/r/ProtoIndoEuropean
News, articles and discussion relating to Proto-Indo-European (PIE), the ancient language from which modern Indo-European languages descend, and also Proto-Indo-European people, and their culture, origins and history.
News, articles and discussion relating to Proto-Indo-European (PIE), the ancient language from which modern Indo-European languages descend, and also Proto-Indo-European people, and their culture, origins and history.
Resources:
Other subreddits you may like:
Does this sidebar need an addition or correction? Tell us here
/r/ProtoIndoEuropean
"Gwiøwiānā Hnŕtrbqā, após tom heitr deh Sämämëxei, ghe Kolsnkwāei, yos twe widmi qahwai tosmi mondhēyoi ruhesi, twe lubhēyō. toyesmos wokws tuhesoskwe hmoi cēr bhuht swādyōs."
/ɡʷiɵu̯iäːnäː ˈhnr̩tr̩bqäː. äˈpɔs̠ tɔm ʔɛi̯tr̩ dɛʔ sæmæmɤhɛi̯. ɡʰɛ kɔls̠nkʷäː. i̯ɔs̠ tu̯ɛ u̯idmi qähwäi̯ tɔs̠mi mɔndʰɛːi̯ɔi̯ ruhɛs̠i. tu̯ɛ lubʰɛːi̯ɔː... tɔi̯ɛs̠mɔs̠ u̯ɔkʷs̠ tuhɛs̠os̠kʷɛ əmɔi̯ kʲɛːr bʰuht su̯äːdi̯ɔs̠.../
Viviana Norrback, since that travel to Finland, specifically Helsinki, where I saw you in that bar in that open-air museum, I've been coveting you. By your voice and gaze my heart sweetened.
It'd be anachronistic because Ice Age is set circa 18,000 B.C., predating PIE by thousands of years, but it'd be more accurate than any modern language dub for obvious reasons. I want to hear your opinions!
Well, it looks like most of us would like it to be. Thanks to everyone who voted!
It'd be VERY hard to pull off, but worth it!
Well, it looks like most of us would like to. I can see why-PIE is not only an incredibly ancient language spoken some 7,000 years ago but also a very beautiful language worth bringing back. Thanks to everyone who voted!
TIL that William Jones established these four similar pairs of names as evidence for the existence of the Indo-European religion.
Janus/Ganesha
Saturn/Satyavrata
Pan/Pavan
Jove/Jehova
That last one is real interesting: Zev(Zeus) > Siv(Shiva) > Jove(Jupiter) > Jahve(Jehova/Yahweh)
Why are these no longer considered accurate by modern scholars?
Also, what other superficially similar deity names did he equate across Eurasia?
You will probably tell me something obvious but I am not seeing the resemblance right now. Thank you for any insight.
PS I'm not managing superscripts but hopefully you know what I mean
They both mean "to measure", and the wiktionary pages for each have a link to the other under the section "See More" with no elaboration. Also, I know the 1 is supposed to be subscript, but I can't do that on my keyboard.
For the ProtoIndoEuropean reconstruction project, how much of the language has been reconstructed? Are there any phonetic dictionaries or phrase books that have compiled the known meanings in a booklet?
I know we have no actual texts, but i wondered if we have any speculations on what type of letters/alphabet PIE may have used? We managed to hypothesise about PIE based on examining related languages, so i wondered if anyone had done something similar with the actual letters/alphabet that PIE could have used?
I know due to the mitanni it is known that indo aryans likley had presence on the pontic steppe and that there are substrams of indo aryan in central asian languagues like in the suggesting indo aryan presence in central asia predating irannian migration. However I have heard nothing of indo aryan presence eastward in siberia or china, if indo aryan tribe were pushed back by west irannic and east irannic tribes migration from the steppe could the wusun have represented a hold out that migrated eastward towards siberia, mongolia and west china? I know at peast beckwith suggests this is there any linguistic, archeological or genetic evidence for this?
How come Demeter's burning of a child at eleusis is so similar to Isis burning the child in byblos? Is this some sort of common motif?
Is it possible to learn this reconstructed language preferable in the form of an online course or book? Also is it possible to speak Proto-Indo-European?
This is an outline of my personal interpretation of a modern version of PIE religion.
“Reconstruction” might be too strong of a word given how many speculative decisions were made to fill in inevitable gaps. It’s also based on a post-laryngeal Indo-European language that I just prefer aesthetically. Nevertheless, I would love to know people’s thoughts.
I also want to preemptively express that this project is in no way associated with racist, bigoted, or other ideological hatred.
SÉNĀ SWEDHĀ
Deities, Spirits, and Heroes
Néres (Demigods, Heroes, and other Spirits) → nera, nóras, neros, anḗr, nā́, nēr, αναρ
Myths
Cosmology and Ethics
Holy Days
Ritual
Im searching for ideas what would *h₂ŕ̥tḱos be If it still would be present through the two fowl shifts in the German language?
