/r/HistoricalWhatIf
For your historical what if needs!
Have you ever had a question about what would have happened if history had gone a different way? Ever wonder if a historical event had gone differently? Here's the place to ask!
Be nice!
Personal attacks, abusive language, trolling or bigotry in any form is not allowed and will be removed. No hate material, be it submissions or comments, are accepted.
No current politics or soapboxing.
Political topics are only acceptable if discussed in a historical context. Comments should discuss a historical topic, not advocate an agenda. This is entirely at the moderators' discretion.
No historical negationism or denialism.
We do not allow posts and comments about fringe hypotheses, false narratives, misunderstood or misrepresented history, genocide denial, and other disingenuous revisionism. They have proven to be magnets for those wanting to push a distortion of historic consensus. Engaging in historical negationism or denialism will result in a permanent ban. Notable examples of negationism include Holocaust denial, Armenian Genocide denial, Japanese war crime denial, and the denial of Soviet crimes.
Please keep posts to only things that are possible.
This sub is called HistoricalWhatIf for a reason. Questions like "What if Hitler used firebreathing dragons in Battle of Britain?" don't belong here. This includes time travel questions.
Provide some context for your post.
To increase both the quality of posts and the quality of responses, we ask that all posts provide at least a sentence or two of context. Describe your POD, or lay out your own hypothesis. We don't need an essay, but we do need some effort. "Title only" posts will be removed, and repeat offenders will be banned. Again, we ask this in order to raise the overall quality level of the sub, posts and responses alike.
No discussion about the past 10 years.
Self explanatory. Posts about recent, current, or future events will be removed.
Read questions charitably.
A modicum of effort is required to participate. Debating the premise of a post is allowed. Dismissing the subject entirely without explanation is not.
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/r/HistoricalWhatIf
Erwin Rommel was known for his humane treatment of locals and unwillingness to use brutal tactics against enemies, he was also very popular amongst his soldiers? I am not asking if Germany could have won Operation Barbarossa or not, I am asking what would have changed if Erwin Rommel was deployed on the eastern front?
PoDs: The Safavids adopt a more robust state structure, like the Ottomans, with stratified administration that could survive the inertia of the Shahs, preventing it's fate of collapsing out of decadence. And the Shahs after Abbas capitalize on the gains he made in Rug making and invest more into the technology of manufacturing them, leading to the Safavid empire completing proto-industrialization in the mid 18th century. And if the Ottomans were able to have a protectorate in South East Asia, let's say the Safavids copy whatever ships the Ottomans were using that they (the safavids) weren't, combined with someone adventurous in the empire, leads to the Safavids discovering Australia before the British (possibly before the dutch too).
We know that Louis with Charles de Calonne wanted to push reforms to among many remove some of church and nobility tax exemptions, abolish Gabelle and Taille tax, remove internal tariffs and establish a National Bank
Say that in 2000, Ukraine created a televised cartoon called "President Putin Hispants." The misadventures of a stupid president who always poops in his pants.
The Cartoon is a hit, and takes hold all around the world. Like literally President Putin Hispants is the new bugs bunny. Only more like poopy Elmer Fudd. But for extra exposure and to REALLY piss off the Russians, they really focus on the American audience. Hence the English name. It was the funniest translation they could find..
Lol how would Putin react to all this?
And for some reason, everyone just goes with this.
So there's this giant human chess board they meet at, and get in formation. Opening move is determined by coin toss.
The following people, literally, stand on the chess board:
Your king: This is your head of state, so if that's a woman, she still plays the position of king.
Your queen: The head of states spouse or significant other. If they are single, their closest relative. This person plays the queen regardless of gender.
The rooks: Meant to guard the king and queen, these will be a two of their bodyguards/security team.
The Bishops: If your country has bishops, two of them will be there. If not, two religious council of the most common religion in the country.
The Knights: Two generals. I don't know, they'll be riding one of those toy horse heads that come on a stick, and they pretend to gallop.
The Pawns: 8 enlisted soldiers
To capture a piece, the person walks in the necessary patern, and then gently walks the captured piece off the board, who will not resist. The capturing player then returns to their new position.
Who is commanding the pieces? The king of course. Each king is allowed one advisor from their country of the kings choice. Presumably the best chess player in the country. He or she is both a non-player and the main player. And, is also the only person on your side who is not literal, but figuritive.
This person represents your most trusted advisor. You may be inclined to go another way at times, and even your advisor isn't right all the time. But know that he's been around the block quite a few times. So, your call.
What's at stake: Your very objective:
Checkmate: You have won, or lost, and the winner gets their desires, but the principals won't be harmed and will be allowed safe exile if necessary. I don't know, Switzerland will take them if no one else will. Objective cannot be revisited for at least 500 years.
Stalemate: The status quo is maintained. Cannot be revisited for at least 50 years. Same in a forced draw, or if the two kings agree to call it a draw.
Resignation: The way most professional chess games end, when they see no realistic path forward and decide to not delay the inevitable. This is a surrender. Other side wins their objective: Same as checkmate.
Forfeit: Running out of time on the clock. Generous time will be allotted.
Of course, friendly countries don't have to do war chess with each other, and diplomacy can be attempted to avoid war chess, but if war chess is declared, you show up at the appointed time. Everyone's just going with it, remember?
