So I’ve long been curious: if we had hints trespasser (and now confirmation in veilguard) that elves were once spirits who took human form, and dwarves were once part of the Titan hive mind, when/where did humans come from?

I just noticed one interesting clue in veilguard’s regrets of the dread wolf. When Mythal urges Solas to take a physical form, Solas says “but I have no desire to live as humans, I have the fade.”

So ancient elves were familiar with humans even before the veil, when they were still taking bodies through lyrium.

Could the timeline of things in early Thedas be: titans + humans exist -> dreams shape the fade and give focus and form to spirits -> spirits begin manifesting as elves -> war with the titans -> evanuris take control and Solas rebels?

Not counting Veilguard's inconsistencies. What groups or characters might be able to defeat and imprison/kill Solas?

Imagine that the Inquisitor manages to capture Solas after searching for him for years, many have died in the process, the Inquisitor does not want to kill Solas but decides to subject him to the rite of Tranquility as punishment for his crimes... What could happen?

The Lucerni was established firmly in the Magisterium around Trespasser. A faction that wants to put a halt to basically the imperium's modus operandi will most likely meet the strongest resistance there, so I can't imagine it lasting more than 2-3 years. Do we know when exactly Maevaris was being suspended from the Magisterium and brought the Lucerni underground? I don't remember Veilguard mentioning a timeline when I spoke to Mae, and I haven't read any of the supplemental media outside of the games.

Had a thought: do you all think that the magisters that entered the black/golden city were warped/mutated/changed by ghilan'nain? Kinda makes sense why they look all fugly now.

Solas dislikes the grey wardens believing they are playing with things they don’t understand. Side note: that’s a real easy take for someone who slept through all the blights where there wasn’t some powerful wolf god to seal it away. Anyways even with his distaste I don’t understand why he isn’t more supportive of the wardens overall goals. If they killed the last archdemons then El and Ghil would die and the veil would fall anyway. A much cleaner and less risky plan than moving the gods and keeping them alive.

He’s had ten years since trespasser to make his move. That’s plenty of time to direct the wardens to the archdemons, let them kill them and basically sit on his haunches and watch it all unfold. Even if he needed the ritual to say contain the blight or help the veil fall as gently as possible he could have timed that appropriately through his massive (and MIA) spy network.

Is he just so full of hubris that he believed it had to be him? He likely believes the warden’s incapable but from his high horse he would have to see they’d make good tools to further his plans.

Side-note again: why would he attempt such a dangerous ritual when he’d been leaving hints for the inquisition to find him? He’s just asking for disaster honestly.

so, when Solas was saying it was used as a focus to channel the power of an Elvhen god, he says they were usually tied to only one god but.... could it specifically have been channeling the power of the imprisoned Evanuris?

I mean, it is a macguffin that never pops up again and is promptly replaced with another macguffin (Lyrium dagger) but could that not have been its actual purpose?

i feel like this is a more plausible explanation for its massive power and ability to damage the veil. (considering DA:V says the Evanuris are being syphoned to make the veil, which is... a writing choice, I guess) than just, building up latent magical energy like a black hole for millennia.

Flemeth (the human woman) sacrificed herself for Solus... because...?

She wanted vengeance for herself, for Mythal, and she gave up, submitted before Solus because better he has the power?

I anticipated some sort of twist, Flemeth being a trickster pulling one last trick and ending up back on her feet, fooling everyone and taking revenge on Solus.

Instead... nothing?

She just committed suicide? -The- Flemeth who turned into a Dragon to kill the only guy/gal who could stop the Fifth Blight over her Grimoire?

There's a lot of bad writing in Inqusition/Veilguard, but this... this is just laughable.

Was comparing DAO codex entries to DaTV entires and in both there seems to be an emphasis on Dumat vs the other old gods. Do we think that Dumat brings special significance? If Dirthamen and Dumat are connected, I wonder if that is important. Thoughts?

So that's my background for Veilguard and I'm trying to find an understanding of what my Rook would've been like in early life before joining Shadow Dragons.

Would an elven Mage have been given any kind of benefit in society compared to their non magical kin? I know magic is like the most important thing, but what's the norm for an Elf with magic?

Would the logical lore be that my Rook is the child of elven slaves?

