Not looking for anything more than a yes or no answer to my question as I still have to read swarm and hive. But do they ever explain why the Formic are “eviscerating” the humans they find?

In my head (for some god forsaken reason) I imagine Corneal Graff as some slime creature with a big mustache for some reason. Of course, I take this description from the Book version, as the movie gives him a human like look.

I tried the first time about 20 years ago and couldn't make it past the second chapter because it was so dry. When I got older, I chalked it up to just being younger and wanted more lively interactions between the characters like in the first two books. So with my free Audible pickups, I got it, thinking I was in a better literary place and hey...it being in audiobook form would make it more accessable.

I was so wrong.

Still as dry and slow as I remembered. Like molasses in December.

I made it to chapter 4 this time while driving and just couldn't push forward. Is there a point where it moves a bit more briskly?

In the Formic War books, when the Formic ship arrived on Earth for the first time and the Formics began destroying everything in order to start their own natural flora and fauna growing on Earth, the humans began trying to communicate to them with human language. (Going back, I remembered that the Formics landed in China. But I doubt they speak Mandarin either.)

Of course, the Hive Queen later managed to communicate with Ender through his mind, which he, along with Miro and Val and Jane and the others, perceived as English (or Portuguese or Stark, or whatever it was). So clearly the Formics were able to learn human language eventually. But when the Formics first landed on Earth, they didn't even know that the humans were there nor that they were ramen and actually saw what was going on, so of course the Formics couldn't speak human language.

Additionally, the Formics didn't even communicate the same way (since they all shared a telepathic connection to the Hive Queen and language was unnecessary), and they were trying to learn about humans and their communication, as we can see when the Formics were studying Mazer and the others inside the ship.

So why, when the Formics first arrived, did the humans immediately try to talk to them? With human language? As one of my friends said once, "why would this species nothing like us be just like us??" Why would an alien species be anything like us, why would they understand human language, why would they understand human emotions and communication? In my opinion, this plan was not very well thought out by whoever decided it would be a good idea to try to talk to the aliens.

So when I bought Ender's Game it came in a larger book size, and Speaker for the Dead came in a more handheld size. Now I just bought Xenocide, and it is the larger size again. Is there a standard and I'm mixing two sizes, or is it something about Speaker being a shorter book than the other two?

Hey everyone thought this would be the best place to ask.

Was the 3rd book for the 2nd formic wars cancelled or something? I put it off for years waiting for the full trilogy and now I’m looking and finding conflicting views on it.

OSC spells it Ramen many times in the books I’ve read so far (Speaker & Xenocide), but in the hierarchy it’s spelled Raman. Is there a reason behind this?

In Ender's Game, the kids say "neh" as an affirming particle, like "That's crazy, neh?"

The weird thing is that this is how Japanese uses ne (ね), but also exactly how Portuguese uses ne (nao e). Both will tag ne onto the end of a sentence to ask for confirmation.

So which was he referencing? Or both? Or neither? French uses "non?" the same way, and Spanish uses "no?", while German uses "Ja?" the same way, he could've just accidentally stumbled upon "neh" as his own kind of future etymology, without knowing about ne.

Anyone know which it is?

* I've wondered whether the Japanese got ne from the Portuguese.

I just finished the last shadow. I just read them in order they were pictured at the end of the book. I read Enders game, speaker, xenocide, children of the mind, ender in exile and now the last shadow. I was confused by the order to begin with but since I was half way through speaker when I started questioning it I just kept going. I already bought the shadow series and haven’t started Enders shadow yet. How do you recommend I proceed? Should I just re read last shadow after shadow series? Super bummed at myself for not double checking the order. Like I said after speaker I just trusted the author showcased the books in the order he recommended.

Hoopla has them on digital download for audiobooks, but at some point I’d like to get him started on the Ender Saga.

Any suggestions on where to look for these? I’m not opposed to rebuying the series, but I’m looking for some free audiobook sources till I see whether his interest waxes or wanes.