Is Deep Ancestors: Practicing the Religion of the Proto-Indo-Europeans by Ceisiwr Serith any good
Are there any platforms that provide lessons/courses on this language/analyzing and understanding it? I already have a firm grip on almost all sub-european languages covering Hellenic, Baltic, Scandinavian, Germanic, Latin and Slavic and I would like to give a try on their even more ancient bases. Preferably, if there's a platform that is free it would be appreciated but I don't mind paying a subscription. Thanks in advance.
From what I've gathered regarding the Proto-IndoEuropean "divine conflict", there used to be two groups, the Hasuras "Lords" and the Dwyes "Gods". Then, some equivalent to a massive social clash occurred, translating into the myth of these two groups fighting eachother (Aesir and Vanir, Olympians and Titans, Ahuras and Daevas, Devas and Asuras, ect).
What it's never explained though, is why there were two groups. What made the Hasuras and Dwyes different from eachother? Was it their closeness with human? What they represented and teached?
What differentiated Lords and Gods?
As far as I understand it, all verbs in Proto-Indo-European have perfective, imperfective, and stative forms. My question is twofold: is my understanding accurate and, if so, how would one translate the three forms of a verb into English, assuming that the root means 'punch?'
I found descendants of this name in Proto-Germanic and Proto-Celtic (Þeudōrīks and Toutorīxs), meaning this is is likely only from Western PIE, but it's still fun to think about. This name would be the ancestor of the names Derek, Dirk, Terry, Dietrich, Theodoric and Tudor.
plehwerkerd.
pleh₁ = the root of pleasure, literally meaning to be full.
wer = the root of verse, verb, and word.
kerd = the root of the word for heart, specifically cardiac through classical greek.
e,g. i feel/am plewerkerd.
I would like to know the plural for words in PIE. (Dakru = dakrus or something of the sort)
In A45 (2000), Stefan Arvidsson, in his Aryan Idols, wrote the following summary of William Jones’ article “On the Gods of Greece, Italy, and India” (171A/1784):
Which Arvidsson says is where the first Greek + Latin + Indian word-reconstruct of theoretical PIE *diéus *ph₂tḗr term, a combination of: Διας (Zeus) Πατερ (Pater), in Greek, Deus-Piter (Jupiter), in Latin, and Dyaus (द्यौष्) Pita (पितृ), in Sanskrit, was done.
However, I’ve been shortly reading Jones’s article, who seems to first mention Jupiter and Divespetir (or Diues-Petir) on page 248:
but I can’t find what page he does a “word reconstruct”?
Thus, I’m asking if anyone knows who exactly did the first *diéus *ph₂tḗr word reconstruct, and also when the letter accents or IPA phonetics were first used, and when the * was first used to mean “reconstructed“, if it was not Jones who did this?
References
I noticed some verbs can turn into nouns, like *bher- (to bear) to *bhēreh² (that which is carrying). How does it work and is it possible to turn a conjugated verb into a noun (e.g.: *sekw- "to say" to *sēkwesieh², "what you say")? For example, is it correct to say something like h²oyu kwid sēkwesiāmsekwesiómsekwesimn¹ kwersi, "you never did what you say" (where *h²oyu kwid is an idiom meaning "(not) ever (in your life))?
¹I thought the -ós and the -mn suffixes could work as well
A question.
In Bali the word for Lake is Danau. It's an Indonesian and Malay word.
These lakes are sacred to the Hindu water Goddess Danu and water and goddesses like Danu in Ireland and the Danube River.
Danu is clearly indoeuropean but every online etymology I'm seeing for Danau has it as "Proto-Malayic *danaw, from Proto-Malayo-Polynesian *danaw, from Proto-Austronesian *danaw (“lake”)."
Does anyone have a take on this? These are clearly related. Is there a strong reason to think it's Austronesian?
Thank you
How accurate is this reconstruction of Article 1 of the UDHR?
Nerding out over Indo-European etymology and trying to get to the bottom of this.
According to Wiktionary (idk how reliable it is for PIE stuff), the Indic word 'अर्थ' - which has many meanings, but primary among them meaning or purpose - comes from the Proto-Indo-Iranian *Hártʰam (“matter, object, purpose”). If you click the link to the latter, it's supposed to come from the Proto-Indo-European *h₁er-tHo-, which itself is said to come from *h₁er- (“to arrive, get somewhere”.
However, if you go for the link to *h₁er- itself, the only meaning that's given is 'earth'. Indeed, if you go to the entry for 'earth' on Wiktionary and follow it back, it is said to come from *h₁er-.
Now to add to the confusion, on Paleolexicon, *h₁er- is said to mean 'goat' - https://www.palaeolexicon.com/Word/Show/19683 - which doesn't seem entirely implausible, given the word 'hircine'.
What gives?