Would anyone like to have an ongoing pm chat about thedas? Been excited for veil guard and wanting to talk. Let me know if these threads aren't allowed and I'll delete it.

Otherwise... hit me up if you want.

I usually side with the Mages in both Origins and 2, but in Inquisition Fiona and her band have sided with the Venatori, and imo even if they hadn't than siding with the Templars would still be the better choice. You have no idea what actually caused the Breach or the Mark at that point, and powering it up is just downright insane to me. It's the one game where I find myself agreeing so much with Cullen. Obviously, as the player, we all know it works either way, but the entire purpose of the Templars is to fight Magic. Yes, what many of them did, and do, to the Mages is horrible, but neither side are perfect. Even so, you can't blame the lower ranks like Barris for the actions of their superiors, and he is the one who sent word to Cullen in the hopes of the Herald talking some sense into his superiors.

In Origins, you need as much firepower as you can get against the Blight. Choosing the Templars over the Mages would be like nuking your own base just because of a handful of people went rogue when there's still a lot of survivors, including children, in there. You should at least try to save anyone left alive before killing everything in there.

In DA2, Meredith is outright insane. Just because some of the Mages were forced, mostly by the Templars own ever tightening restraints, into practicing Blood Magic doesn't mean you should kill them all. And in the Mage path, several of the people who turned into Abominations if you support the Templars end up perfectly fine. Yes, your own mother ends up dying to a Blood Mage, and you encounter several other Blood Mages over the course of the game. But Blood Magic is like any other magic, it's just a tool. It's the intent of the person using it that matters. If you're careful, like Merrill is, than you should be fine unless someone else intervenes.

That's also no excuse for some of the things we see the Templars doing to the Mages, including one woman who was almost killed in Act 3 just because she sheltered her cousin for one night. Not all Templars, and not all Mages, are the same. We see some of the "fugitives" are just people who wanted to see their families or, in the slightly humorous case of Emile in On The Loose, not die a virgin. There's a lot of grey here, and while the Templars do tend to go too far at times, the same can be said for the Mages.

I've got a slightly crazy idea about what they could do to try to improve relations involving pairing Templars and Mages together along with a modified version of the process through which Fenris had all that Lyrium implanted into his skin, but I'm still thinking it over. Might try putting it all together in a DAI Mage Trevelyan fanfic or something.

We established that killing Corypheus' dragon makes him mortal. Why exactly has the Inquisitor sent him into the Fade physically, granting him exactly what he wanted instead of... killing him?

Like, I was stunned for a good 5 minutes. Have I missed something?

Was that just a lame-way to potentially bring him back a 3rd time?

Another article was wondering about Flemeth and Hawk, and my question's of that nature. The Hero of Ferelden, optionally, -kills- Flemeth, and she's able to be saved by Hawk. A piece of her soul or essence endured in that amulet, which allowed her resurrection.

"Just a piece, but it's enough."

Is Flemeth that survived just a piece? Has she lost most of her power?

How do you think she feels about getting killed? There is no mention to my knowledge about her and the Hero of Ferelden in the background duking it out. For something all about vengeance she's remarkably passive.

You have a nation of blood mages with powers capable to dominate/control men/beasts/monsters. You have dragons. You have hubris, ego, and lust for power with no morality to keep mages in check. Your nation at one point worshipped dragons.

The question is simple; why nobody tried to bond dragons with magics and become dragon riders like song of ice and fire? Were there any attempts made? Why did they fail? What do we know from the lore?

We're playing D&D RPG campaign and the party's destination is Tevinter Imperium. They'll travel through the Northern Passage strait between Par Vollen and Rivain. Given the Qunari are at war with Tevinter, it is obvious they'll have a whole armada guarding their island's waters (which likely include Northern Passage)

What would they do with a human ship? Who controls the passage, Qunari or Rivain, whats the relationship between the two?

A toll would be paid or the Qunari would just blow every ship to smithereens?

So just read horrors of hormak and looked at solas’ tarot card. There should be 12 stars/thaigs and there are 12 stars what do you all think about this?

To me it seems like thaigs might have been centers of collection/concentration camps the ancient elves used to gather dwarves to do stuff.