But if you're doing a multi front war, you're playing multiple games at once. You and your allies, are in the tournament room. In an unbalanced match, someone's gonna be playing multiple games. (Last one standing gets the objective they and their allies pre agreed on. So in this case you can lose but still win if you have an ally who wins the chess war.)
Lol what does history look like from Korea Onward?
Whose winning what here based on chess skill and leaders ability to listen to wise council?
So it's no secret that Woodrow Wilson was an infamous racist, who allowed his cabinet to introduce segregation into the US Navy and the Federal Civil Service specifically: the Treasury Department, the Post Office, the Bureau of Engraving and Printing, the Department of the Interior, the Marine Hospital, the War Department, and the Government Printing Office. As a result separate offices, lunchrooms, and bathrooms and other facilities were created for white and black workers.
Now short of the obvious (Wilson loosing the election of 1912), and the far-fetched (Wilson having a radical change of heart) is there anyway to prevent the introduction of Segregation in the Federal Civil Service and the US Navy, on the grounds that doing so is a waste of taxpayers money and it will reduce the efficiency of the Civil Service and the Navy?
Sources:
How Woodrow Wilson Tried to Reverse Black American Progress | HISTORY
In this timeline, Jews, Christians and Muslims united their beliefs under one superior to all.
What would suggest this is that nuclear physics originates from there and there would be no migration of German-Jewish physicists to America (if anything it would be the otherway since there were Jewish quotas in america at the time)
Furthermore the treaty of versailles didn't have provision regarding nuclear weapons, so puting recourses into those would be a way Germany could increase it's military while remaining in compliance with the treaty.
Adtional Informativo
He dies in 1972
Additional information
He kills Khrushchev, Zhukov, Molotov, Bulganin, Malenkov, Kagonovich and Mikoyan ( in the coup) After that he kills: Brejnev, Gorbachev, Patolichev, Vorochilov, Konev, Rokossovsky, Buddyone, Timoshenko, Sokolov, Ustinov, Vasilevsky, Ponomarenko, Vyshinsky and Yazov
He dies in 1982 and is succeeded by Ivan Serov (1982-1990)
The Sino-Soviet split never happens
In this world would the Soviet Union survive because it was in the hands of hardliners?
That Albert Einstein declined an offer to be the President of Israel has been told to me all my life, and I never really wondered a) was it an 'offer' for the job or was he being invited to run for elections or what, and b) how Einstein's politics were different from the person who eventually took the position.
So, What If Albert Einstein was the Second President of Israel?
At some point in the cold war, I dunno let's say 1977, West Berlin says "enough of this shit" and they blow up the Berlin Wall and their troops come marching it.
An invasion to reunify as a western power.
And West Gernany never told anyone they were gonna do this. It's a surprise attack.
In our timeline, Arnold sent a messanger to deliver a letter to his contacts finalizing the deal, but the letter was intercepted.
Arnold being forewarned that the letter was being delivered to George Washington, who wasn't far away, fled, and the plot was foiled.
What if that letter never got intercepted, and, probably in a matter of weeks if not days, the British take West Point without loss?
Seen as a key US/USSR "confrontation"
I just somehow get a recording of Bobby Fischer saying "I resign."
I get to the event early, hide the recording under their table, and at a certain point in the game, I somehow activate it.
And then everyone thinks that Bobby Fischer said: "I resign" to Boris Spassky.
For those unaware, stating your resignation is common at those levels, and it is the same as check mate. You lose the game.
Other methods, like tipping over the king, can be done on accident. And offering a handshake leaves it unclear whether you're resigning or offering a draw.
But when you say: "I resign," that's all she wrote.
And they all heard him say it.
Lol what would come of that?
In OTL, the Philippines were given to the US as part of the Treaty of Paris in 1898, and the US took possession of the islands and ruled until 1946.
But what if another empire such as the British, French or German empire took the opportunity to sweep in and seize the Philippines before the Americans could take control? The British and French had territories in the area, and the Germans were trying to establish a colonial empire, so what if one of them seized the Philippines? Would the US risk a major war to get them back? Also, how would Filipino culture today be different (in OTL there is a large American influence)?
How would this impact WW2?
Would the US enter in the Axis?
Who would become president in 1965 after his death If he instaured a dictatorship?
(This os basicaly what If Japan won WW2)
The US still declared war on Germany but in 1944 after the submarine war explode a US Cruise ship.
And Dewey become president in 44.
It was decided by just one vote that the citizen Louis Capet had to be sent to the guillotine. What if the votes were different and the former King kept his head (and life) by just one vote? What would the Revolution have done with him? How the other powers would have reacted? Would Napoleon still have risen?
The first American cardinal becoming the Pope would lead to a massive shift in the perception of Catholics in America, and would also possibly change how things turn out for the Church without Pope Leo XIII not being elected at least until later, if at all. How would things have changed?
So in the OTL, the Spanish conquered the last of the Mayan Kingdoms of the Peten Basin (Ex: Tayasal) and Belize in the 16th century.
But what if the British placed the Mayan Kingdoms of these regions, under their protection? And in return they would provide logwood, mahogany, and other agricultural products? How would they develop economically, socially, and politically under British rule?
Source: