Hello again!! This is the first time reading the HP series and GoF book is sooo fun so far!!! There’s drama, there’s betrayal, there’s romance (!!!yay!!!), there’s the wizard tournament! I remember watching GoF as a kid and it was my fave movie and definitely my fave book so far. I know I’m only in the middle but this book seems so much more interesting (for me) than the other ones. I love the little bits of calm, where Harry can just be a normal teenager.

Anyway, obviously I know who each character ends up with but Hermione & Krum was such a fun twist! Even Neville wanting to go with Hermione was so sweet. Hermione is one of my favorite characters (even if her house elf arc is a bit sad), so seeing everyone react to how pretty she looked at the ball made me feel giddy! She pulled Krum!!! Good for her!!! (Even tho Ron tried to ruin it, Krum seems so broody and sweet.)

Harry finally noticing how many girls were in Hogwarts had me DYING. It’s sad that he’s been too worried about getting killed every year that he had no space in his mind for crushes. I remember being around 12-18 and having crushes was such a big deal. It was literally all everyone talked about!

Don’t even get me started on Ron and Fleur. Doesn’t she end up with one of his brothers?!?! I know this book is Harry’s POV but damn, I wanna know more about everyone else’s life!!!

10/10 book so far (poor Patil twins, poor Hagrid. I need my man to have a happy ending. I don’t remember what happens to him but I hope he’s happy!!!!)

Edit: how can I forget the petty dislike of Cedric?? Literally so funny.

Went past this bit of the battle of Hogwarts last night and I get Voldy put the graft in with the giants to get them on board. But my question is how do you think he got the spiders on board, or do you think they just had the riot mentality and joined in

Imagine how Voldemort reacted when Lucius told him that he was being blamed for the dementors in Ootp. Voldemort, Harry’s ex-teacher who cares so much about his education that he places his plots and plans at the end of the academic year so as to not inconvenience his education. Voldemort, who knows that pupils should worry about summer homework and not attacks. He’d probably be irritated lol

I’ve had the trilogy book set of the first 3 Harry Potter books and I discovered that the philosophers stone book was an early 3rd printing from 1997 with the 10 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 and the full Joanne Rowling text while the other books were from 1999. It was originally bought in a charity shop for £3 in the late 2000s. Interesting to see how the early print ended up with the other 2 books.

I actually think it is. Harry often completely misunderstands Snape and misinterprets things about him however he usually has incomplete information and also Snape singled him out from day 1 and set the tone for their bad relationship so like yes Harry is often wrong about Snape but a lot of it is due to Snape’s own doing and the way Snape chose to treat Harry. I like how Harry has to grow to recognise how complex people and how contradictory they can be and Snape is an example of that. When he sees some of Snape’s memories in book 5 and 7, he can identify a bit with them and it makes Snape a bit more human to him and then of course when he has the fully story naturally his personality of Snape changes significantly

I think it is equally both and that is why he feels so angry and upset with this book. He is clearly hurt when Dumbledore doesn’t look at him and starts to feel insecure about how much Dumbledore actually cares about him. I think they both sort of go together because he then also is frustrated about why Dumbledore is not telling him certain things he really wants to know. He seems to take it very personally though the walll between them this year especially when Dumbledore avoids his eyes

There is magic in blood, that’s clear from numerous examples:

Dumbledore is particularly famous for his defeat of the Dark wizard Grindelwald in 1945, for the discovery of the twelve uses of dragon’s blood, and his work on alchemy with his partner, Nicolas Flamel.

…

The blood of a unicorn will keep you alive, even if you are an inch from death, but at a terrible price.

…

“B-blood of the enemy . . . forcibly taken . . . you will . . . resurrect your foe.”

…

I wanted the blood of the one who had stripped me of power thirteen years ago . . . for the lingering protection his mother once gave him would then reside in my veins too. . . .

…

[...] least pleasant of all, an ornate crystal bottle with a large opal set into the stopper, full of what Harry was quite sure was blood.

…

“Salamander blood, Harry!” Hermione moaned, grabbing his wrist to prevent him adding the wrong ingredient for the third time. “Not pomegranate juice!”

…

“While you can still call home the place where your mother’s blood dwells, there you cannot be touched or harmed by Voldemort. He shed her blood, but it lives on in you and her sister. Her blood became your refuge. [...]”

