1-1-1. No front-page posts relating to the US hiring process

I don’t know anything about the field but I’m becoming more curious as I’m exploring different careers. I love night shifts at most jobs. Are the night shifts less stressful or more stressful if so?

I have been going through the assessment process for a trainee ATC position with Airservices Australia, and the next steps would be the assessment center visit and medical. I've found some general info that there are colourblind ATC's, and if you fail the initial colourblind testing, that you get given another test to specifically see whether or not your colourblindness would impact the job, and if you pass that you are fine, or that you will likely get placed in enroute where colour isn't used.

Can anyone confirm this? I do have mild colourblindness which practically wouldn't affect my actual ability to perceive the difference of colours

Last Wednesday's accident was not the fault of any individual, rather, it was an overworked, under invested, over scrutinized NAS that is responsible for performing flawlessly every day. You guys are what makes the airspace run safely and efficiently, we can not be anymore indebted to the hardworking professional controllers than if you guys flew the planes as well.

From an airline pilot that see's the congestion and ridiculous volume flowing through the NAS, thank you for everything you guys do. I have been saved by you guys more times than I care to admit. Your profession is one that can never be outsourced, never substituted. It must be manned by competent professionals that every one of you are.

That controller in DCA was put in an impossible situation and they should be comforted. They did not cause that accident, the elected officials that have chosen to underfund the FAA, the nextgen improvements, the staffing issues and the FAA apparatus did. The blood is on their hands. And the comments that came out of that sewer of a mouth of that excuse of a man that somehow wound up on Pennsylvania avenue are disgusting. If no one else says this: you guys have made one pilot's life safer. And for that I say:

Thank you.

Used to play Tracon II back in the 90’s in high school and fired it up again because of all the recent news. Y’all are freaking super heroes. This is stressful as hell! It’s still fun though. Thanks for all the work you do keeping us safe!

Anyone been at RTF and the government shut down while you were there? Wondering how they handle it. Send everyone home?

Curious if anyone works at fields in or around Delaware? Specifically, lower DE/MD/VA area.

Trying to research how one would look into jobs for navaid / ils techs but I never see anything for spots in these areas.

Thanks.

Hello,

I am posting on behalf of my partner who is supposed to be starting ATC training next month. He hasn’t received his certificate from Transport Canada yet and has about a week before his offer is potentially rescinded.

I guess I’m just wondering if anyone has been in this position before? Is there anything he can do?

It’s a life changing opportunity and I’d hate to see him lose it after making it this far. I understand that special exceptions won’t be made for him but just wanted to make sure we aren’t leaving any stone unturned.

Thank you in advance for any advice :)

Hi guys so I have my FEAST training in Maastricht and was doing some research on it before I went and did it. While doing so I was looking at salary etc etc. Can anyone give a rough estimate of how much they're making being an ATC? I have heard so many different figures varying from the states to europe. If anyone is currently working at maastricht, then even better.

n/t

I’m a ramp controller at a class B. Some of us have been talking about the potential of unionizing. Do we have the ability to fall under NATCA’s purview, given we are non-fed and non-CTO? Several of my co workers worked with NATCA in the FAA and said by and large it was a good union, and we are mulling over the idea of unionization given recent events.

Ciao, ho presentato da poco la candidatura per il corso di formazione ATC. Sono stato convocato ad effettuare la prova di FEAST 1 alla fine del mese, alla quale mi sto preparando (riguardo la parte logica) sul sito ufficiale di eurocontrol, mentre per inglese non ho trovato piattaforme per esercitarmi. Vorrei chiedere a qualcuno che ha già fatto le prove di inglese del FEAST 1, se saprebbe indirizzarmi perlomeno sul tipo di domande che potrei trovare e se c'è un modo per prepararmi. Grazie mille, buona giornata.

From a FB post:

I’m posting this on my personal page because some coward on the retired air traffic controller page apparently didn’t like it and removed it:

I’ve read so much crap on here in the last few days, I’ve finally had enough. It’s time for me to put my two cents in. President Trump was 100% right on everything he said about DEI in the FAA. I’ve been screaming about it for 30 years.