I had not fun deliveries and when I was rereading Speaker for the Dead, I had a laugh/cry moment 🫠

I know that we like to pretend that this book doesn't exist but it, in fact, does. I liked the story the first time I read it. Didn't love it but I liked it. I never expected an explanation for the origin of the Descolada because Card said that the answer to that question wasn't interesting. They would either be Raman or varelse. What bothers me is that the planet was described as having no life and no flora that couldn't have been classified as shrubs but all of a sudden in The Last Shadow there are apparently woodlands with tall trees. Am I misinterpreting one of the books? This is just one of the many inconsistencies in this series that makes it clear to me that I like this shit more than Card does. He can't even be bothered to read his own work. Is that just a big shot writer thing? Too cool for school type of thing? Or does he just conveniently change aspects of the story to tell the story he intends? He does it a lot with Peter's character. The only way how he can lift characters like Valentine or in this book Thulium is to regress the growth of Peter's character throughout the Shadow Saga.

A bit of a ramble but why are there trees when Children of the Mind made it clear that there weren't any and that this planet was very young?

I read the Formic Wars trilogy between 2014 - 2016.

I am now starting the 2nd trilogy. However, due to the 7+ year gap, I'm missing some of the bigger picture.

I read the wiki on the first 3 books, to try and remind myself of what happened.

One question I have right now is, what was Ukko Jukes' motivation behind the drone attack in Earth Awakens?

Hopefully I can pick up with the 2nd trilogy, without being very lost.

As I am reading Speaker for the Dead, I keep thinking about Jane. What if there was a Jane-esk entity in real life and we would not even know it? Can you imagine? What if there is already such an entity in existence? My mind is blown, send help.

I've been rereading the books, and while I'm most of the way through the Shadow series already, this still lingers in my mind.

Near the end of Xenocide, they realize that Jane won't die once the computer shut off happens after all, due to her connection with Ender's aiua. She'd be intellectually crippled for a while, but it wouldn't be outright death as soon as the shut off happens. But almost as soon as CotM starts, they're back to talking about how Jane will fully die once the shut off happens, not just be hurt essentially. It was pretty confusing for a while and it felt like a glaring mistake to me. I know that they eventually used his connection with her to save her through the Piggies' trees and then Valentine 2, but it still felt like a mistake that they went back on it being permadeath for her.

And on a similar note...again near the end of Xenocide, Ender meets with Novinha and she basically invites him to come and visit her once a month until he decides to join the order. But again at the beginning of CotM, their first meeting is played as if Ender hadn't been there before and that he wasn't welcome, and he had to convince her that he wanted to stay by her side.

I'm not sure I really have a point here...but those two points really bugged me about CotM, among other things that made that book the weakest in the Ender quartet for me. Was there ever a reason given for these holes?

NO SPOILERS PLEASE

I've read the ender novels and the shadow novels.

Next up on deck is the formic wars novels.

However, I'm immediately suspicious because these books are written by Orson Scott Card "and Aaron Johnston". Which I assume means that this random guy wrote these books and OSC just signed off on them.

Part of why I like all the other books is because of OSC's writing style.

Are these books worth reading?

I read some of the Dune books that were written outside of the the main cannon by a different author and hated them.

I live in south america so it wasnt an easy task

Ender's Game

Truly excellent. One of the best paced books I have ever read, finished it in two and a bit sittings. Had my doubts about the Demosthenes/Locke chapters because they kind of appeared out of nowhere and I was eager to get back to Ender, but got into them pretty quickly as well.

Not sure how I felt about the twist, because I could see that I was nearing the end of the book and that Ender was still being trained, so I knew that something dramatic had to be coming and the twist felt a little too neat for wrapping up the story. Overall though one of the best books I've ever read.

9/10

Speaker For the Dead

It was clear pretty early on that this was going to be a very different book to Ender's Game. I would say that it is as good as EG, but for completely different reasons. The characters were all wonderfully flawed which made Ender's interactions with them very satisfying. Some incredibly intense moments in this book as well.

The one thing I didn't like initially was Jane. She seemed to be a very convenient solution to a lot of Ender's logistical problems - the kind of solution that I had appreciated Card for not indulging in previously. Overall not a detriment to the book as a whole though.

9/10

Xenocide

This book to me was not nearly as good as SftD. In Speaker, there is a slow burn of a story but it's worth it for the moments of tremendous drama that pay off for that slow pace. In Xenocide, there were not nearly enough of these moments to keep the story as engaging for me. I also had a big problem with the Path twist - to create Path for the reasons it was is just a purely evil action, with no moral justification at all. It's pretty much just supervillainy on the part of Starways Congress.

