Okay so I am skipping around the show and rewatching a couple episodes I really enjoyed and I went from It Will All Be Painfully Clear Soon Enough right to Facing Darkness Is Kinda My Thing. In the first one we actually get to see Landons subconscious actually manifested and we got some funny insight into his thoughts. Mostly about hope lol. We watch hope take a journey through Josies subconscious, and heck, even saw into the necromancers (Kinda). What I want to know is if hope's subconscious was turned into a golem, what would it say, or or if the other charecters took a walk through her subconscious, what would they see, or feel, what damage would they discover below the surface and would that help them understand her better. Is her no humanity self just chilling there or what? I mean we kinda saw her subconscious manifested as landon when she used the crystal, but that was to solve a problem and it was acting as landon so it wasnt her own. What do you think it would look like and how do you think each charecter would react to it?

I wish that landon stayed dead the first time. Then we would watch hope struggle and see how she handles her grief and how that effects her relationships with her friends like lizzie and josie wanting to be there for her but she pushes everyone away. We can explore how having these new friends helps her deal with it easier that when her parents died and she had no one. And rafael and her could bond over their trauma of landons death, help eachother, and then fall in love. He would be a better boyfriend sine hes not as vulnerable as landon was and she didnt have to worry about him as much or risk everything for him. He also could give her the oppertunity to be vunrable and express emotions and be the weak one for a minute instead of always having to be strong and brave to save everyone else. And she can help him open up and not push things down by giving him someone to talk too. They would develop more as charectors and we would have more plot instead of just saving landon. Rafael wouldnt just be landons best friend or the damaged wolf who lot his girlfriend, it would make him his own person. How could explore her power without constantly worriying about when her human (at the time) lover is going to leave her. Look, Im not hating on handon here. I LOVE handon i think they are adorable and I love the dynamic of the strongest creature ever to exist getting giddy over a teenage boy! And the forbidden love because he is the son of malivore was just perfection.i just think that from a chareter growth perspective and a storyline perspetive this wouldv made more sense. Thoughts?

Because werefolf and witch are both passed down through bloodlines, when a werewolf and a witch have a kid, in theory that kid would be both, right? And since witches and wolves are both "naturally occuring speices" or as natural as they can get according to the witches, nature shouldnt have a problem with it. Its never mentioned or discussed in the show, but it seems possible with all the rules we know about the universe. If you dont think its possible, then do you think they would be just a witch until they activate their curse and then there ust a werewolf? Or all one species and none of the other? Let me know your theories.

Hello there!

I started to watch Legacies with my girlfriend while simultaneously trying to find a world in which we can play DnD together. Once I realized this world would be a perfect setting for a new DnD player and the serial nature of the show is so fitting for episodic DnD storylines.

My question is about all the other lore in this universe. I haven't seen the Vampire Diaries, The Originals, and we are only on season 2 of Legacies. I am afraid of starting this adventure, then something like the school burns down, or Malivore is a friend, not a foe and my campaign won't jive well with the canon in the Vampire Diaries.

Do you all see any reason why I can't create new students, new characters, actual teachers etc and plop a DnD character that saves the school or saves the town?

So in legacies they mention some of the classes students have to take like intro to magical history, Advanced Alchemical Studies and your bloodline and you. But, the one that im wondering about is origin of the speices. Basically they teach about how vampires and werefolves (maybe withes idrk) were created. But, how vampires were created would really be all about the mikalsons, obviously. So would hope take that lass? I mean she personally knows the mikalson family, and no class could teach her anything she didnt already know. And as we learnt in the originals, the hollow created the werewolves, and hope is all too familiar with the hollow. So would Alaric still make her take a class to talk about HER family and the reason they died, or not. added to that, would the leassons on the mikelson family teach about hope too, or talk about her? I mean I know when she was Hope "Marshell" they prob didnt but do they now that everyone knows? Anyway just tell me your thoughts.

