Baptism tomorrow?

0 Comments
2024/12/03
11:07 UTC

0

Did christianity did nothing to solve violence problem in mediveal age?

I feel like christianity did nothing to solve the violence problem in mediveal age.I feel like there were not so much good christian in past mediveal age.They did not find any peace in those age.Is it actually true?

19 Comments
2024/12/03
10:56 UTC

10

Losing faith in God and my will to live (23M)

TW: Suicide

This is basically a rant about how I’ve lost faith in God because of how much sadness and evil is in the world. I don’t mean to offend anyone. I just needed to get this off of my chest.

I’ve been struggling with anxiety and depression for years at this point, and these last two years have made me feel even worse, to the point that I’ve grown increasingly suicidal and have grown angry towards God.

Last year, my Grammy died from cancer at only 73 years of age. She was a devout Christian and had faith in God right until the end, but I can’t wrap my mind around why He would put such a caring, faithful woman through so much agony. I watched the strongest woman that I’ve ever known wither away into a voiceless skeleton over two months of in-home hospice care. At one point, she even asked her nurse why she was taking so long to die. How could God do something like that? How could He repeat that process for millions of people around the world?

This year, my mental health grew even worse, especially after the U.S. election. Hatred and bigotry won on Election Day, and America is set to be ruled by intolerant fundamentalists who claim to be faithful servants of Jesus. How could God let this happen? Why does He continue to allow the worst people in the world to carry out atrocities in his name while good people suffer and die? I don’t understand. If God truly loves his creations, then why does he allow them to experience discrimination and abuse carried out in His name? Is it really all about free will? Then how can He have some sort of grand plan?

I’m just so angry and upset all of the time. I hate God for letting his children suffer. I hate him for allowing the existence of evil. I hate him for taking Grammy from me when I needed her the most. I hate that I can’t feel her presence. I hate that I can’t speak to her or ask her for advice. Everything seems so bleak and pointless. If God doesn’t care about me, then what’s the point of going on? Why are the best people in this world the ones who are punished the most? I don’t understand, and I don’t know if I ever will.

5 Comments
2024/12/03
08:08 UTC

7

Using tarot as a means to grow closer to God

TL;DR I'm good at cancelling out negative influences and want to use tarot to let God speak to me perhaps more clearly

Ok so, backstory. I've struggled with religion a lot over the years with my heavy religious friends and family condemning me for all I've done wrong yet never reaching out or trying to help me.

Since I've been with my boyfriend (almost 5 years) I've grown much stronger in my faith, yet have picked up some old bad habits again.

Recently I've just been feeling God's presence in my life in a much more intense way than before. I've always loved learning about other religions though never want to practice it myself

Bring us to tarot, I'm absolutely fascinated by the psychology behind it and to me they are material objects that only the user can give power to. It just has me wondering were I to buy a pack and learn about it on my own time, cancelling out any negative influences (which really, they don't have much religious content depending on which you get), could I not use them to grow closer to God? That in my prayers which I have been doing just about 95% more than weeks ago, could I not ask God to show me what he wants me to see?

I don't know, I have asked God to show me if he does not want me to go through with this for about as long as I've felt his increasing presence and have not received a message on that, yet many other things I received clearly

It might not work, but I can't put the thought away that it might bring me closer to our Saviour which is what I truly need

21 Comments
2024/12/03
06:32 UTC

0

AI Chat Companion for ALL Christians

Hi everyone,

I've been working on an AI chatbot that I think may be helpful for Christians with progressive or non "traditional" Christian beliefs. The benefits of an AI companion during this journey are that it is:

  1. Free and anonymous
  2. Designed to listen compassionately and give constructive feedback
  3. Expansive knowledge of Scripture and theology (while allowing for a broad range of theological viewpoints)

Please take it for a spin and let me know if you have any questions! https://faith-chats.streamlit.app/?index=0

(You can choose from a variety of chat settings at the top)

16 Comments
2024/12/03
03:13 UTC

29

Just be you! The world needs you!

No one else can be you and the world needs you! LGBTQ folk, that means you too! This is hopefully just some affirmation for those that need it. This is not an invitation for hate or debate so if it’s not your cup of tea, no problem! Move on! God bless and hope you have a great day.

https://youtube.com/shorts/rd9aLfMzX4s?si=YFyYaDEODo3cEkAr

4 Comments
2024/12/03
03:05 UTC

5

i (f23) desperately need someone to talk to about this

i've been back and forth to and from god my entire life. fully turned against him when i was 16 and thought i would never turn back. i am gay and had been traumatized by some people in my church. i also began questioning my gender, and for a few years identified as a trans man.

i met a girl (21) exactly a year ago. i was in the darkest place ive ever been in mentally. our relationship started on deeply rooted lies on my part. she forgave me and she brought me back to god. inspired me so much to give up my life to him. i fell in love with her and she fell in love with me. we talked about our future, getting married, having a family, the whole 9 yards. i have major codependency / attachment issues, and she had major trust issues. we started fighting constantly. she was manipulative and i was a liar. but we swore up and down that our relationship was built off of faith. we only dated for almost 8 months until she decided that me being trans was wrong. i had been starting to think the same thing. she broke up with me because it was also wrong for us to be gay. we stayed "friends" for two months, but it really consisted of us trying to justify being in a relationship together because of how deep our love was for one another. but our friendship ended all of a sudden when she told me that i either needed to get out of her life forever, or chose to live "the way god intended" - straight. long story short, i defended myself and i got blocked.

it has been almost two months since we've talked. i think about her every second of every day. she haunts me. i can't pray or do a bible study without thinking of her. i'm so scared that she has made a permanent scar on my faith. it is IMPOSSIBLE for me to think about god without thinking of her. and to make matters worse, i found out today that she has a boyfriend.

i have no idea what i believe in, i have no idea how to even think about those things without her flooding my mind. i have no idea who i am, now that ive basically been brainwashed into thinking that being trans isn't okay, and maybe that being a lesbian isn't either? not to be morbid, but it's seriously just making me want to die. i feel like this battle with myself will never end. i just want to feel at peace.

4 Comments
2024/12/03
02:49 UTC

28

What is gnosticism?

Hello everyone. I have heard of this, and I am wondering what this is. Additionally, it's hard to understand what Gnosticism is as there's no "Gnostic Bible" to my knowledge the same way there is for other denominations. I also have heard that Gnosticism is more of an umbrella term as opposed to a single denomination. Additionally, what is the definition of heresy as I hear this thrown around often while referring to it.

23 Comments
2024/12/03
01:57 UTC

8

Crying every time I pray

Hi, I've noticed that I feel moved when I do prayers, it's been going on for the longest time. Some people say it's the Holy Spirit moving through them, I don't know what to think ... As someone who deal with a lot mentally, sometimes my Faith and view of reality of the world is shaky. My family is against religion, I have no support system no friends and no social life ( so no church ).

Reconnecting with God really did something for me. I was sad, depressed and suddenly I followed the path of Faith again and now things are better with God.

I pray for someone on the regular and they've told me that for the first time in months, they felt peace after I prayed for them .. which made me felt incredibly thankful since I used to believe my prayers weren't heard.

I'm curious to know what you people think about this and also if any of you also cry, may God bless you all 🙏🏼

2 Comments
2024/12/03
00:51 UTC

5

People who went to Catholic schools, was the French Revolution (and the Second Spanish Republic if it was brought up) portrayed as bad while Spanish colonization (and Francisco Franco if he was brought up) was portrayed as good?

EDIT: The reason I asked this question was because the people over at r/Catholicism hate the French Revolution and the Second Spanish Republic.

13 Comments
2024/12/02
22:14 UTC

7

I'm fascinated and also slightly obsessed with the concept of reincarnation and parallel universes because I feel like it would give me an opportunity to go back and "fix" everything that went wrong in my young life in THIS particular world / timeline. Has anyone else here ever felt this way?

