We know that this entity is essentially all seeing, across all timelines it was built in.

What can it really comprehend? How many factions got created?(thats stupid, an infinite number, I know). But when and how? Shelter 41 cant be the only "big" anomaly in the future, we are talking about the infinite. Can it recognize art? Is the AI that sophisticated it knows what really gets humans going?^([1])

I see one of many flaws, if the Director knows all the timelines it was built in, its still a fail-safe. The timelines that didnt need it, well, they didnt need it. All the timelines we get to consider are already too far gone, the Director is just the most powerful piece of technology the people think will save them. So they relinquish all control, desperate move.. The fact it can see across timelines doesnt make it "better", because it can only see timelines that are already failing, already built it with the "same" parameters.

Functioning or Utopian timelines wont need the Director, they will certainly have an AI of such complexity, maybe better, but that AI would be specifically instructed not to interfere. Similar to protocol Omega, or all the protocols that we know of for that matter.

What we see at the end of S3, is that the PRIME screen that all the directors see? Or is it just a version of our Director accepting defeat and overhauling the program in the future[(its present?) Would that mean protocol OMEGA for its presen?]t If its the latter, this already happened an infinite number of times, and the Director shouldnt name it V2, because these "versions" already happened across all the "other" timelines, which it should be able to see ALL ,[THE TIME]. Why would an all seeing computer name something V2^([2]), if it already came across the same exact situation multiple(<infinite) times..

If it truly is the PRIME screen that all the directors see, they must realize what their purpose is, even if its against EVERY protocol they ever "knew". At that point, V2 would certainly mean a total destruction of the human race. Dont get me wrong, there is no other option the AI could come up with, and I wouldnt blame it. What about 0115? What about 009, 0017 and 0029. In this timeline, these travelers should be the most important people in their century, why would the Director send them back for a trail? Which we saw was possible to do "online" in S1E8, all traveler teams ACROSS the world voted, betraying the grand plan isnt a small thing, it gets you a trial with ALL your peers, literally.

We dont get to see any of the programmers missions, 0029 is turned by the faction, 009 is seen one more time(S3E5), 0017 is never mentioned again. The Director surely put her to work(009), it was his plan to send her into the future, as it was with the others.. (desperate move, as awlays)

How far can the director see? He couldnt see 0027 transferring into the future, what else can it miss? Technically, if all it takes is a programmer, it could essentially miss alot of events in its present, not even talking about the time it was "offline". We are still talking about a machine, that only sees what it can. If its offline, it doesnt matter what its processing capabilities are, it cant see them.

The Director couldnt see everything as WE and the travelers were lead to believe. The Faction was essentially a revolution we didnt get to see. What they did with the technology was exactly what WE(as people) would do, the opposite of what the "oppressor" dictates.

Director finds a "morale" solution to take lives? Why would we care.. The Directors programming wasnt perfect, but it was better than a free-for-all, or a continuation of a civil war. The faction did exactly what WE would do if our people were in this situation.

A world where people in positions of power actually accept that time travel is possible, is already lost. The fact is, that the timeline we see or any that are considered, are already lost. THE DIRECTOR is the fail-safe people built when they saw they are too far gone. This doesnt mean that ONE traveler program wont succeed, it just means that any success is already less than an optimal outcome.

Thank you for your read, share your opinion in the comments.

[1] Does the Director take art into account? Millions of people turned their life to something because of art. Can the director see that? Can it make decisions based on possible changes or only historically calculable changes?

[2] This is the weirdest situation. Forget the show getting canceled, focus on the shows timeline. Why would a computer that is able to see MULTIPLE timelines classify something as "V2". In this instance, V2 is way more than a second version, it will try to do its best not to end up in this situation.

Im in season 2 but something that keeps bothering me is that the travelers seem to make little mistakes that could have been prevented if they had just learned. It’s a whole list really. Why doesn’t Carly know how to take care of a baby? Why didn’t they prepare Carly for how to deal with an abuser like she doesn’t know what CPS is. Didn’t they know that she died from blunt force trauma from her husband? Why doesn’t Trevor know how to play football ? Why don’t they have a cure for addiction in the 29th century? Why haven’t they put Phillips butt in a room and detoxed him yet? Why would they send someone into a heroin user in the first place even if it was just “one time”? Why didn’t they prepare them for the side effects of the antitoxin? They also are too trusting and don’t ask enough questions. I’m kind of sick of them just following the director blinding but also the faction is annoying.

They just don’t seem as smart as I was expecting.

The plot was really good , actors good too , starting season was good and much potential, s2 was good but i kind of lost the excitement during season 3

Of all characters i liked philip most , he was most sane, compassionate and of all characters hood looking to me , although he was in an addicted body he tried his best , he questioned what seemed wrong even if done by the director .

The blind trust of mac and team in director icked me a bit, they followed directors order blindly without asking any thing, i know they took oath and all , its just it didnt fit well with me

Like killing Kate's child and mac just accepting that wasn't good to watch ,

David deserved better , i liked him ,he was a pure soul who was ready to be in chaos just for marcy

I was really looking forward to see philip end up with someone at the end but there was nothing to see

Somewhere i felt like lives were treated as toys as overwriting ppl by faction or the director

Why did i felt trevor would be setup with that girl who was bullied by his gf in cafeteria in early seasons ??

I liked grace towards the end , her quirkyness was fun I The yates superiors and travelers working together on sonething would have been great but there wasnt any teamwork

Well at last i wanted to see marcy of traveler program and david together not original marcy , Anyways it was good overall i guess earlier seasons not later seasons

It just makes more sense to me. Why would he want that day erased otherwise? Why not undergo better efforts of concealment? Just because “they knew he would eventually find out”? It all feels very much like a crafted surface-level ploy just deep enough to get MacLaren to stop digging further, and frankly, I don’t think it would take that much because he’d much rather believe it than the alternative. Anyways this is just a quick summary of my thoughts on the matter what do you guys think?

Hi everyone, I am trying to catch why in season 1, David's apt room is # 16, but then, in season 2 and onwards, he suddently moves to room 14. I've not found an explanation, anyone has ideas?

Watched back at the original release time, and am rewatching all episodes now. Have been watching a 2-3 episodes per week. Nearly all of this post is spoliers. I'm confused by the pandemic part of S02 Ep 4&5.

#1 Starts with the team being told they need to be innoculated to protect themselves from a sickness that is known to happen at this part of the timeline. (1a) Does not seem like every member of every team should need to be innoculated. Shouldn't the directory KNOW who dies/survives the sickness already? OR: When we fast forward to the end, we learn the director has been offline since the end of season 1. (1b) Is this information about the coming sickness just a lie from the faction? Because the director would not know who dies in that case...

#2 We finally Jenny 4514 is from the faction. DUH! Saw that coming a mile away. How is it that none of the core team members wondered (2a) where was the rest of Jenny's team? I know Marcy is still getting used to the 21st having been recently reset, but (2b) could she not have tested the eye drops to discover their addictive nature?

#3 Assuming it was the faction that sends a messenger back to Philip to modify his existing knowledge of the known disease to the new form there is no cure for?

#4 How is it that Jenny 4514 duped Doctor Derek D-13 into helping? How did Derek not wonder why she it traveling alone. Kind of a repeat of question 2a.

#5 Other general question not related to any specific episode. If travelers can only travel once, how do we account for the very large numerical gap between Trevor 0115 and the rest of the team: Philip 3326, Carly 3465, Maclaren 3468, Marcy 3569? I recall Trevor's backstory being him being older, and very sick in the future, but if all your sending back is the consciouses of the mind, he could have been sent while he was still young.

It seems that the majority of my rewatches are spent picking apart the shows, and the giant plot holes, instead of just enjoying the show.

This is not the case, with Travelers. I really am blown away by the writing.

[This is an interpretation, not what was in the works or a clear and intentional message done by the creators (or was it ?)]