Given a choice, do you want a Doctor who got 100% the first time he took the test or a Doctor who failed the test 12 times and got 70.5% on the 13th try? They’re both certified doctors. DEI initiatives, or whatever they were called years ago, put far too many of the 70.5% types, of all demographics, into ATC, both in the controller ranks and management. Combine all of that with a reporting system that doesn’t hold anyone accountable and an agency that doesn’t seem to ever learn anything from mistakes, and you have 1000+ near misses. Those 1000+ near misses should’ve been a giant warning, but no one wanted to do anything about it. We ran out of luck. I posted the below about a week ago as a comment in response to President Trump’s initiative to end DEI in ATC, it’s still true:

“It’s a cool day here in south Florida, so I have time to give my take on DEI within FAA air traffic control. It’s a little rambling, so I apologize for that. If you disagree, feel free to let me have it. It’s just my opinion. I was an FAA air traffic controller and ATC supervisor for 28 years(MFD, CAK, CLE supervisor at CAK and ZOB). What I’m writing applies to some, certainly not all, FAA employees. Over my ATC career, I had the privilege of working with and being managed by some of the most skilled and dedicated people anyone could ever ask for.

Since I was hired in 1984, there was always a push for diversity, but the real push for diversity started in the 90s with a program called “Train to Succeed”. The gist of the program was instead of washing out and removing those who couldn’t do the job after a normal amount of training, they would train them for eternity until they could barely get by. Training hours were established for those who showed an aptitude for air traffic control. What the train to succeed program did was allow for those who had a very low aptitude for air traffic control to eventually become certified controllers. After the program was establish, it didn’t just apply to those who fell into DEI categories. The new lower standards then applied to everyone.

On the management and administrative side of ATC, all promotions in the FAA had to be approved by regional DEI offices and meet diversity criteria. It resulted in MANY being passed over for promotions by those with less skill, abilities and experience. Again, once standards were lowered for DEI purposes, they stayed low for everyone.

Then, in 1998, the Clinton administration worked with the union to establish a pay system which was very top-heavy. It left little room for pay incentive to move into management positions. The union also made it punitive for their bargaining unit members to move into any supervisory or administrative positions by taking away the seniority of those who would accept temporary management positions or those who would decide management wasn’t for them and return to the bargaining unit. This seniority was used for bidding of schedule, vacation time and certain committees or work assignments. With ATC being a 24/7 business, schedules were very important to everyone. Before these program started, supervisory positions were well sought-after and provided an incentive to work hard and improve oneself. After these programs, there were times when supervisory positions only had one or two applicants and sometimes no applicants. In many cases, those applicants just wanted to get away from working traffic.

All of this resulted in controllers who barely squeaked by in their training, and couldn’t do the day to day job without assistance, with the help of DEI programs, becoming supervisors or managers. Once made management, at times, they were the least experienced or knowledgeable people in the operation, often not skilled enough to provide support, oversight, assistance, or performance improvement recommendations to those doing the actual job. For fear of having their own inabilities exposed, many would just go along to get along with the employees, allowing substandard performance. This sort of incompetence permeated all levels of FAA management.

When controller standards were lowered, the union(NATCA), doing what unions do, then demand that all of their members only had to meet the new low standard. The union even went as far as eliminating cash performance awards for exceptional controllers’ yearly performance ratings and replacing them with a pass-fail program that very few or none ever failed.

Then, under the Obama administration, in an effort to further improve diversity numbers, the requirements for being hired for an air traffic control position were again reduced. Instead of requiring a college degree, the initial hiring was based on a biographical questionnaire given to applicants. It’s my understanding that some certain applicants were actually given the proper answers for the questionnaire, so they can be placed at the top of the hiring list.

Just when we thought it couldn’t get any worse, a program called the “safety culture” was started. Prior to this, when a controller would have errors or mistakes, they were removed from the operation, retrained or in the case of multiple safety lapses, they were relocated to easier work environments. Errors were tracked and reported. After the safety culture was put in place, there was really no penalty for controller errors and the tracking of errors generally stopped.

All of the above combined to create a controller workforce that only had to meet the minimum standard any DEI hire had to meet, while not being held accountable for errors due to a non-punitive error reporting system, while being protected by the union who had their way with weak FAA management, all while being managed by many of the the least skilled employees who just wanted to get away from working traffic.

As a controller, a supervisor and a commercial pilot, I feel DEI in ATC was a recipe for aviation disaster. Fortunately, throughout all of this, automation was improving and providing safety safeguards in the system to keep the traveling public safe. I wouldn’t want to think what would’ve become of the system without those safeguards in place.

It’s my opinion DEI has no place in our government or any safety related occupation. DEI and the results of DEI were a big part of several of my career moves, or lack there of, and my decision to retire in 2012, at the age of 49.”

I’m mad and broken hearted for the loss of life. I’m sad that the system I worked in for so many years has become such a mess. We were doing the wrong things for the wrong reasons, for years. I thank God we finally have a president who is trying to change that, and I don’t give a damn who it pisses off.

In height of all that’s happening right now, what are the options that the public has to advocate for ATCs? I’ve seen a few post about contacting our local member of congress. I like that idea but can we all gather here and unitedly agree that that’s what we’ll do? It’ll hit hard and we’ll be heard more if we all do it in close proximity (most on the same day.)

Let this post be the one where we all stand together and agree to contact our state’s member of congress, letting them know how important our ATCs are as part of public safety. Also, it should be a constant thing! Let’s do it everyday!! Push for this, be annoying if need be- we cannot allow what’s happening to destroy our ATCs work lives as they know it. And in turn, would cause way more fatalities in the skies.

I’ll be attaching the link to finding your members of congress below. Just put in your address in the box and it’ll show you who they are, address, and phone number. If anyone has a premade email that they could attach in the comment so we can all send the same thing, that’d also be very helpful!

But all, please please let us stand together and do this. Let’s fight this together!

https://www.congress.gov/members/find-your-member

https://youtu.be/SboL2uNWBDo

A very foggy morning with Sunrays in the background.

The career I probably want the most out of any is being an air traffic controller. What should I do to prepare myself at for the job my age (I am 15 years old)?

What’s going on in the contract ATC world? Did one of the companies go under? A bunch of the towers seem to be switching to different companies.

It’ll be like putting a wet band-aid on gunshot wound BUT it’ll be instant.

We have a pool of certified controllers that we aren’t utilizing. Let’s reassign the most important responsibilities of an OS to the ATM and suspend the rest. Make most, if not all, OSs go back to the boards. Count them as manning for scheduling, which will reduce OT and fatigue.

Some facilities would go from roughly 80% staffed to 100% staffed. The OSs can go back to being supervisors as we certify more people.

Also, there’s no reason the application process should take as long as it does. There has to be a way to significantly reduce the time it takes from hitting submit on USA jobs to getting to your facility.

This morning the new Secretary of Transportation, Sean Duffy, was on CNN doing an interview. During this interview (at roughly 9:08 am ET), he went over the staffing issues, but he also brought up the "antiquated" air traffic control systems and stated that a lot of the systems that are being used date back to WW2; and that we have to update the system. He then went on to saying that the technology was invented here, but it's not being used here.

My questions today are:

1. What air traffic control systems would you like to see the FAA acquire that are not already utilized in the National Airspace System?
2. What other modernization/changes would you like to see?

Shortly after the crash was reported, there were some posts here of the scope images of both aircraft from what appeared to be an ATC terminal. I remember distinctly playing it back several times and observing that both aircraft converged at 300’ AGL. Again, data tags for both aircraft indicate 300’ at collision. That video is no longer around, is it? I am now hearing that they have conflicting data on the Blackhawk’s altitude at collision. Seems bizarre to me.

First I want to say that I've been following the NTSB media briefings. They are the experts. What I have here is speculation and will wait for more from the NTSB before throwing more slices of swiss cheese on the wall.