6 Comments
2024/12/02
20:55 UTC

10

In a constant state of mourning

Honestly I feel like I might need to take a step back from online things entirely. I feel like I've become aware of so much that's it's just breaking my spirit

Everyday even if I'm just scrolling on yt for something to watch, or even just watching a movie I'm always getting reminded of how twisted and divided this world is. Everyone's in some type of category with some type of identification and there's always someone hating on someone else that's different. There's always someone doing something terribly wrong, or pointing fingers at the other groups and calling them the bad guys

I've just been thinking about it constantly and every time it just breaks my heart even more. I seriously don't know what to do with all this grief I'm feeling I might just pray about it at this point because it's the only thing I can think about. Just the fact that everyone is so beautifully diverse but it's that exact diversity that tears people apart. I keep thinking about how people weren't supposed to live this way at all, and how much we let systems control how we live or think less of other people. How much people hate, use, threaten, and disregard other people just makes me hopelessly confused. We're all humans first and foremost... The world is so incredibly blind.

I'm not exactly depressed but I just feel so.. sorry

2 Comments
2024/12/02
19:16 UTC

0

December Blessings: A Powerful Prayer for Breakthrough, Healing, and Restoration

0 Comments
2024/12/02
18:42 UTC

8

As progressive Christians we may feel despondent right now, but God invites us into love and joy!

The doctrine of the social Trinity shifts our priority from barren individuality to abundant community. 

Our natural tendency in the West is to think of ourselves as individuals with our own unique being, or “substance”. Individuality and substance are important, and overly dominant, concepts in Western philosophy and theology. They pervade our culture and form our worldview, frequently without us even realizing it. 

The French philosopher Rene Descartes defines substance as a “thing that exists in such a way that it doesn’t depend on anything else for its existence,” noting that only God possesses such independent existence. Descartes then defines worldly substances as “things that don’t depend for their existence on anything except God.” This definition asserts the dependence of all things on God, then asserts their essential independence from each other. Descartes’s vision unites all reality to God, then fragments that very same reality. 

Such a metaphysic implies, intentionally or accidentally, separation from our neighbors. If God has created us to be metaphysically separate from one another, then what motivates us toward unity? If, on the other hand, our sustaining God is Trinity, then our sustaining God is relationality, or being-toward-another. Because we are made in the image of God, we have received the imprint of our Sustainer. Hence, we are dependent not only on God, but on one another as well. We are fundamentally communal. 

This mutualistic interpretation of life implies universal communion, thereby rejecting all forms of estrangement, domination, and hierarchy. Such a relational metaphysic may disorient us, since we (in the West especially) are more accustomed to the belief that things and people possess an underlying essence granting them a stable identity. In this view, a “thing” is what it is, and is not what it is not, forever. 

But contemporary physics calls into question the existence of any underlying essence or unchanging substance. Quarks, for example, are the most basic units of protons and neutrons. According to quantum physicists, quarks have neither parts nor dimension, nor can they exist independently of one another—there is no such thing as a “free” quark. Yet, quarks combine to produce the atomic nuclei that grant the cosmos weight and solidity. Metaphorically, we could say that quarks function only in relation to one another. 

Theologically, the social doctrine of the Trinity renders relationality, or communion, the most fundamental metaphysic in Christianity. God does not have relations; God is relations. Or, as Peter Phan writes, “In God relation is pure esse ad, facing-each-other, pure being-oriented-toward- each-other, pure self-giving and receiving-of-another.” Within the Trinity, each divine person possesses a centrifugal nature that seeks fulfillment in their neighbor. 

God invites humans into the same metaphysical extraversion.

As a reinterpretation of our most basic reality, the Trinity forces us to reconceptualize our relationship to God, one another, and the cosmos. If reality is most basically communion, then to be real is to be in communion, and to be separated is to be less real. Division diminishes being. Prior to relation, in the eternal nothingness that is the absence of relationality, any isolated being is a nonbeing. A solitary being is a nonbeing that yearns to be yet can receive its being only through another. By divine decision, without relationship there is nothing, even for God.

The social Trinity completes the personal concept of God as an interpersonal concept of God. 

Catherine Mowry LaCugna writes, “The identity and unique reality of a person emerges entirely in relation to another person.” The Bible has always insisted that God is personal, not abstract. Hence, you are not a glorious accident of cosmological evolution; you are a divinely intended gift, given by means of cosmological evolution. And within the universe is an unending desire for your well-being: “I alone know my purpose for you, says YHWH, my purpose for you to thrive, and my purpose not to harm you, my purpose to give you a future with hope. At that time you will call upon me and come and pray to me, and I will listen to you. You will seek me and find me when you seek me wholeheartedly” (Jeremiah 29:11–13a).

 In the biblical view, unrelated personhood is unfulfilled personhood: “It is not good for [someone] to be alone” (Genesis 2:18 DRA [gender neutralized]). We can observe this truth today: newborns denied physical contact develop reactive attachment disorders, inmates left in solitary confinement go insane, lonely people become depressed. Without other persons, personality is lost, because personality is fulfilled only through inter-personality.

The doctrine of the Trinity expresses this theological insight by insisting that God is more than personal; God is interpersonal, and lovingly so. Since humans are made in the image of God, the more we love the more joy we receive. Since we cannot deny to God our richest personal experiences, we ascribe to God their consummation. Perfect love and its correlate, pure joy, both belong to God, who invites us into their union. 

The doctrine of the social Trinity does not imply polytheism or tritheism (the worship of three separate gods). 

Critics of social Trinitarianism argue that, if the Trinity implies three unique centers of consciousness, then Christianity has rejected monotheism and adopted polytheism or, more specifically, tritheism (the worship of three gods rather than one God in three persons). But Trinitarianism is not tritheism. 

One way to distinguish the triune God from three gods is by contrasting the Christian Trinity with the Greek troika of Zeus, Poseidon, and Hades. These three gods are separate: ruling separate realms, marrying separate women, and pursuing separate lovers. They are ranked in power, over which they argue and for which they compete. They distrust one another; when their desires clash, they clash. Their disordered intentions produce a disordered world, as each wields power against the others in support of his arbitrary favorites.

In the Trojan war, for example, Zeus favors the Trojans, but Poseidon favors the Achaeans. When Zeus’s sexual attraction toward Aphrodite distracts him from the war, Zeus’s wife Hera advises Poseidon of this development, and Poseidon seizes the opportunity to strengthen his side. Later, upset by Poseidon’s intervention, Zeus sends him a message: 

Go on your way now, swift Iris, to the lord Poseidon, and give him all this message nor be a false messenger. Tell him that he must now quit the war and the fighting, and go back among the generations of gods, or into the bright sea. And if he will not obey my words, or thinks nothing of them, then let him consider in his heart and his spirit that he might not, strong though he is, be able to stand up to my attack; since I say I am far greater than he is in strength, and elder born; yet his inward heart shrinks not from calling himself the equal of me, though others shudder before me.

Zeus, Poseidon, and Hades rule the cosmos but threaten chaos. Hades lusts after Zeus’s daughter Persephone and abducts her, with Zeus’s permission. Her mother Demeter, goddess of agriculture, threatens to destroy the harvest and starve humankind, and thereby deny the gods their sacrifices. Zeus must plead with Hades for Persephone’s return. Even the natural order is not safe from these three gods’ cravings.

Zeus, Poseidon, and Hades are three gods, and in no way one God. They exemplify tritheism, and in the worst way. Many things are triune, both three and one, in which the three are distinguishable but inseparable. A musical triad is three different notes that make one chord. A triangle is three unique sides that make one shape. The French tricolor is three different colors that make up one flag. Hydrogen cyanide is three different atoms (HCN) that compose one molecule. Deuterium is three different particles—proton, neutron, and electron—united into one atom. To assert that any of these examples is one but not three, or three but not one, is foolish. Likewise, the Trinity is three persons united through love into one God, both three and one, hence triune. 

We all of us, in all our diversity, are made in the image of God. May we, who are many, so unite that we become one: perfectly unified difference, perfectly harmonized complexity—e pluribus unum. Such will be the Kingdom of God, which is the Reign of Love. (adapted from Jon Paul Sydnor, The Great Open Dance: A Progressive Christian Theology, pages 51-54)

*****

For further reading, please see:

Descartes. Selected Philosophical Writings. Translated and edited by Anthony Kenny et al. Cambridge: Cambridge University Press, 2009.