This Might need to be a separate post but the ears of races seems interesting. Humans and dwarves are similar but elves and qunari are also similar. Seems like humans are made from dwarves and elves: shemlen: young ones/new ones. Qunari are soldiers made by Gillian’an

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F-_9KWpWoAAsu_p?format=jpg&name=medium

Hello all,

With a new game coming and many revisiting the series, I thought it would be a good time to remind folks of (or introduce them to!) the splendid lore work of /u/eravas , who has done many splendidly researched and wonderfully mad lore posts. There is a compilation they made of their posts to be seen below, explore and enjoy!

https://www.reddit.com/r/dragonage/comments/n8j48r/spoilers_all_two_archdemons_short_of_a_blight/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=mweb3x&utm_name=mweb3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button

In the Stone Prisoner questline (Shale's), you meet a man who is the son of hthe mage Wilhelm Sulzbacher. Sulzbacher has a secret mage laboratory in his cellar. So my question is was Sulzbacher an apostate? He is in the first DA novel, and seems rather unremarkable. But my understanding is the chantry doesn't let mages have families, and I doubt they'd approve of him having a secret laboratory. Did he do both of these things in secret? Furthermore, his son seems to know a little magic, yet isn't wearing circle robes and has a daughter of his own. Is he (the son) an apostate?

So was replaying dragon age 2 (favorite in the series) and i realized i retroactively had a question about Flemeth/Mythal: why does she save Hawke?

Is it solely to save her own skin through the amulet? Or does she see in Hawke a greater destiny?

Thoughts?

For myself: why Hawke specifically? There are countless refugees, why them specifically? Is it his ability to get to the Dalish clan for the rite? Makes a Merrill romance( the one I go with) seem interesting.

Would love to hear y’all’s thoughts. :)

I get that the Wilds are dangerous, but can't you just sail the coast around them?

Replaying DA1. When you go into the Kokari Wild's, one of the Warden recruits says he is scared of a Darkspawn ambush, but Alistair says that Wardens can sense Dark Spawn so to not worry, we won't get surprised. But there are a few points in the wilds where Dark Spawn literally do ambush you, just appearing out of thin air around you. So was Alistair just talking out of his ass?

I think we need to reevaluate what Solas said about no known lore connects the old gods to the Elven gods.

We see two possible at the end of the trailer

We know that Razikale, the Dragon of Mystery and Lusacan, the Dragon of Night

I have forgotten who the community associated with them

But I thought one was Dirthamen: Keeper of Secrets

As that domain matches. But I don’t recall the other

But one of them in the game play trailer has a huge head dress or thorns and that likely would have been Ghilan'nain.

This is all assuming there not more magisters of course

The one thing we truly know is that they're a shadow group who "represent those across the sea" and can make entire outposts full of Inquisition soldiers disappear to "serve a higher power" if you take Cullen's advice to ignore them. If you take Leliana's advice, you get a weird letter, some assistance, and then complete silence.

If the Inquisitor deferred to Cullen:

Three Inquisition outposts along the Nevarran border were later found abandoned, yet with no sign of a struggle or looting. A message was left in each outpost:

We hold your Inquisition in high esteem. Thedas's present troubles are great, but you have the strength to meet and conquer them. More will come. We prepare for the day and hold vigil. Do not look for your men; do not mourn them. They have given themselves of their own free will to a higher cause.

On behalf of powers across the sea,

The Executors

If the Inquisitor deferred to Leliana:

After Leliana followed up on leads concerning "those across the sea", a message was sent directly to the Inquisitor:

Compliments to your spymaster. She is a resourceful woman. Once she traced our agent to Caimen Brea, the match was ruled in her favor. Tell Sister Leliana to call off her dogs. Save them for Corypheus. We suspect also that she has gotten all she can from Ser Helmuth. A caterpillar on a leaf does not know there is a forest about him.

You will hear no more from us. Our intention was to watch, and we have seen enough. Corypheus threatens us all, and the Inquisition is Thedas's only hope for stopping him. Remember that, for the moment, we are not your enemy. As a gesture of goodwill, we share our knowledge. May it prove valuable in your coming battle.

On behalf of powers across the sea,

The Executors

They also had someone using a voice modulator and a disguise so thorough you couldn't even discern their gender or age show up in Tevinter Nights to discuss what they know of Solas. The bald egg proceeded to covertly petrify them, and then warned Charter, an Inquisition Agent, that those across the sea were dangerous. Which makes me think that they have to be formidable if Solas was terrified enough to personally intervene. It's possible that the Executors are the ones who provide us the key to killing him, maybe they once fought the Evanuris in ages past and some of the old weapons, or more modern versions, are still around. Yes, Solas said that the original Elves didn't die so easily, but given everything else he's lied about I'm taking that with an M-Class planet of salt.

Personally, I'm wondering if they aren't the original Human civilization(s). We know the Dwarves were once the more mobile immune system of the Titans and the initial seeds of their modern civilization sprouted after the Elves found them in a dead Titan. There are also a number of theories about where the Elves and Qunari came from. The former appear to be Spirits stuck in the physical world. The latter seem to be the results of a super-soldier program mixing the Dragons with someone else, maybe Elves, a program which resulted in beings with aggression that is nearly completely uncontrollable outside the Qun or certain rare circumstances.

But we still have no real concrete information about how Humanity fits into all of this. So what I'm thinking is that when Solas created the Vale he caused a disaster that went far beyond the borders of Thedas. Human fishing fleets, or exploratory expeditions, were flung across the sea and shipwrecked on the far side from their home, far enough they were presumed dead by the rescue teams.

But then the Breach, a huge hole in the Fade which caused Rifts to open all over the place, showed up, and the Executors were initially sent to investigate only to find the descendants of their lost ships. It makes sense, a civilization as advanced as Tevinter needs a foundation, even with Magic they couldn't just make it out of literal nothing inside of a century, and survivors of ships who were already prepared to setup a colony would be able to do so quickly.

Hi Everyone! I’ve had some time to do some thinking about Dragon Age and its lore, and as I struggle to get my thoughts out of my head thought I’d share some here. Rather than bore you with my preamble, here is why I’m doing this and how.

We are introduced to Kirkwall as our boat sails through the Twins, and are dropped off at the Gallows. For now, I will skip (most of) the approach, as we don’t see much of it. The monuments to the Old Gods aren’t depicted, and while we sail under several weeping figures there are at least 3 of them – so they aren’t THE Twins. This is a bummer as I have so many questions about that vista (yes, I’ve seen the concept art).

At the Gallows Courtyard we are treated to an imposing vista of many large bronze statues and a bas-relief carving [Gallows Courtyard] [Gallows Courtyard - Numbered]. The writings of Brother Genitivi states that the courtyard was designed by Tevinter Magisters not to commemorate the suffering of slaves but for “breaking the spirit of newcomers” [link]. Wonderful folks those ancient Tevinter.

Lining the left and right of the courtyard are a series of identical statues [Label 1]; emaciated individuals hoisted in the air and covering their faces in despair. Aside from the arm placement, these appear to invoke in the gamer a parallel to certain Christian imagery of a crucified Jesus [Wikipedia Discussion]. The bent knees, crossed feet, loincloth, and emaciation – I feel confident the designer was tapping into this as language to help convey the idea of suffering. (As an aside, if you’re interested in art history the evolution of how the crucifixion in iconography is a fun nerdy dive. Is he suffering, is he calm, is he euphoric? In the words of It’s Always Sunny In Philadelphia, “How bloody is this guy going to be?”).

Ahead of us, on daises flanking the entry staircase into the Gallows proper, are two mirrored scenes. On top of two daises there is what appears to be a procession [closeup]. A large figure [Statue 2] stands over five figures [3a - 3e]. In front of the stairs are three prostrate figures [4, closeup], hands covering the sides of their heads, and below each dais are two identical carved bas-relief scenes we will discuss later. Beyond the stairs the entry to the Gallows is lined with avian sculptures [5 & 6] that I don’t believe are part of the scene. So, who is in this scene, and what is it depicting?

It seems that the large figure is a Tevinter; he is wearing armor with a hood with a single head-spike emerging from beneath, with winged shoulders. He is holding what appears to be a halberd (mages staff?) in one hand and clenching his fist in another. However, when we move behind this statue we can see a second torso, wearing the same attire, but wielding an axe in each hand [Reverse Tevinter]. Is this one individual or two? Is there time progression? The duality of Tevinter magical and military might? This is a deliberate stylistic choice, but I am struggling to grasp its specific meaning, but it is definitely conveying power and intimidation. I know there are more Tevinter statues in DA:I, I wonder what comparison will show me.

