I'm 30M, and have never been a drinker. But I just found this sub recently, due to the events I'm about to describe. I can't really go into the exact reasons why, as this post is going to be long enough as is, but the tl;dr of it is: I've had alcohol both before (against my will) and after hitting the drinking age, and I've just never been able to enjoy the taste or feeling of it.

Anyway, everyone close to me in my life has always known me as "the guy who doesn't drink", and I've never been given any real grief or flack over it. I've occasionally seen posts on Facebook and other social media about how not drinking makes people feel oppressed or shunned or whatever, and I've never been able to relate. Until recently.

Last week, I took a 5-day cruise with a bunch of family members (my parents, and 6 members of my mom's side of the family). Before that, I hadn't been on a cruise since 2012, when I was 17. So this was my first cruise since I've been an adult/legally able to drink. Before I go any further, I want to get this out of the way because I know I'm going to sound whiny: I had a great time. But being on a cruise for the first time since becoming an adult, I noticed something that I hadn't noticed on the cruises I took as a kid: they really, really push their alcohol. Now, I don't blame them for this, as I'm sure that's how they make their money. But it can really make for an awkward time if you don't care for drinking yourself, but still want to enjoy your time on the ship. Especially if you're around your family, who are most definitely drinkers.

I've always known my parents as just occasional drinkers. If they ever did drink, it was almost always at home. My dad would very rarely have maybe one drink at a restaurant on rare occasions, and that's it. As for the rest of my family who were on the boat, I'm not really around them enough to know how much they drink in their everyday lives. But oh god, they really let loose on the ship.

Again, I don't want to sound too much like a prude, because it was a vacation after all. But my dad got drunk on the first day, right before the ship had even left the original port. In 30 years, I had never seen my parents drunk before, and I really didn't want the first time to be on a massive boat surrounded by thousands of strangers.

For the whole week, I honestly felt distant from my family, as all of them (except for me) got drunk at least once. It also led to discussions about why I don't drink, and some of my family actually laughed at me when I explained. I just kinda took it, for the most part. Like I said, I've been through this before, and while I've gotten some comments and such from friends and coworkers, I've still never felt pressured or shammed for not drinking.

But 2 things in particular happened that really irked me. One was on the last night. I won't get into the details because it doesn't have anything to do with alcohol, but my dad, while drunk, made a comment about my personal life to my cousins that I really didn't appreciate. I tried not to get too mad, because I knew he wouldn't have said it if he was sober (or if he did, he would've been a lot more tactful about it), but I can't help but think of a quote I once heard: "A drunk man's words are a sober man's thoughts". I probably paraphrased that, but you know what I mean.

The other thing was earlier in the week, when a few of us were going through the itinerary/schedule on the app, and we came across something that had some weird codename (can't remember exactly what) that was scheduled for all the days. Trying to figure out what it was, someone looked it up on their phone: it was a thing that apparently most if not all cruise lines schedule for recovering alcoholics, basically like a support group. My family apparently thought the mere idea of this was hilarious, with one of my cousins even saying (again, paraphrasing) "Why on Earth would anyone like that ever get on a cruise ship? I mean, there's alcohol everywhere!" I didn't say anything, because it was a vacation and I didn't want to bring down the mood, but that comment kinda made me upset. I'm not a recovering alcoholic, but I still really enjoyed being on the cruise because of all the other things offered, and her comment made it sound like people who had overcome potentially-deadly addictions to alcohol didn't deserve to have the same experience.

Like I said, I apologize for how whiny this was. Despite all of that, I really did have fun during the week. But I still came away with the feeling that maybe I shouldn't cruise again, since it's not really a place for a non-drinker. I hope I do get to eventually, though...just maybe not with my extended family.

I raise my glass of Martinellis to your clear-headed awesomeness!

Hi. I've just found this subreddit and I wanted to say that I am a 40-year-old man who never tried alcohol, never smoke and never did drugs. I get in shape by eating nutricious, homemade food and no Coke, no junk food, no candies and I practice intermitent fasting.

Has anyone noticed any shifting sentiments around you regarding the consumption of alcohol? Specifically in the direction of limiting it or cutting it out entirely.

I ask because I may be in a bubble, but I like to listen to health-related videos. I noticed there are quite a few videos with millions of views that have come out within the last few years about alcohol. These videos go in depth and thoroughly discredit any positive health claims around alcohol and give an extensive list of its harms. Rhonda Patrick, Renaissance Periodization, Dr Dray, and Andrew Huberman come to mind.

I’m wondering if this has had any effect, especially around communities that are health and fitness oriented.

Some suggestions I've heard is:

It doesn't agree with my medication

I'm a recovering alcoholic

Only ten days sober, but looking for support where I can. I would have never done this without this amazing change in my life

They don't consider the social pressure and its constant promotion of alcohol (even partially hiding the negative effects on health), nor the higher cases of people developing anxiety and depression and looking for alcohol to cope with it, that study isn't even representative enough:

https://www.sciencealert.com/your-iq-in-high-school-can-predict-your-alcohol-use-later-in-life

I was drinking 12 to 16 units a week roughly, and then I had a holiday with heavy drinking then stopped. My anxiety hasn't been good and my physical stress symptoms are worse. Anyone else experience this before things got better?

I try so, so hard and put a lot of effort into being supportive, caring, and understanding of people. But I really lose patience with friends who make plans with me, only to get the "I'm way too hungover to make it by the time we agreed (or at all)" text in the morning. I try to stay kind about it to them directly, but deep down I'm really, really irritated.

It's not like you got food poisoning. It's not like you caught the flu. You had control over this. You are literally capable of planning your own hangover, so the NIGHT BEFORE, you chose to fuck up the plans we had for WEEKS? And this is the second time!

What's the phrase the kids say these days? "Miss me with that shit"? I'm so annoyed. It annoys me even when it's not hangovers, but hangovers as the reason for missing our plans makes me want to scream.

(I'll get over it, I just needed one person I could kvetch to.)

Basically prior to becoming fully teetotal I bought some spirits and wine for special occasions but obviously haven't opened them and hopefully never will

How do you all suggest I get rid of thrm it does seem a bit of a waste pouring thrm down thr sink or throwing them in the bin.

But at the same time I don't really wanna gift them and add to the societal problems of alcohol acceptance or potentially even mske someone a Alcoholic.

Do you chaps and chapettes have any other ideas?

Don’t think I need to go into too much detail about the ridicule nondrinkers face in society.  Nondrinkers aren’t welcome in drinking spaces, except most of society is a drinking space, and drinking has woven its way into just about every event and hobby - baseball games, movies, nightly dinners, rec sports beer leagues, paint and sips, the list goes on.  The only places nondrinkers are truly welcome are third spaces, which are rare, low-quality, and not given any kind of support.  It’s segregated facilities all over again, literal segregated water fountains, if you will.  Except even activities that are supposed to be alcohol-free will regularly have booze snuck in. 

The argument against judgy drinkers is always “maybe you just need to hang out with better people.”  But that’s the thing- this attitude is commonplace with all drinkers.  And I get that they can’t help it, it’s just that drinkers and nondrinkers have completely different worldviews that cannot coexist, like Muslims and Christians, cobras and mongooses, liberals and conservatives, take your pick.  Each side judging the other and claiming self-defense because the other threw the first judgy punch.  They are natural-born–enemies, two completely separate classes of society. Nondrinkers even have their own glass ceiling- they earn 10-14% less than drinkers (https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s12122-006-1031-y).

There’s plenty of evidence on Reddit to back it up, just read one of the million dating posts on here asking if being a nondrinker is a dealbreaker, and the responses range from ridicule and hate at worst, to a respectful yes at best.  But the end results are all the same- yes, being a nondrinker is one of the biggest red flags a person can have, and nondrinkers and drinkers are incompatible in relationships.  With that, the only place you won’t find that judginess is with fellow nondrinkers in your own tribe, so you’re pretty much forced to pick from a small minority of partners at the bottom of a separate, much smaller barrel- yet another example of nondrinkers being segregated and getting the short end of the stick.