Edit: Okay so most people are saying that its like math or science or spanish (Great analogy) but I was seeing it as more of a related arts class that everyone has to take a course on but its only one year. I understand she should still learn about her family in the classes, but I dont think she should have to take a class on them and then the thing that is the reason they are dead (Hollow). I was thinking more along the lines of, why should she have to take a class and a quiz on the hollow when she not only met the hollow, but it took over her body, seperated her family, and ended up killing her parents (her mom indirectly, but if not for the hollow hope would never have had to kidnap her). I just think its wrong that she has to relive ALL of that for no reason since she CLEARLY has knowlage of it. Ya know? It is a lot of resurfacing trauma that the show has explained she never properly moved on from. I also think it would make her feel more alone that these people everyone learns about as monsters are her family and they died because of her and no one understands what she does about them. And its her families lives and deaths and student are treating it like nothing more than a grade and probably joking about it and saying hurtful things. I dont think she would be able to handle that and that she would break and hurt someone in class lol, or at least thats probably as low as alaric thinks of her so I doubt he would let her take it even if she wanted too.

What character of TVD-TO must have appear in Legacies? And in what season/episode?

I think Bonnie

This is weird theory but i think it could work, if a werewolf and a gemini witch would have a child than the kid could and would be siphonor and if they drink human Elenas or Hopes blood and die than they would be a hybrid and a heretic since siphonors can be both so they would be a tribrid. Boom another tribrid. What do you guys think?

Episodes included : Death Keep Knocking On My Door, There's a World Where Your Dreams Came True, The Boy Who Still Has a Lot of Good to Do, Let's Just Finish the Dance

Season 1 is probably the best season of Legacies and has the right amout of character developpment and relationships dynamic. Let's see what those episodes have to offer and why the other seasons of Legacies didn't work :

Death Keep Knocking On My Door : This episode explores the mind of Hope and her past trauma. The whole season, Hope's main storyline is that she needs to learn how to connect with people and move on from her past trauma. Here, Hope try to do a lot of things she tried to do in The Originals : she makes decisions without permission, and think she can do all things her way. But she gets punished at the end, because her plan failed. I feel like Hope in the next seasons is so headstrong and doesn't listen to others people and VERY rarely learn from her lesson (actually not at all, even when she lost her humanity, it's feels like there's no consequences and she's even condescendng to Lizzie afterwards, and Lizzie give her right, like no, sis, she's not). In this episode she kinda find closure with her whole father thing, but still gets punished for her behavior. And also, the episode gave really good material for Danielle Rose Russell, especially in the scene with Alaric, who himself still dealing with the events of last episode with Jo. It's actually good characterization. And also, have you noticed that no one talk about Landon, not even Hope and we survived ? Like, I almost forget that was a thing.

There's a World Where Your Dreams Came True : Like a lot of the episodes of the show and storylines, this episode is clearly inspired by The Wish, from Buffy The Vampire Slayer, which was an excellent use of the "What If" trope. While not achieving the high of the Buffy's episode, this episode is really great for Lizzie's character. This episode gives a new depth to Lizzie's rivalry with Hope, which was gonna be repetitive, if this was drag to long. We saw the whole selfishness of Lizzie and Jenny Boyd made a really good job with her break down where she learns that Josie is dead. It's also bring up the Merge thing and the tone wasn't childish, they really put the effort to make it look really serious. Again, Landon wasn't there and things worked just fine (No Landon slander but damn, so many stuff in the last few seasons revolved around him).

The Boy Who Still Has a Lot of Good to Do : A really good centric MG episode and gives up inch into his past, his whole character doesn't revolve Lizzie, he has actual fears, family and identity crisis. Surprisingly, I found the episode to really well-handled the religion subject with MG's father and Quincy's acting was alright and I'm sure he could have done more if the writers have give him some good material afterwards. Landon made a mistake with dragging MG into this but that what makes a good character. He was just trying to do the right thing, especially after he, himself, had trouble with his own past family, like girl yes, good characterization, i'm here for it. And Hope saving MG's life, just show Hope's selfless side and I think the point of Legacies from the jump, the first sentence, was to show the difference between Hope and her family's legacy, that why I kinda disagree with people saying that Hope sacrificing everybody for Landon in the next seasons was in character. Season 1 Hope wasn't like that, and she was still dealing with loss. That was just the writers causing conflict and drama and try to built an epic romance, but it didn't work. Landon becoming a Phoenix was really impressive and a good twist.