Below this looming Tevinter are five smaller male figures progressively falling from standing to kneeling. My impression that this serves dual purposes. First, from a distance these are processions of despair heading into the Gallows. Second, it is the depiction of a single individual captured in a sequence of agony: first clenching his throat, falling to his knees, weeping, then finally crawling with an arm reached out for help. Figures a, b, and c are all clutching their throat – have they been forced to drink something? Perhaps this is the moment where the slave collar has been placed on their necks and they fight against it. in figure d he holds his head in disbelief and in figure e reaches out for anyone to help. In this scenario, the scene would move to the prostrate figures [4] at the base of the stairs: their will broken, the figure falls to the ground weeps.

These individuals are all bald and painfully thin; is this further depiction of suffering, or are they a specific group of people we know are very slender and are often depicted as bald. Are they elves? (As an aside, I suddenly see the pitfall of "EVERYTHING IS ELVES!")

The case that they are human

Their ears are small and not pointed. Damn.

The case that they are elves

In DA2 Qunari saw a radical overhaul, creating very distinct profiles. The elves saw a similar redesign; they became waif-like and they were given very distinct noses that form a nearly unbroken line from tip of the nose to top of the head (sort of like skinny, big-eyed, Mr. Incredibles). The statue has the same line.

If we jump games we see that the elven gods are depicted as bald in their own artwork; this is probably an artistic choice as while Ghilan’nain is described as having white hair, her mosaic is bald [Mosaic of Ghilan'nain]. In Solas’s murals every elf he paints has the same nose-forehead configuration and the non-freed elves appear to be bald [Removal of the Vallaslin]

So I took another look (and wished I had a free-look mode). I compared the ears of the kneeling statue [Image], and one of the weeping statues [Image]to the bearded statues in front of the chantry [Image], as well as Aveline (since Carver is dead, and Bethany and Isabella have covered ears) [Image]. These ears are really different [Image]. These aren’t the fully akimbo elven ears we know and love, but they are not the same as the others, sort of angular and kind of elfy. (An intrusive thought: are these ears docked?)

Using these conventions, we can look at the bas-relief sculpture at the base of the dais [Number 5]. Lines of individuals walk in front of a mountain range towards the stairs of the Gallows. They are looking into the air, hands covering their ears, appearing to wail into the air. Unlike the bronze statues, these individuals are not wearing slave collars. The individuals are bald, with the distinctive nose-forehead that may indicate they are elves. An aside, do we see an artistic trend in Tevinter of depicting all slaves with these elf-y characteristics to quickly identify individuals as slaves (suggesting the terms have become indistinguishable)? Or is the origin of Tevinter culture so intrinsically linked to their relationship with the elves that they have incorporated some of their artistic symbols? Perhaps there is something to be discovered about Tevinter identity and ethnogenesis [link] in the future. How much did the Tevinter learn from the elves? How much is their empire aspiring not to replace the Elven Empire but be the Elven Empire.

We know Kirkwall lies beneath the Vimmark mountain range, and Sundermount, and it stands to reason that these are individuals walking along the mountains into the Gallows. Though not depicted in the carving, the Gallows looms at the center of this piece in the form of the actual entrance. Are these the elves who survived the battle at Sundermount [Merill tells us this] being herded towards generations of servitude? The despair is understandable. I think the statuary is telling the story of throwing down the elves, enslaving them, and destroying their people and culture, leaving them weeping and prostrate before Tevinter might. Gross.

We can use this mural to begin to ask further questions about the accepted history of Kirkwall. The figures are walking, and not being sailed, so is this scene before Kirkwall was formally founded (as Emerius)? That would explain all the figures being elves. If so, what was already here? We know the elves were defending their ancestors in Uthenera. Why were the Uthenera placed here, did some other power draw the elves? What drew the Tevinter, was it just to fight a final bastion of elves, or was there more? Why did the Tevinter begin digging before they discovered valuable minerals? Were the Tevinter the first to dig? The first to thin the veil?