Sure you could make the argument that things like race or sexuality are real and worse because they aren’t choices, they’re things you were born with, but what about people scared off from alcohol by alcoholic parents?  They didn’t choose to be born to them.

I'm curious what response I'll get to this on the original post.

Different households have different attitudes towards alcohol with their kids/teens, and different levels of exposure.

For some, alcohol is rarely, if ever, a factor, so they don't really get exposure. Or perhaps some families treat it as taboo or forbidden, which many have said lead them to be desperate to try it and not have the experience to do it sensibly.

For some households alcohol is a wholly negative thing. Abuse, trauma, or perhaps just no care for how kids are raised with it. I feel like this either turns people way off it, or continues the cycle of abuse as the kids learn to drink that way.

Some are more in the middle. Perhaps allowing teens a drink if they're curious, doing it under supervision etc. This might include education. These families probably drink at a level considered acceptable or moderate by society.

I'm curious to hear from people about their experiences and how you think it affected your relationship with alcohol. Even if you don't fit into one of the categories above!

I'm particularly interested in those in the last category, who feel they had a sensible upbringing about it, but still ended up developing a problem with it. But all stories welcome!

Alcoholic beverages taste like ass almost 100% of the time people will pay up to look fancy to essentially drink things that taste horrible. I guess there is an argument for girly drinks but even those would be better without alcohol in them lmao idk it's just a funny thought I had. I also know people do it to be drunk as well but God with a tastes like that idk how you could drink more than half of a tall can. Ordering these drinks is like asking for the waiter to give you an entree of the kitchens trash can lol

Hi all, so as I've written. I'm in a really great transitional phase in life and looking to get more into reading as I find myself doom scrolling. I live books like Hermann Hesse's Siddhartha which have profoundly supported my growth. Do you have some to suggest? Thanks in advance!

A common thing we're told to do as nondrinkers is to grab a soda that looks alcoholic to blend in (coke could be a rum & coke, a sprite looks like a g&t, etc.)

Personally it never felt right to me, like I was giving off the wrong impression. If I fake drinking on a first date or something and I see them again, I've dug myself a hole I'll have to lie my way out of eventually.

I also don't really want people to think I drink. I can't tell you how many times I've come to like a person and then once I see them with a drink I lose all respect for them. I would hate to do that to another nondrinker, someone out there who's looking for a sober friend and sees me with my (fake) drink, unknowingly assumes I'm a drinker, and loses respect for me

Hello my fellow teetotalers! I’m really glad that I learned about this sub and know that there are plenty of people out there who share my teetotal lifestyle! I’m a 23M college student, and knowing how college has always been an environment where many take part in drinking because it’s the “fun thing to do”, I usually find myself to be the only person who never drinks. That being said, I’ve never obliged to it and I’m very proud of not giving in and continuing to stick to consuming my non-alcoholic beverages. I wanted to know if there are any college students in this sub and what your experiences are like being teetotal in a college environment.

Hey my teetotal/sober peeps. So I 25M have had a hard time finding people who share my values against drinking and smoking. How do you all do so especially in today's drinking heavy dating culture? I'm a Christian, so I'm looking for that too, but it seems impossible to find people, even filtering by that that don't drink. Any tips?

I did it. I hosted a dry birthday party. And it was no problem!

I posted here a while ago about my anxiety over doing this. In my head, people were going to be sitting around twiddling their thumbs and awkwardly not socialising if I didn't serve alcohol.

Lots of people here were encouraging and helpful. There were some naysayers, who said the party would fall flat and I'd just have to accept that people can't party without drinks.

I provided food and soft drinks. There were games, organised activities, etc. And it was great! People didn't leave early because it wasn't fun, people genuinely had a good time. Nobody even commented. My fears were unfounded.

Just wanted to share, in case it encourages anyone else who is worrying like I was. Obviously it depends on your friends, I guess mine are good ones, and not everyone is lucky enough to have that. But if you think they'll cope, go ahead and have the party you want!

Thanks to all those who encouraged me