Let's Just Finish The Dance : Here, Hope is still dealing with the fact that she almost lost Landon, but it's not just about Landon, it's about her fears to loose somebody else she cares about, especially that, at this point, Hope was just starting to open up for real to other people (others than Alaric). This all take place on the Mystic Falls ball, which brings nostalgia to everybody who watched TVD. We see Hope bonding over Lizzien without forgetting Josie's issues or walking over MG's little adventure of the last episode, with his mom coming back. Roman's coming back also bring back bad memories for Hope, and allows her to still follow her path this season, which is healing from her past wounds. Lizzie offering Caroline's dress to Hope, was a beautiful callback and the scene where Hope cry and breakdown in Lizzie's arm was so well-done, I rewatch it often, because it's real depth and comes from everything she's been trough not only because of Landon's drama (because I've been rewatching Legacies and the only times Hope cries, it's because of Landon, except when she tells to Alaric her secret in the very beginning of season 2 and when she gets her humanity back in season 4). Even Landon's side storyline about him feeling not special is intersting to see and his scene with Penelope too.

What do you thing about those episodes ? And the others seasons ?

Like, they love to throw the Super Squad everywhere in this show but the dynamic wasn't it. I rewatched the first episode of season 4 and that the first time they actually talked just the two without the others since.... I don't even remember. And the end, where Hope and Lizzie are talking, it's the first time since season 1, where their conversation doesn't turn around to be about Landon. In the episode "Screw Endgame" in season 2, Hope asked her about her visions about Sebastian, and then they die and I thought that in the next scene, we would see them talking about that but no, the subject is again about the whole Landon-Josie thing. I think this episode's purpose was to prove that the super squad matters to Hope, so that when she loose her humanity, that would be actually impactful. Her speech at the end of the episode before the Christmas episode in season 2 about how she misssed the Super Squad, I was like "Girl, what and who did you miss about it" and the rest of th season, we don't see her actually reconnect with them (if she even connect with them in the first season). In Buffy The Vampire Slayer, when Buffy comes back to Sunnydale, she still grieving the death of Angel, but she still try to reconnect with her friends and parents, and it feels organic. She try to get her life together at school again. We don't see Hope do that. In the episode "I couldn't have done it without you", I was waiting to see her journey in school but girl, she was literally a side character in this episode and the only episode where she sees her having a meaningful scene with one of her friends, was the scene between her and Josie. Also, the characters are not fleshed out, so it's more feels like side characters with extra lines. The first episode of season 4 could've open a lot of storylines for the characters : We could've seen Kaleb struggle with his past and we also could've seen how he was turned, we could've explored MG's desire to be a leader and how it contrast with Hope.... But no, the characters seems static and feels pale compared to the duo of Hope and Lizzie doing their thing in this season. Even subtle, the premiere of the seasons opens a lot of storylines for the side characters in Buffy ( I'm compared it to Buffy because Brett Matthews worked for Joss Whedon on Buffy and Angel and clearly wanted it to be a Buffy fantasy, without taking in consideration what make Buffy so impactful in the first place) like season 3 premiere, despite the gang being seperated from Buffy this episode, we see their own life : Willow is leading the team, asserting her newfound confidence this season and also, in later seasons, her fear to be Buffy's sidekick and also we see that she still practicing magic, Xander is still in a relationship with Cordelia and Giles try to find meaning in his life as a Watcher after Buffy run away, something that would be relevent when he's gonna loose his place as a Watcher and part of his arc in the whole season 4. Even Joyce gets to have her moment where we see her POV to Buffy's lifestyle and how she's gonna accept her slayer life trough the season. Legacies's characters doesn't have the same kind of depth and their connections doesn't feel real and their interactions are REALLY brief. The interaction between Hope and MG proved that they can have actual geniune friendship chemistry between them, too bad we don't see them interact again except of the really dumb attempt at bringing her humanity back.

The writers clearly try to replicate the same vibes as the Scooby-Gang in Buffy The Vampire Slayer but missed the mark (like a lot of attempt in the show).

What do you think ?

I haven't seen a lot of Legacies in close detail but I think that the Mikaelson's being thrown in the Malivore would have been a nice gap between The Originals and Legacies and dealt with the issue of the Actors.

Could have had the Mikaelson thrown in there, Hope could know. I could explain the connection between Hope and Malivore.

Just a random idea?

Okay so, who else was thinking and making up strategies of ways to defeat the gods while watching the squad strategize their own way of winning? Maybe it was only me but... I was wondering why they didn't also get help from the remaining Mikaelson family members, including the one and only hybrid of his kind Marcel??

They could have been useful since the Mikaelson's are impervious to anything but white oak and that weapon is no more, they would have been part of my plan. Hope is their blood so they would have done anything to help her.

What were your thoughts if you have some i would like to hear it.

It look like a lot of peoples don't like the gods storyline, but I honestly like it. I wish it was introduced sooner and tat they used them more.

I absolutely hate 95% of those cringey monsters ( like most peoples I guess ). I understand that the show needed to introduce something new... After all, we already got the first immortals, the oldest and most powerful vampires, the most powerful witches of all times... of course we needed some new original antagonists. But... a walking puddle sending gremlins and unicorns kill the main characters... dear lord...

The gods would be perfect as main antagonist through the whole show because for one, they look human so it's not absolutely cringe. And also, there is a near infinite number of gods / demi-gods with VERY various level of powers... So it wouldn't be crazy to have low level gods that could be handled by most characters, mid level gods that could be a pain in the ass to deal with and high level gods who would be insanely powerful and the big bads.

One other reasons the gods could be a good thing as antagonist is because of Hope. Clearly, the writters struggled with her. One minute she is insanely impressive, the other... she just dissapoint by acting all weak. With gods as her enemies, either would be a win-win I think. Hope beat a god ? Damn ! Hope loose to a god ? It's still impressive that it take a litteral god to beat her.

I think even Landon would be more interesting if he was a demi-god, even maybe the son of Ken... instead of being the son of a mudman and his sole purpose is to be a vessel...

What's the best and the worst season of Legacies? (I'm starting watching), and what are the best and worst episodes?

When Ken died, how come the curse of the ferryman didn’t break & Landon was stuck being the ferryman?

I know it's a very meaningless story, but what would you think if it were possible for a white oak dryad to exist? I imagine that if dryads weren't such fragile monsters this plot in Legacies would be interesting. I could imagine a more macabre version or even a red oak dryad going after Hope Mikaelson?, or who knows, maybe a hybrid dryad? I'm starting to think that there were Malivore monsters that had very poorly used plots.

are the character plot lines and interpersonal relationships worth me watching if I don't like any of the premise of the show (supernatural school 🤢 and a shittier supernatural style monster of the week concept 🤡), don't like hope as a main character in the originals and I didn't enjoy the last 2 seasons of either original show?

I've watched episode 1 and I like landon, as well as his relationship with rafael. I HATED THE COMPELLING THE HUMAN AWAY THING THOUGH OMG GET ME THE FUCK OUT OF HERE THEY WERE FAMILY HOW FUCKING DARE YOU DO THAT JULIE PLEC

I'm rewatching the show right now and the character developpment is... non-existent. I feel like there's a lot of potential but none of that were used...At least after season 1 for sure :