Wow, that’s a lot to think about – and I’m not even out of the Gallows Courtyard yet! We’ll look at the other statues and the overall architecture and layout of the courtyard soon!

Elves: All we truly know is that they are intrinsically tied to the Fade and once had an empire that ruled a good chunk of Thedas. At the top of their society were former Generals and Kings who'd come to be worshipped as Gods, the Evanuris. Basically the original Magisters. Solas states that this came from the aftermath of a war, but he doesn't actually say who they were fighting.

Personally, I'm wondering if they weren't going up against the Titans. It makes sense because we know Mythal killed at least one of them.

Though we still have next to no information on the exact nature of their connection to the Fade beyond immortality and the ability to use the Art to a level far beyond most modern Magi. There's a lot of theories, some fans think the Elves are Spirits that have somehow gained organic forms similar to Cole, others think the Elves simply evolved in regions where the Fade was already bleeding in and that there was already a natural Veil between the Fade and Thedas. If the latter, then it's possible they only travelled between these regions through the Fade itself, and then later via the Eluvians, while ignoring the rest of the world unless it had resources they wanted.

In that case, then their assertion that the Fade was omnipresent prior to the creation of the Veil could be yet another lie. In addition, if it was everywhere, then why was it only the Elves that had such a vast command of the Art? As far as we know, this wasn't the case for the Dwarves, who we can be reasonably certain were in the same general region as the Elves at the time. Certainly haven't heard anything about the Kossith or ancient Humans having similar powers.

Dwarves: Apparently had some sort of symbiotic relationship with the Titans, almost like some sort of more mobile immune system. They might've been enslaved, but given the original Elves such as Solas apparently don't even truly consider them to be alive because they are neither intricately tied to the Fade nor capable of dreaming when they aren't connected to a Titan, like a phone without internet, that's questionable at best. Then the Evanuris killed a Titan and started mining Lyrium, AKA the Titan's blood, and thus found the Dwarves that were living inside of it

Qunari: Used to be the Kossith before going through some serious physiological changes either due to getting experimented on by someone, most likely the Elves, or via their own experiments. This led to them gaining the Draconic horns they're so well known for. Corypheus calls them an experiment, which makes me wonder if the Evanuris didn't take the Kossith and try to mold them into some sort of new breed of foot soldier, ultimately abandoning the project when their aggression proved almost impossible to control. This might be why the Qun doesn't really work for most, but it does for the Qunari: their brain chemistry is almost completely different.

Humans: As far as I can tell, they just appeared around the time the Fade showed up, The Maker was most likely a serious misinterpretation of the interior of a Titan, and Andraste was most likely a Mage. Though personally I'm leaning on them coming from across the sea like the Kossith did. We don't know anything solid about the Executors except that they represent "those across the sea" and they use the symbol of an upside down triangle with two wavy lines through it. If they are the original Human civilization(s), then the Executors could be agents sent across to find the descendants of a lost expedition or merchant ships lost in a storm.

Now, for the rather crazy theory about Dreadwolf.

There is also the matter of the Dragons, and why every Human civilization we know either currently worship them or did so at some point in the past. I mean, Dragons are awesome, we all know that. But every, single, one of the ancient Human civilizations worshipped them at some point.

The Elves are tied to the Fade, Dwarves to the Titans, and if the Qunari are the result of experiments on the Kossith, who we know almost nothing about, then they might be unique in having an artificial connection. Maybe even an artificial version of Humanity's natural connection to the Dragons. If Humanity is tied to the Dragons, the Human Fire to the Dwarven Earth and Elven Spirit/Air, then who knows what sort of extra abilities they've forgotten. Abilities that can only be unlocked not by killing the Dragons, but by taming them.

I'm getting Divine Divinity 2: Dragon Knight Saga vibes here. You don't get any loot by killing the Dragon in Trespasser, and are outright encouraged to free it. You can also tame a Dragon if you enter the Well Of Sorrows, and even if you don't, Morrigan can transform into a Dragon if she enters it. Feels like there's going to be a complete reversal of our treatment of Dragons in Dreadwolf. Solas and his forces will be trying to kill or enslave them, and we'll be working to save them. The more Dragons you have, the easier the end battle is.