The story of Path was good, I liked all of the characters and their plight. Lusitania and the troubles there were good as well. Still a good book.

7/10

Children of the Mind

This book I had a lot of trouble with. Ender's Game and Speaker for the Dead I was compelled to finish in just a few nights, CotM took me nearly two months to finish. So much of the writing felt unnecessarily bloated - paragraphs and paragraphs of people having arguments that lead nowhere. Quara and Miro both became incredibly unlikable characters for me. Peter and Wang Mu hopping around from planet to planet like an action spy movie. Jane's abilities solving almost every impossible problem they face. The Descoladores threat being expanded upon and then left unresolved. The Divine Path plot about how important the philosophy of individuals is in determining the actions of Starways Congress - all to be solved by bribing them with lots and lots of cash. Wang Mu falling deeply in love with Peter, to the extent that their philotic strands become intertwined, after only a few weeks of knowing each other... this book felt full of literary shortcuts, so that Card could focus less on the story and more on driving home the point that human feelings can be complicated.

3/10

Overall I would say that Speaker and Ender's Game are absolute masterpieces, and that the other two are easily forgettable.

(To preface: I’m new to reading the series and I’ve just finished Ender’s Game and I’m about halfway through Speaker for the Dead.)

I’ve only ever heard that this series is extremely popular with a very passionate fan base. However, I work at a Barnes & Noble and we mostly only carry the enderverse books in mass market format (a smaller and cheaper paperback that normally isn’t a very popular pick) and we only carry the Ender’s Quartet series and maybe Ender’s Shadow.

Normally that means the other books aren’t selling well enough for us to hold stock. But I also can’t even order any of the Formic Wars and some of the Shadow Series books into our store even if we wanted them. Not to mention that I hardly get asked for OSC from customers.

Maybe it’s just that it’s not mainstream enough or that it’s too “old”, but it seems so bizarre to me that a book series that is, so far, phenomenal and was so critically acclaimed has just seemed to fade away.

I’ve only read the book Ender’s game, but I do want to continue the series. Does the movie spoil any events of the other books in the series?

Just finished Shadow of the Giant and I’m a little confused on the tie to Xenocide/Children of the Mind. So the end of Shadow of the Giant gives insight into not only how Peter united the world and became Hegemon, but also about how at the end of his life he spoke to Ender multiple times enabling him to write The Hegemon. Ender at this point knows all of Peter’s ambitions and regrets and has a full picture of Peter and even goes as far as to say that he’s glad they talked.

What I don’t understand is that if this is the case, why was his view of Peter so negative in Xenocide and Children of the mind when the child versions of Peter and Valentine are “created” from his mind?

It can also be the funniest or the most epic moment in the book.

I'll preface this by saying this is just my opinion. E.G. Alive had so much potential, but the lack of a narrator makes the project nearly laughable. Do not misunderstand me, OSC'a dialog is fantastic. The bittersweet irony and sarcasm laced with hope for humanity is my favorite part of the enderverse. BUT the plot relies on action and setting to drive it forward. Alive relies on dialog alone to convey action and setting. Listening to characters describe the action is cringe beyond fuckworthy. People do not comment on the actions of others to the degree used in Alive. It's not natural. For comparison sake, I just finished the full cast version of the golden compass and the subtle knife, and it was fugging fantastic! It is narrated by the author with a full cast for the characters. I just got the amber spyglass on Libby and I can't wait to listen to it. I mean, I'm about to give up on Alive halfway through to finish his dark materials. Ender's Game is my favorite book ever. EVER. (except for maybe shadow or speaker lol) if Alive was narrated by OSC and supported the full cast, minus Scott Brick (actually fuck that guy, I couldn't finish shadow because of him), I would have been so happy. There are parts of Alive that I am enjoying, but goddamn, when I have to listen to Graff describe how Ender defeats another opponent, my ears might bleed.

TLDR: Ender's Game Alive relies on dialog to describe action and it just doesn't work for me. Also fuck Scott Brick.

I was going for Speaker for the Dead, but saw this post and now I'm in doubt. pls help