Hesiod. Theogony, Works and Days, Testimonia.  Translated by Robert W. Most. Loeb Classical Library. Cambridge: Harvard University Press, 2006.

Homer. The Iliad of Homer. Translated by Richmond Lattimore. Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 2011.

Kohl, Christian Thomas. “Buddhism and Quantum Physics: A strange parallelism of two concepts of reality.” Contemporary Buddhism 8, no. 1 (2007) 69–82. DOI: 10.1080/14639940701295328.

Lacugna, Catherine Mowery. God for Us: The Trinity and Christian Life. San Francisco: HarperCollins, 1993. 

Olson, Roger E. and Christopher Hall. The Trinity. Grand Rapids: Eerdmans, 2002.

Phan, Peter C. “Relations, Trinitarian.” In New Catholic Encyclopedia, 2^(nd) ed, edited by Berard L. Marthaler, vol. 12, 45–6. Detroit: Gale eBooks, 2003. 

Zizioulas, John. Being as Communion: Studies in Personhood and the Church. Crestwood: St. Vladimir's Seminary Press, 1985.

0 Comments
2024/12/02
17:28 UTC

35

I desperately want to leave Christianity but I'm so afraid.

I know this is probably not the best place to talk about this but I don't know where else to go where I feel safe. I believe in God, that's just fact, but I can't worship him, there's so many reasons why I feel a burden doing it. I see so many people out there just happy and astonished by God, like they're able to devote their whole life to God without a second thought and they worship and praise him and do whatever he says no matter the consequences because "it will all be better in the end", but I just can't do that. I want to live my own life, live for me and not God, I just want to exist without devoting my whole existence to something else but idk how to do it or even feel about it. I feel so sick every time I think about leaving Christianity because it's the only thing I know and I'm so scared of the afterlife and hell/judgement that it's borderline insane how much it takes up my brain space. I just want to live without feeling like I have to apologize or that the only way I'm full and a decent person is because God says I am. It hurts so much to live in a world where I'll always somehow be less than something else just because of how I was born and sometimes I honestly wish I could choose to never be born as awful as it sounds. I don't understand how people can live so happily believing in God when they have to submit their whole life to him and just exist always as a number two, making their entire life just to worship. I want to be like that sometimes, but it just hurts so much, and I have so many reasons about Christianity that I'm so burdened by, it's less comforting than it ever was reassuring. I see atheists living their best lives and it just makes me feel a sense of loneliness, like that's where I'm meant to be, but I know I could never do it. Sorry for venting or if this was confusing, I just really needed to reach out somehow.

32 Comments
2024/12/02
17:03 UTC

8

Stories from Church Camp

I have so many. I attended youth church camp for about 12 years. One or two weeks away at home during the summer. I was also a youth pastor and brought students to church camp for a week at a time.

I thought it would be fun to share some stories from church camp. Sexual exploration, fond hookup memory, funny story, or even evangelical ridiculousness. Let’s hear what you’ve got!

As always DMs are open for further dialogue.

13 Comments
2024/12/02
17:00 UTC

13

Are you a lay leader or clergyperson? Do you identify as disabled? Let's talk!

Hi all, I am a current minister in the Disciples of Christ and have been working on a project to better support and advocate for disability justice within our denomination for a few years now. One of the tangible outcomes of the discussions we've been having is that disabled clergy and leaders need to have wider support networks - not just of allies and accompanists, but of people who experience similar joys and struggles. In other words, they need to have disabled peers who just *get it* without needing to be educated (we're working on that piece separately, too).

If you are disabled, in some sort of leadership position (loosely defined), are open to working with the very ecumenically-minded DoC, and interested in joining regular Zoom-based groups, I'd love to invite you to scope out this link and see if either option is right for you. Note: this is open to all traditions and happy to include folks from across political/social/theological spectrums in general, but is firmly a pro-LGBTQ+/gender egalitarian/anti-racist/anti-ableist space.