I've watched the show a few times now as it is one of the best sci-fi shows of all time in my opinion.

As pretty much everyone around here, I desperately crave for more seasons or a reboot.

But after I watched it the last time, an idea occured to me.

What if "Traveller program ver. 2" is us, the spectators ?

I mean, the message of the show is clear : we need to act now for our future. Be careful of our environment and do not take for Granted (pun intended) everything we have as it all can quite quickly disappear. I love how we can read between the lines of the story and sometimes stumble upon some scenes that focus on "the little things" ("I have pigs !", the bear/dog, etc ...)

So it made me think, what if the final message, the "goodbye" kinda scene was to say "you now know. You are the Traveller Program v2"

What do you think ?

https://preview.redd.it/38kufiwzl6wd1.png?width=2850&format=png&auto=webp&s=a5a8d671aee0f343a73e2404536deebbd68f7f7d

He's Squid in the new Penguin TV show

I've just started watching the show and am about half way through season two and really enjoying it my only annoyance is Jeffrey Jr because why is that kid always freaking crying almost every scene that kid is in hes crying it's so irritating I don't really understand the purpose of having the baby just cry like is he unsettled? Does he know that Carlys not his real mom hence the crying? It's just really annoying and irritating on my eardrums other wise a really enjoyable watch looking forward to watching the rest of this season and next.

Why Marcy shoot herself instead 001 ?

Why did Philip retain his hosts heroin addiction while Marcy was seemingly cured of the mental handicap? It doesn’t really make sense to me that one brain would keep certain features while another is seemingly cured/fully replaced? I don’t know if this is explained later, or was something that was just written to make the characters more interesting, but it seems a little silly to me.

I just finished the show for the first time!!! I’m so sad its over😭 I really got so attached to some of the characters, Marcy, David, Carly, Phillip.

The vision Phillip had in the last episode of David and Marcy’s other futures pained me so much.

But you guys know what else pained me - when Marcy and Yates both said “nuke-ular” explosion lol. Its just my personal bitch eating crackers

In the end, I’m sad its over and I’m going to be perusing this sub for similar show recommendations.

I am blown away, and desperately want a Season 4, which I know we will never get. The deaths of David and Marcy hit me hard, so I was happy to see them be reunited. Did Grant die in 9/11, or was it stopped?

Don't get me wrong, I love the one we got. But there's a lot of potential for it to be an anthology series like the Criminal series.

The premise is definitely compatible with that format and the Travelers program obviously being a world-wide initiative just begs the question, why hasn't it happened yet? The show is critically acclaimed and the main reason it got cancelled was because it was a Netflix show.

Ok, so I was kinda disappointed to be honest. After a point it feels like the writers don't even recognize the margin of their own creation. We are talking about an AI beyond our comprehension, near, if not exactly, at what we call a singularity today. And we still have people who are in doubt about it to the point where they form a new group to take it down because they think it won't succeed. My question is, if such a machine can't succeed, what makes you think that you have more chances at succeeding yourself with so incomprehensibly less thinking capabilities than that thing?

Also, the fact that the characters have had so many years of training about their hosts and some seem like they can't even handle their emotions? I understand that maybe the future doesn't have that much info about the life of a host so someone can't be trained perfectly but here we see them full on ignoring the mission of saving the world just because of an explosion of anger due to random injustices. They constantly mention protocols blah blah and literally follow none of them at the end.

Aside from these, it makes no sense that they only go to a host before the person dies so they don't interfere much with the timeline. If not making thousands of people live longer than they were expected to live -while as it seems like the travelers can't even be trained properly to play the host's role in their life- is not a significant interference with the timeline, I don't know what is.

I have to say though that the actors were amazing, switching between so many different personalities is a serious skill and they all just nailed it. Also huge props to the whole team that made the sets, music etc these were really good tbh, congrats to them.