One of the things that piqued my interest yesterday was when NTSB board member Todd Inman and IIC Brice Banning commented that the ADS-B altitude data from the CRJ was reported at 325ft +/-25ft yet the data on the radar scope (which I presume is in reference to the STARS and/or ASDE-X display) showed PAT25 at 200ft. I believe STARS and ASDE-X use a 3 digit number to display altitude in the datablock so I suspect STARS/ASDE-X displayed PAT25's altitude at 002.

Why would the displays in the cab show PAT25 at an altitude of 200ft when the collision occurred at approx 325ft? A look at the METAR data the day of the crash shows the baro pressure increase in the hours leading up to the crash.

https://www.ogimet.com/display_metars2.php?lang=en&lugar=Kdca&tipo=ALL&ord=REV&nil=SI&fmt=html&ano=2025&mes=01&day=29&hora=16&anof=2025&mesf=01&dayf=30&horaf=03&minf=59&send=send

METAR Altimeter Data for the hours leading up to the crash

Will wait for NTSB but I suspect the altimeter in the Sikorsky may have been set at say 29.80 inHg while the actual air pressure was 29.90 inHg at the time of the crash. A difference of 0.10 altimeter setting results in a 100ft difference in altimeter reading.

The part I'm not so sure of is if STARS/ASDE-X display corrected vs uncorrected baro alt. Do military aircraft report corrected or uncorrected altitude? Do the surveillance systems correct the altitude? Regardless, I suspect the helicopter pilots may have thought they were at at lower than actual altitude based on the altimeter and a stale altimeter setting.

I'm looking for free resources or websites that provide an overlay of SkyVector aeronautical charts with real-time ADS-B data.

I've already tried ADS-B Exchange but unfortunately, it seems to only cover the USA. Are there any other websites or services that offer global coverage or at least coverage for other regions?

I was listening to a podcast and there was a suggestion for specific flow of information that no one had taught me before:

• approach N12345 10 miles from <airport> request.
• N12345 approach
• 12345 flight following to ABC, type is C17, request 6500
• 12345 squwk 1234, altimeter 3001

...

In this precise order. I've never given my position in the first call up (except to tower when entering Delta). Also should i say the word "request" or "vfr request" at the beginning or is that redundant?

EDIT: thanks all for the replies. It sounds like the above callup is generally preferred by STARS equipped facilities, and centers, especially when working multiple sectors.

Forgot to mention that this is for the U.S. The European Direction Finding feature sounds totally awesome which correlates the VHF transmission with the target!

Hey everyone!

My CFI friend recently got a call with no caller ID telling him he had a possible pilot deviation for busting airspace and asked for his cert # and birthday.

He was busy and said he would call back (he can’t because no caller ID). He can’t recall what it might be about.

Could this be some kind of scam or prank? Would center call from a blocked number?

Any insight helps. Thanks!

Hello!

I am a recent Computer Science technologies graduate and NavCanada's Technical Services Trainee job posting caught my eye.

I am trying to better understand what the position entails. Is this an IT position? The job position mentions multiple times the importance of customer service skills, but I am unsure as to how that fits in maintaining aviation systems.

I also see that the job posting requires a driver's license. Is there a particular reason for that other than wanting their employee to not rely on public transport to get to work on time?

Thank you!

So I've held off a bit on posting this mostly because my ATM revealed he lurks on the ATC subreddits, but I've had a few drinks and don't give a fuck anymore.

Did anyone else have their ATM pull them into a meeting after the DCA crash and tell them that they need to do better? Like how the fuck can an ATM shit on his controllers at every turn. I wasn't even involved in that incident and I feel like he blamed me for it.

Just ranting against management I guess but god damn. I don't how these people just feel the need to blame controllers for everything that happens...

Hey guys im currently 19 and wanting to be a ATC in the next couple of years. Im my country, the airspace is administraded by NAV. To get in you need 180 credits of any university degree and to go through an extensive multi phase program with tests and interviews.

Theres somewhere around 1 to 2 thousand applicants each year and only 20 to 30 get in. Base sallary starts at 122k a year (very high considering the minimum wage here is less than 14.5k)

If i get in, can i later move to another country like france, switzerland or even the US and Canada without having to go through the same entry process? How are the salaries in those countries compared to here?