Hope Mikealson : So... Well, what can I say. In season 1, her journey was intersting. It was about her trying to fit in, to have friends and to not act like a loner... Was it always done in the better way ? No but was it still compelling and interesting ? Yes. Landon was part of this journey, just like Josie, Lizzie, Alaric and Rafael. We had her father-daughter dynamic with Alaric, frenemy relationship with Lizzie and this blossom friendship with Josie. We got to see her deal with her trauma in episode like "Death Keep Knocking On My Door" or the Miss Mystic falls episode. But after that... Well, like Danielle said, saving Landon during nearly 3 seasons is not a journey or a storyline. In season 2, we see her coming back. We should have see her coming back, try to get back to her friends, to fit in again etc... In Buffy The Vampire Slayer (because it's very clear that Brett try to make his own Buffy fantasy), when Buffy comes back we see her struggling to get her life back to her friends, parents and school, despite still grieving the loss of Angel. For Hope we got to see her being moopy about Landon and Josie during 6 episodes... Like girl, please. We should have seen her trying to have new friend with Ethan and Maya, who were just... dropped. In the episode "Screw Endgame", we see her get interested into Lizzie's stroyline with Sebastien, before both of them were killed and in the scene after, we STILL talking about this whole Josie and Landon storyline like... please. And the scene in "It Will All Be Painfully Clear Soon Enough", when Hope says to Josie all the thing she missed at school, it's doesn't hit cause like, girl what do you miss, the Super Squad ? We barely saw her interact with any of them in season 1 or in this season. Class ? Girl, when where you ever enjoying yourself with the other students or wanted to be near any of them. In the episode "I Couldn't Have Done This Without You", Hope act like a side character, like we barely see her journey when she get back, that shoud have been our main center but no. We should have explored the Alyssa's character more and see how Hope and her contrasts with each other. The whole Landon/Hope relationship should have been in the background this season. Even in her subconcious, she still talking about LANDON, like damn it, she can't even be her own character. The only 2 episodes where she does not try to save LAndon or something is when she try to help Josie when she became Dark Will... uh, dark Josie, in the last few episodes of season 2. Even when she tried to save the Saltzman, somehow, that turns out to be a choice between them and LANDON. In season 3... Season 3 was something, and not in a good sense. We see her only worries about LAndon, putting others people on the line because of LAndon, brooding about LAndon, having to choose between LAndon and something else ! GIRL, we're tired, TIRED. Hope literally have no other things going on this season except her relationship with Landon. Landon should have stayed dead, we should have seen how Hope dealt with it and explore her relationship with new girl Cleo and see her interact more with Alaric after one of his daughter left. Also her chemistry with the Super Squad... is really not giving. They barely interact and when they do, it's for talking about how to stop Malivore and to save LAndon. Even her interactions with Lizzie are... well, it's not the topic of the conversation is it. Season 4 seems to have enough with Malivore, finally and ends up this storyline by making Hope an no-humanity tribrid. Very good, finally something else to do with her character, just don't make her remind us every five seconds that she has no humanity, like, girl we know, we saw you. The episode where everybody try to reach to her is... well not moving at all because we didn't see any connections between any of them. In Buffy, or even shows like Smallville, which also tell the story of an unique person, who have to connect to the world, that would have been moving cause we had emotionnal connections. The Mikealsons episode is mostly moving because we saw The Originals, bacause two of my friends made the mistake to watch only Legacies without TVD or TO and didn't really how this family meant so much to Hope and why it was such an important episode for Hope's journey.

The others characters are gonna be REALLY SHORT

Lizzie : best character, no questions, she's the only one with actual depth, character developpment and that the writers take of outside of romantic relationships.

Josie : Love Josie in season 1, liked her arc in season 2, even tho, it felt kinda rush and overwhelmed by everything else and the dark Josie arc didn't have the same emotional impact on me like it did for Dark Willow, Void Stiles in Teen Wolf or even Queen Evil Phoebe in Charmed . Her arc in season 3 make sense but wasn't well-made for me and overshadow by her relationship Finch...Anyway and in season 4, well she was packed to leave.

MG: TO THIS DAY, WE STILL DON'T KNOW who turned him. His arc in season 1 of Ripper and with his mother being part of the Triad could have been interesting to expend in the further seasons but no. He spends his time pinning over Lizzie or having really dull side storylines, that doesn't connect with the main one.

Kaleb : the actor did a good job by making Kaleb fun to watch, and I hope he gets more works in other projects but his character was really not it in Legacies. His grey visions of life could have been explore trough the show but no... He was just there and his death in season 4 really didn't hit me, much less after I knew he was coming back.