…

Blood Brothers: My Life Amongst the Vampires

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“You’ve got to give the door something?”

“Yes,” said Dumbledore. “Blood, if I am not much mistaken.”

It’s also clear that some magic runs in families, sometimes:

“Are all your family wizards?” asked Harry, who found Ron just as interesting as Ron found him.

“Er — yes, I think so,” said Ron. “I think Mum’s got a second cousin who’s an accountant, but we never talk about him.”

…

“A Squib is someone who was born into a Wizarding family but hasn’t got any magic powers. Kind of the opposite of Muggle-born wizards, but Squibs are quite unusual.[...]"

…

“There isn’t any Seer blood in your family, is there?” [Tonks] inquired curiously, as they sat side by side on a train rattling toward the heart of the city.

…

“No, no, house-elves can’t leave unless they’re given clothes, they’re tied to their family’s house,” said Sirius.

…

You’ll be Gryffindor like her, I suppose? Yes, it usually goes in families. Not always, though.

…

“You can speak Parseltongue, Harry,” said Dumbledore calmly, “because Lord Voldemort — who is the last remaining descendant of Salazar Slytherin — can speak Parseltongue.

The notion that magical ability is influenced by one's pedigree is not patently absurd.

However, magic pops up in all sorts of people, regardless of blood:

“An’ they haven’t invented a spell our Hermione can’ do,” said Hagrid proudly, making Hermione go a brilliant shade of magenta.

Enforcing a discriminatory system based on so-called blood-purity is not only majorly unkind (duh), but also just bad policy because it's not determinative, there are far too many exceptions and counterexamples to be a useful heuristic to view the world.

Are there any other good hp based podcasts

I think Hermione might have been tempted but she knows how adamant Harry is about handling this by himself. She knows how irritable and on edge Harry had been this year and how he doesn’t like people making decisions about his life without consulting him so she probably doesn’t want to risk a serious rift in their friendship. Also she probably realises that Umbridge has so much power that there is no guarantee she can be stopped so Hermione thinks of other ways of resisting her like the DA with Harry as the teacher and later the Quibbler article. She also helps with the Murtlap Essence which is very kind of her. I think if she had told though Harry would have been angry at least initially

This is something my husband asked and I didn't know the answer. It is said that Seamus is Irish, but is there a student who we know comes from Scotland?

I noticed some discussions on whether Northern students need to go all the way to London to catch the train but I don't recall seeing this particular information about students who would live close to Hogwarts.

Much in line with Snape’s double agent role, could Snape have ended up killing both Dumbledore and Voldemort?

Dumbledore knew Harry must ‘die’ and that Voldemort would do it. He suspected that there was a way for Harry to ‘come back’ but he wasn’t 100% sure. It was always a possibility Harry loses given what the prophecy says (though it’s a little bit more complicated and cba to get into the fate stuff lol!)

Do you think that Snape had orders to assassinate Voldemort once the horcruxes were gone (though, Snape only knows about Harry and probably guesses Nagini)? Perhaps dumbledore told Snape that once Voldemort fears for his Snake and Harry is told to get killed, then Snape attacks Voldemort?

Else, it doesn’t really make sense what Snape thought the whole point of this was.

Sure, Harry must die because some of Voldemort’s soul is in Harry, Snape understands that. So Harry dies. But now what? Voldemort is still here. Lily is not avenged (if anything you’ve got her son killed, your one redeeming task).

Surely there was a second part to Snape and Dumbledore’s conversation when Dumbledore said “Alas, once Harry has passed on. It will be very down to you Severus. Smoke that mother fu….”

I don't just mean instead of Fred. I mean, Fred, Lupin and Tonks. Percy should have been the Weasley that died and the parent who left an orphan.

Imagine: in Book 5, Percy is not only working for Fudge, but also married young with his first kid on the way. His attitude towards his original family and Harry is fueled not just by snobbery, but fear of losing his promising career path and seeing his own family ending up "poor" and mocked like the one he grew up in. He is obsessively trying to avoid being like his parents. His wife might be Penelope Clearwater, who he's already over-protective of since her attack by the Basilisk.

After he sees the error of his ways, he joins the fight against Voldemort, and asks Harry to be his kid's godfather, the previous one having snuffed it. Percy joins the Battle of Hogwarts and dies redeeming himself. Penelope likewise dies in the war.