0 Comments
2024/12/02
16:01 UTC

5

Looking to get back into Christianity

A little bit about my situation: I used to go to church etc as a kid and did all of the Christian style things and then in my 20's (now 32) | stopped going to church and everything like that

In May this year I had a bleed in my brain (AVM) and have been through some of the toughest months since then learning to walk again, talk, recognise my wife and family etc. It has only been a few months really since it happened and if you were to see me or even meet me you'd probably never know something like this has happened. The last few months while l've been facing my challenges l've been thinking about Christianity and how I can slowly get myself back to it.

I've thought about podcasts as it's something I can listen to and think about. My short term memory is really bad so l know reading and retaining information isn't something I can do just now. My mobility is pretty poor as of late so going to a church etc isn't something I feel I could cope with and being in crowds of people is a real struggle. I really just wanted to post to see if anyone had any suggestions of things I could try, if you read this far I am thankful for it. Was really hard getting my thoughts into words

2 Comments
2024/12/02
15:36 UTC

94

Can a Christian not be homophobic?

I am an Eastern Rite Orthodox Christian. Now I am a member of the Lithuanian Exarchate of the Ecumenical Patriarchate. Prior to that, he was a member of the Belarusian Exarchate of the Moscow Patriarchate. I'm heterosexual. Therefore, I have no personal self-serving motivation to defend LGBT people. But the extremely aggressive promotion of homophobia by the Russian Orthodox Church prompted me to do a theological fact-check on the topic: does the Bible really condemn homosexuality?

I provide a detailed and reasoned account of my research in books in Lithuanian, English and Russian languages:

Can a Christian not be homophobic?
Ar krikščionis gali nebūti homofobas?
Может ли православный не быть гомофобом?

My conclusions are unexpected and at odds with the majority of Orthodox Christianity believers. It turns out that there is not a single place in the entire Bible that clearly and unequivocally condemns homosexual love relationships as sin. All the quotations used by traditionalists are either distorted in translation or misinterpreted through the prism of modern views without taking into account the cultural and historical context. In the book I deal with each of these quotes.

It turns out that there is not a single place in the entire Bible that clearly and unequivocally condemns homosexual love relationships as sin. All the quotations used by traditionalists are either distorted in translation or misinterpreted through the prism of modern views without taking into account the cultural and historical context. In the book I deal with each of these quotes. We also know from Christ's words that not everyone is born with the capacity for lifelong sexual abstinence (Matthew 19:12). This is true for both heterosexuals and homosexuals.

Therefore, I am convinced that when a healthy Scriptural theology triumphs over the superstitions and prejudices of Christians, the churches will address homosexuals with the pastoral rejoinder of the Apostle Paul:

"For it is better to marry than to burn with passion!" (1 Corinthians 7:9)

But the situation in the minds of my coreligionists is still very far from that prospect. Although no theological body whose decision is authoritative for the entire Orthodox Church has made any judgment on the subject, homophobic sentiment on a private level is so pervasive that even high hierarchs are often convinced that negative attitudes toward homosexuality are an original teaching of the Church. In fact, this is not the case. Even the medieval authors of church canons that mention sodomy or arsenokoitia did not care at all about the issue of same-sex or opposite-sex relationships. They did not understand these words to mean same-sex relationships and condemned not them. (This is also in the book.)

I think it is the responsibility of LGBT Christians and those Christians who have realized the difference between their own teaching of the Bible and an unjust homophobic interpretation of it to spread a healthy theology to their fellow believers. Someday our descendants will wonder how among Christians there could be defenders of religious discrimination against LGBT+ people. Just as we now wonder how among Christians there were those who defended slavery and racism as traditional Biblical values, the destruction of which threatens to destroy fundamental social foundations and is an enmity against faith and God.

P.S. I am willing to answer any questions or objections regarding my theses and beliefs. And if you can't afford to buy the book, I'm willing to give you tips on how to comment on any Bible verse that homophobes

88 Comments
2024/12/02
15:10 UTC

2

Best Bible In a Year sites/podcasts

I understand the main tenants of faith but I want to get more acquainted with the scripture, so what website or podcast is the best for reading the bible in a year.

4 Comments
2024/12/02
14:39 UTC

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