Jed : NO COMMENTS;

Landon : Die and then come back to life is not character developpment. I appreciate the character and actor but it's like he writers didn't have any idea of how to treat the character, despite having him being the show's center point.

So , you what do you think ?

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Episode 5 season 4, the sweather Lizzie wear are the exact same color of the non-binary flag??? Probably not intentional but I still wanna headcanon her as non-binary now

There’s so many duos I wish we had more of but I’m rewatch The Originals and I really wish we got more of Vincent and Hope. I wanna start this off by saying I love Vincent’s character, one of my top 5s in the show easy. One of my favorite things about him is that he never took the fact Hope was a Mikaleson out on her or use it against her. I mean he saved her in season 4 even knowing it meant bringing the family back to New Orleans after just getting them out. Then in season 5 when the prophecy’s about Hope was coming to light he defended Hope, saying he knew her and she was just a child. Then in legacies he was only mentioned (sadly) but he helped her get her humanity back on. He’s such an underrated character that’s so special to the show and me. I just wish we had more of them. Honestly I had a lot of wishes for season 5 that didn’t happened lol. Anyways sorry for the rant but I had to get that off my chest. If you had any duos you wished you got to see more of or even at all let me know, I’d love to discuss it.

I have painfully watched the show up to Season 4 Ep11 and I have seen all of TVD and The Originals, but this show.... Tbh I have mainly watched because I liked the Originals concept so much and I do like hopes character but it shocked me that you barely see Caroline or Rebekah or Kol or hell even Freya even if it was just a chat on the phone to ask about a spell or something etc etc etc and the whole show about monsters yeh okay fine, but omg Malivore does my head in, there just seems to be no teeth it's just argghhh how can it go from originals to this....

I would choose Ben

What would you do to make legacies plot better / the show In general I know the show wasn’t the best ( for a sequel from tvd ) but what would you have done to make the show better / get more views etc certain plot lines you would’ve added in certain ones you would remove

so basically last time i checked heretics in tvd don't need daylight rings, they quite literally set the town ablaze in plain daylight, with no ring and no burning. but i read somewhere on this subreddit that lizzie had a ring on her finger post-transition and she prepared for being a heretic or something, which would contradict the point of day walking for hybrids in tvdu, so if somebody could please enlighten me i'd really appreciate it

Hello friends! I'm making a post of tribrid Hope, Dark Josie and Heretic Lizzie.

Is there any epic quotes from the show you recommend?

The fact mg let and befriended a human was one of the biggest parts in legacies for me, what about yous?

I loved season 2 of legacies especially that episode when Hope is beating Ryan’s ass in Malivores headquarters. That was the pinnacle of the show (and some really good writing, editing, etc)

I think there are alot of songs that i know that remind me of TVDU but mainly vampire by Olivia Rodrego the most because the show being about vampires and that stuff

Does anybody genuinely enjoy the show? I see a lot of hate on it here. I love the show and think it has a lot of funny moments and light hearted ones as well.

One of the reasons why I love the show is because , we already had serious shows (TVD & TO) and to now have a show that was funky and wild but also actually feeling like we got to see the teens BE teens.(even while facing supernatural aspects)

I know people are disappointed that it’s not like TVD or TO. But I still think it’s great. If you take out any expectations from the show and watch it I think people would enjoy it.

Mg and Caleb are one of my favorites and bring a lot of comedy to the show. As well as other characters. I saw someone say if you look at it as a comedy you might enjoy it more.

How could I forget my favorite the episode that made me laugh so hard. S2 E16 when Caleb and Jed were singing at the funeral and kept trying to one up each other 😂😂😂. The show had so many funny moments like that which made me fall in love with it.

The necromancer was hilarious as well. The plot of him and Chad was a favorite of mine as well. And when he was the referee when Jo and hope were fighting. Had me laughing my a** off 😂.

This show genuinely was funny and had so many great sub plots.

Some of my favorite episodes are S2 E8 S3 E3