For twin drama, George is not just disfigured but also disabled, and learns to keep up his sense of humor. Lupin and Tonks meanwhile have been through enough already. Let Tonks avenge her Dad and Moody in the battle, and let Remus f-ck up Fenrir Greyback in a werewolf showdown. And crimeny, let Neville kill Bellatrix LeStrange.

So some books have obvious red herrings like in Philosophers Stone Snape is the one you suspect. This one is notable as the main characters suspect him too.

However, on re-reads as an adult I noticed every book has AT LEAST one red herring but that some of them had gone over my head.

1. Snape obviously!

2. Percy!

I felt so stupid when I realised. So many instances. Spending time in his bedroom alone sending letters in the summer, the book he is reading/buying at diagon alley, Harry and Ron bumping into him randomly all the time often near important locations like the bathroom or slytherin common room, Malfoy slagging off Percy, Ginny knowing something about Percy, mentions of Percy’s ambition, mentions of slytherin ambition, Percy getting annoyed about the twins dressing up as slytherins monster…. I could go on. Lockhart is also an honourable mention being present at various key moments, book shop, the voice etc

3. Sirius

Obviously 🙄 Probs Lupin at points too with all the dog references, the map/knowledge of secret passages, ‘luring out of school’ comments, grim sightings, dementor skills, the discussion of a traitor/friend of the potters and werewolf clues. Plus Snape’s comments to Dumbledore about Lupin.

4. Mr crouch/Ludo Bagman

This book is in someways has the most complicated plot. Certainly Rowling says it was the hardest to write and had some crazy number of rewrites for a chapter. It also has a lot of secondary red herrings, Krum, karkaroff…

There are a few subtle signs but the most obvious is the World Cup. Crouch misses the match, we find Winky, crouch is on the map stealing polyjuice, we see how he’s brutal and power hungry, he goes off sick. However, after Harry meets him in the forest, we know he’s probs not the villain.

Bagman, there’s the fact he’s in the woods before we find winky, the deatheater accusations, there’s the goblin stuff, offers to help Harry and how crouch and winky say he’s a bad wizard.

5. Umbridge

This is kinda the least satisfying one as it’s the least covert and ends up partially true. We also kinda know she’s just her own sort of evil rather than a deatheater, not to mention her incompetence. However there are moments when we question this. There are nods to Umbridge sending the dementors in the court room, possibly on Voldemorts orders, there’s Harry’s scar hurting when she touches him, there’s how she undermines the anti-Voldemort movement, how she is so pro slytherin, her brutal methods, the various ministry of magic clues like the dreams/devils snare/malfoy and there are

6. Slughorn

Again this one is a bit complicated because in someways it’s Snape but we know he’s good, it’s like a double switch. It’s not Malfoy because he really was the one behind things. Tonks also gets an honourable mention as they run into her at key points too.

Slughorn however, he’s head of slytherin, we are told Harry doesn’t know if he likes him, he has the poisoned mead, he recognises the ring on dumbledore, slughorn was in hogsmeade before the cursed necklace, slughorn has all the polyjuice that gets used to transform crabbe and goyle, slughorn has the Princes old potion book with the dark magic in it and is a potion master himself. There are probably more but I can’t remember!

7. Dumbledore

So this is a really hard one as it’s not like the other books. There isn’t really a ‘who done it?’in a fixed location as they are on the run. There is a case for Harry being the red herring given he’s a horcrux etc.

I’m fairly sure it’s dumbledore even if it’s not quite like the other red herrings. We don’t exactly suspect dumbledore but we question his motives and whether he’s ’good’. The hallows symbol being associated with Grindewald, Dumbledore’s dodgy past, Harry’s frustrations with him, Ron’s suggestion it’s all a sick joke by dumbledore, the trap in godrics hallow, Dumbledore’s manipulations, the Grimmauld place ‘ghost’, the ‘pig to slaughter’ memory and probably more.

It’s more that we and Harry question if Dumbledore really is on Harry’s side or if he’s just against Voldemort and everyone else is just a pawn.

Basically just the title. We know that Dumbledore did not inform Snape of all he knew about Voldemort’s horcruxes. Although Dumbledore did tell Snape, as shown in the princes tale, that a piece of Voldy’s soul had latched onto Harry’s. But I’m curious if Snape would have put this together to realize it was horcruxes they were speaking of. Had someone uttered the word would Snape have known about that magic? We know he was intrigued by the dark arts his whole life so it would seem that he, unlike others, might have been in possession of a book that would have mentioned them. But we also know Dumbledore removed those books from the restricted section before Snape would have been at Hogwarts. I assume he could procure dark arts books out in the real world and therefore could have reasonably come across it.