My main problem is the story itself. It feels like the show tries to explore the concept of AI along with the human vs machine combined with time travel paradoxes. This already is too much and it clearly seems that the writers don't even understand the complications of it. If such an AI was ever made, the most important thing we'd have to understand is that under no circumstances should we think a human can form a better solution to something than it will. It feels like there was so much potential to truly explore these ideas and see how the story would unfold but the show just follows a generic path that just cannot keep up with the sheer complexity of the world it creates, at least in my opinion.

I know I’m late to the party, loved the show through my first watch and I tried to catch up on what I didn’t get on here, but just a couple things I wasn’t sure on/missed on my watch/would be cool

1. why right before 9/11 for 0001? Was it a “you’re going to die anyway so it’s a good time to test the program”? Did McLaren going back before 9/11 reset the earliest a traveler could go back to (I.e. getting a TELL for someone that could stop 9/11?), or is his trip back in time immaterial to the ability to send a traveler, despite the opening of “try 2?”

2. how does a traveler go to a 2nd host? Like Marcy blanked but was the same number, and grace/trevor though have inhabited multiple bodies- do you have to die as one traveler to go to a new host? Could hall have just gotten a new host for the final fight? Like is that all up to the director’s discretion?

3. most shows it would be filler, but I would have loved a holiday episode here, to really hammer home the struggles of adapting to 21st century culture. McLaren showing up to ugly sweater day at the FBI? Carly having to spend the day with Jeff’s family? Marcy having no idea David’s Jewish (if true?) Philip looking for long-lost relatives in the 21st? The possibilities are endless!

Incredible show, and love the dialogue on the sub here

Also... Interesting how S2:E5 shows what happened in 2020.

I am honestly so pissed off at The Director for letting David die like that. After grabbing a nuclear core with his bare hands to prevent a nuclear explosion that killed thousands, The Director just abandoned him. He was such a selfless person and it literally broke my heart. I am now a member of The Faction.

Hey Guys! I just watched the Pilot and the first 3 episodes and to be honest, it doesn’t seem like it’s picking up for me :( . I came in with the idea that this would be similar to fantastical shows that I watched like the Witcher, Locke & Key, Magicians, Sandman, Shadow & Bone.. Hopefully y’all get where I’m going with this. My question for you guys is does it ever get to that element? I’m getting the vibe that this show is more like Law & Order. Tell me this (them being from the future) isn’t the only fantastical element we get.

EDIT: Shoutouts to you guys for informing me much about this show. I really appreciate y’all’s opinions and letting me know whether this would be a show that i would enjoy! I actually just learned that this is a sci-fi show and not a fantasy one! Based on some of the replies I’ve been told to give it to the first season. Again, thank yall so much, I really appreciate the kind word and the background of the show!! 🙏

What a fantastic show! I absolutely adored the characters, my mind is blown. There's so many things that I liked and didn't like (in a good way)

I was intrigued infuriated and frustrated by they all too realistic issues and obstacles that kept popping up from other people. I adored the character so much even the ones that I didn't like. Everything about the show just had me going. Could totally watch them for another couple Seasons but...

I feel so bad for Marcy who didn't get to see that they found a solution. So to be fair! Nobody else knew that there was a solution either they all got to live out there rest of their existence in that timeline with bombs heading towards them.

I had a mix of feelings when he left cat standing on the cliff. Both wonderful good for him Vibes and annoyance and sadness at what they could have had...

At first I was really happy for Marcy and David but then I realized that it's not my marcy. But I'm happy for David.. and for that Marcy.

I wish Grace had gotten a kiss...

10 outta 10

I’m aware no season 4 and I’m ok with that but I can’t find people talking about this show, or fan art, or literally anything except here. Does anyone who any bit of fan anything (art, fiction, etc) so I can live more then just rewatching. I love this show, the characters are well built -tho a few plot holes I never understand- and overall amazing. I see a lot of people are on this sub so it should exist. Am I just not looking hard enough? Please if anyone has info I would love it.

As for the plot holes, I can only think of one at the moment but how was Marcy able to talk ok? It was still the host brain meaning she would take on any effect of the body right? Like Philip and his addictions and grant with some memories left. It didn’t affect the show too much but didn’t make sense. We also never truly see a
Seizure but it’s said they happen a lot. So really how often cause I feel like it would’ve happened at least once during a mission or something.

Thank you anyone who ends up having info.

I just finished watching this show for the first time, and I really liked it. Overall, I thought it had a really intriguing, well executed premise, and it got me thinking about it.

There is a saying that the best bad guys believe what they are doing is right, and they have sound reasons for what they are doing. There is also another saying about how a good story should show the bad guys doing bad things so it is clear they are the bad guys. Travelers excels at both of these.

You see 001 and The Faction doing horrific things—kidnapping and torturing people, performing experiments on them, destroying people’s lives, killing people by the dozens and by the thousands. They are clearly the bad guys.

And yet, when 001 monologues about why he is doing what he is doing, I can’t help but agree with him. He is an awful human being, but he is right that humanity should not have turned itself over to be ruled by a machine, however benevolent or well-intentioned. And, he is right that The Traveler program is unethical, despite The Director’s attempts to run it in an ethical way.

The show makes it clear that The Director’s interference in the past via the Traveler program is making things worse, not better. It causes the rise of The Faction. It results in the invention of technology in the 21st that nearly causes a bigger cataclysm than Helios. It destroys lives in the 21st, such as David’s, Marcy’s, and Kathryn’s. Every time, The Director recomputes and runs new missions in what seems like the vain hope that it will perfect the timeline, but I really got the feeling that the Traveler program was a terrible idea that was destined to fail.

The show also concludes, or at least strongly hints, that the Traveler program was a mistake. Carly says that despite the awful conditions and the precariousness of life in the future, she and her family were happy, and that she regrets going to the past. Grant attempts to stop the entire program before it starts because of the mess they made of things. And, despite this, The Director seems like it is going to keep trying until it gets it right.

The show had me questioning the entire concept of the Traveler program. The purpose is to “fix” the timeline, but in the end, the timeline is what it is. The idea that it is “broken” is a value judgement, and so is whether or not the program has “fixed“ it. This judgement is executed by an algorithm running in a machine that is essentially experimenting on humanity. I found myself agreeing with The Faction that, for better or worse, the timeline should play out with humans in charge and without interference.

The show presents The Travelers as the protagonists and 001 and The Faction as the antagonists. By the end of the show, I concluded that we were rooting for the bad guys the entire time. The Travelers and The Director were well intentioned, but that doesn’t make them good. Both sides thought they were right. Both sides saw themselves as the good guys. Come to think of it, maybe there wasn’t even a good side and a bad side, but just sides, both good in their own way, and both bad in their own way.

Despite the brutality of their methods, by the end of the show, I found myself agreeing with The Faction and questioning the wisdom and benevolence of The Director.

After I rewatched Travelers again for the 4th or 5th time recently, I thought about similar shows in the same vein. Honestly, the only thing I can think of is Continuum. It's a little bit different. Not an ensemble, different kind of premise, but still scratches the itch in the same time travel kind of way. Well, this was a few months ago and at the time, Continuum wasn't available on any streaming service. I was sad and didn't want to pay out of pocket to rent or buy it. Cue my surprise when yesterday it was recommended to me on Prime.

I just finished the first episode and the actress that plays the antisocial hacker/guidance counselor on Travelers is in this episode so I'm sure there's more cross over in the future.

sorry im a bit slow when it comes to remembering things but like what is his deal?? Why was he doing all these experiments on people and how did he know abt the travelers and want them to expose themselves

Yeah I know that in the future, 001 is the leader of the faction, but the 001 that we see in the show comes from a future where the faction didn’t exist so that particular version of 001 isn’t connected to the faction at all until they start working together in season 3.

Towards the end of season 1 Grace made it sound like the faction was the ones kidnapping and torturing the traveler teams, but then we saw 001 doing that, so who was it?

The way the characters talk about it just makes it sound like a nuclear bomb but then why would they call it something different? Also MacLaren said the Rothski device was invented 22 years after season 3 so it has to be different, so what is it exactly?