I just think it’s interesting, such an academic intrigued by the dark arts as Snape was, to be like; “wtf is a Horcrux!!?” If it ever came up in conversation.

Side question also if you made it this far… what was Dumbledores backup plan if Snape died before alerting Harry of that crucial and final piece of clarity he needed to walk into the forbidden forrest to greet death like an old friend?

So, I was re-reading OoTP for the hundredth time and notice a cool bit of foreshadowing that I’ve missed on all other readings.

Remember, how we get to know at the end of the book that it was actually Umbridge who ordered the dementor attack on Harry? Well, during his trial, it’s actually foreshadowed so well that if someone paid attention they’d instantly know it’s her who did it. So surprised I never noticed it earlier! I’m providing the relevant text below:

“'Oh, I don't think any of us believe the Dementors were there by coincidence,' said Dumbledore lightly. The witch sitting to the right of Fudge, with her face in shadow, moved slightly but everyone else was quite still and silent. 'And what is that supposed to mean?' Fudge asked icily. 'It means that I think they were ordered there,' said Dumbledore.

'We must ask ourselves why somebody within the Ministry ordered a pair of Dementors into that alleyway on the second of August.' In the complete silence that greeted these words, the witch to the right of Fudge leaned forwards so that Harry saw her for the first time. He thought she looked just like a large, pale toad. She was rather squat with a broad, flabby face, as little neck as Uncle Vernon and a very wide, slack mouth. Her eyes were large, round and slightly bulging. Even the little black velvet bow perched on top of her curly hair put him in mind of a large fly she was about to catch on a long sticky tongue. 'The Chair recognises Dolores Jane Umbridge, Senior Undersecretary to the Minister,' said Fudge.

[ Removed by Reddit on account of violating the content policy. ]

It is thought when Neville is young that he might be a Squib because he doesn’t show any magic signs whatsoever, and even when he does he’s not very skilled or powerful. It just dawned on me that his parents were both probably very skilled magicians because they were both aurors and everyone seem to think highly of them, so why didn’t their son inherit this skill? Well, of course later we see him blossom and show his true colours. So could the early magic deficiency be due to grief from loosing his parents? Never thought of it before, but it kinda makes sense

Canonically speaking, Remus was not the voice of reason everyone seems to believe he is, at least not during Hogwarts years. He was too afraid of pissing off his friends and too grateful for their friendship to ever speak his mind. Even after the prank Sirius play against Snape, Remus didn't seem to be too bothered (at least not that everyone else knew). But at the same time, in ootp, when Harry confronts Sirius and Remus about the bullying towards Snape, Remus says that he never told them to stop bullying people, but Sirius does say that he would sometimes make them feel embarrassed of the things they were doing. That does sound a bit like standing up against their actions?

From Prisoner of Azkaban:

‘Professor Dumbledore – yesterday, when I was having my Divination exam, Professor Trelawney went very – very strange.’

‘Indeed?’ said Dumbledore. ‘Er – stranger than usual, you mean?’

From Goblet of Fire:

‘Yes,’ said Harry. ‘Professor – I was in Divination just now, and – er – I fell asleep.’

He hesitated here, wondering if a reprimand was coming, but Dumbledore merely said, ‘Quite understandable. Continue.’

Never realised Dumbledore was insinuating that Trelawney was a strange person and that her classes are so stifling that students would naturally fall asleep.

I had a nice chuckle upon rereading these lines many years after my first read.

“— or secret Defense Against the Dark Arts groups?” said Sirius. There was a short pause. “How did you know about that?” Harry demanded. “You want to choose your meeting places more carefully,” said Sirius, grinning still more broadly. “The Hog’s Head, I ask you..." “Well, it was better than the Three Broomsticks!” said Hermione defensively. “That’s always packed with people —” “— which means you’d have been harder to overhear,” said Sirius. “You’ve got a lot to learn, Hermione.”

But... they were right, the Hog's Head was a much better choice. Sirius' logic here only makes sense if a handful of people – maybe less than 5 people – is trying to talk softly to each other in a crowd. It is mentioned two pages later that at this point in time, there are 28 people in the D.A.! For everyone to hear what anyone is saying, they would have to speak up considerably and basically yell if they have to talk above the loud babble of the crowd. Meaning more people, if not the ENTIRE pub, would have heard them.

The spell Muffliato had not been introduced in the series yet and besides, it would be much too suspicious if everyone close by to them in the Three Broomsticks had annoying buzzing in their ears. I mean, c'mon, was Sirius expecting them to use 28 pairs of Extendable Ears for every meeting (/s) ? Or maybe an elaborate game of the game "telephone" so that everyone understood what was being said 🙄 (/s)?

‘Fools who wear their hearts proudly on their sleeves, who cannot control their emotions, who wallow in sad memories and allow themselves to be provoked so easily – weak people, in other words – they stand no chance against his powers! He will penetrate your mind with absurd ease, Potter!’ Snape, OOTP

You know, this is a very powerful quote, but it's ironic to see it said from the same person who cannot control his emotions (throwing a glass jar at a kid), constantly wallowing in his sad memories (him being bullied and abused) and allowing himself to be provoked so easily (venting all his spite and vindictiveness on people/children who play zero part on it)

'You've been raising him like a pig for slaughter!'

Says the one who has been treating him like an emotional punching bag, even if he does feel remorse about that for keeping Dumbledore's words in his head.

Tom Riddle: Mysterious, psychopathic, manipulative, strategic, intelligent, charismatic

Voldemort: "LOOK AT ME, I'M THE BIG BAD SNAKE MAN"

Is it because he lost parts of his soul and couldn't understand others anymore? Is it bad inconsistent writing?

Adult Voldemort's MO is entirely driven by ego and domination. He leads a cult where he essentially forces his disciples to hide things from him for fear of being tortured or killed. He creates an environment where nobody under him except a few absolute headcases wanted him to return. He makes decisions that leave him incredibly vulnerable and allow for Harry to have a confrontation with him. His younger self, while he had shades of these attributes, was extremely secretive and manipulative. He drew people to him through charisma and was overall a much scarier villain.

Anyone else feel this way?

Why did neither Dumbledore nor Voldemort think of using the liquid luck to achieve their respective goals in the wizarding world?

It hits me every reread. Like I know he is the most evil person ever and the deatheaters follow him no matter how nasty he gets. But was he like this the last war too? Can’t see anyone wanting to be in his presence when acting like this . But I’m guessing he was first his persuasive fake good persona and then slowly showed his true self and by then they were all sucked in and addicted to the power and/or scared

I always used to find it annoying in Goblet of Fire when Amos Diggory proclaims "One falls off his broom, one stays on, you don't need to be a genius to tell which one's the better flier" I mean did Cedric not tell him that dementors attacked Harry?

So, I have this fantasy of a savage Harry. After winning the Triwizard Tournament when Harry is meeting Cedric's parents, I wish Harry had said "Two wizards faced Lord Voldemort, one died and one didn't, you don't need to be a genius to tell which one's a better wizard."

I mean I know this one line goes against Harry as a character. But somehow everytime I'm re-listening to Goblet of Fire, my brain just adds this bit of savagery.

Cant spell her name.

Okay, so has anyone ever realized Minerva has been at Hogwarts for 62 years?!

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in chapter 15 of OOTP Minerva’s says she was teaching for 39 years “this December” + 2 for HBP and DH making 41

19 years later, Minerva is the headmistress, so that’s 60 years.

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4 years later, cursed child, still the headmistress, making it 64 years.

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She is DEDICATED.

So, we all know that Harry's career advice meeting with McGonagall is probably one of the best scenes in book 5 (definitely one of the most badass McGonagall moments IMO, and she has quite a few). But we never really hear anything about anyone else's , how it went or if Umbridge interfered with it or not.

How do you think Ron, Hermione and Neville's career advice meeting went? Would Ron have mentioned becoming an Auror and received similar advice/desdain from McGonagall and Umbridge? Did Hermione just basically get told she could do whatever the hell she wanted anyway? Would McGonagall have encouraged Neville to pursue a career in Herbology?

Starting a thread where people can present their cases for what if scenarios in Harry Potter. Hip hip! ✨

This is not meant to be hateful! Personally, I really know I love a book when I dissect the hell out of it! Your criticism could be anything. It could be a plot hole, a character's action, etc.