Now for the less crazy theory about Dreadwolf.

The Ancient Elves placed Eluvians all over the place, and from what I can tell Dreadwolf is spread from Antiva and Rivain to the Anderfels and Tevinter. A smaller part of Inquisition and a large amount of Trespasser was about how they could go almost anywhere. What if we have to take part of the network from Solas's forces? With it, we have the ability to move our forces from one place to another like ghosts and avoid detection en route.

Dorian also mentions building their own Eluvians when in Vir Dirthara, and an 8-10 year time jump, as some are suggesting due to a short story, would allow us to use them to explain fast travel at any of our camps. It would also be a neat plot explanation for us being able to go from one side of the continent to the other in a reasonable timeframe. Not that we'd necessarily need one.

Apologies for any formatting or general issues with connecting my thoughts, this was written on my phone in a sleep deprived haze.

David Gaider spoke once of the Fex, and if I remember correctly they're mentioned briefly in World of Thedas. A few others have theorized a connection between the Fex and the Scaled Ones – I agree, but maybe in a different way.

If the Fex and the Scaled Ones are one in the same, that would raise the question of why and how the fex, native to an island to the North of Thedas, are in the deep roads suckling down Dwarven blood in the Deepest of the Deep Roads (and what the ritual did to/for them).

Excerpts from Chronicles of a Forgotten War, Author Unknown

Commander Othon told us to move out. He didn't give details, only that there'd been attacks north of Cad'halash and the Crown was sending reinforcements.

In the flame's light, we saw a man's body like those of the Imperium humans, but covered in scales. It wore armor and even had a dagger hanging from its hip. Its jaws wrapped around Drohg's face and twisted.

I guessed there was a score of them, all wearing armor and carrying weapons as sharp as their teeth and talons. The one that killed Drohg barked orders I didn't understand.

The Scaled Ones had set up a camp at an intersection in the Deep Roads. In the center there was a golden altar fashioned in the shape of fire. A chill swept through me. On the tip of each flame hung the corpses of those we'd lost—including Father and Drohg. They'd been drained of blood, leaving only bone wrapped in grey skin. A robed Scaled One stood before the altar. Its voice was different from the others: softer, almost feminine. It chanted and raised a basin of blood towards the altar. The other Scaled Ones bowed low. The robed Scaled One produced fire from its palm and mouth and ignited the blood.

The memory of Father's sagging, emptied face kept me awake. The hour passed slowly, but it did pass. Othon led us down the path to the overlook. I readied my axe for blood and steeled myself for the sight of the altar. But it wasn't there. The camp, Father and Drohg, the Scaled Ones... all gone. Only the basin remained, charred around the edges.

The Forgotten War (between -1195 Ancient and -975 Ancient) being between the dwarves and the fex might imply Deep Roads entrances beneath the Par Vollen pyramids and ruins, but we still don't have any indication of what the war was waged over. Dwarven blood? Maybe, maybe more than that alone.

The ruins and pyramids on Par Vollen depicted revered beings that mirror those of the Evanuris – the Old Gods? – similarly sharing features likened to dragons.

Here and there, odd figures are depicted, tall, horned, always in a position of authority and respect.

The Old Gods were the ones that whispered to the first human dreamers fifty years after the Neromenian tribe landed on the shores of Thedas and taught humanity magic, blood magic, encouraged Tevinter to raze Arlathan and wage a conquest against the Elvhenan, the ones that urged the Magisters to enter the Golden/Black City and ultimately unleash the Blight, and the ones that lead the Blights as Archdemon.

The Kossith arrived in Southern Thedas ~500 to 700 years later in -410, and still worshipped animist gods (which can be anything from persons, animals, plants, spirits, environment, and technology – perhaps fire and blood was one of those deities?)

According to these notes they were going after Cad'halash specifically, as far as we know, and Cad'halash harbored elven refugees from Arlathan.

In we learn that Mythal and Fen'Harel had statues guarding, protecting the old Thaigs, given places of honor, ever vigilant in the deep dark.

These statues are old. Better shape than anything I've seen on the surface. Many of them are for Mythal, though. And Fen'Harel. Not in a spot of honor, but guarding, attending.

Protector and All-Mother, why are you honored here, so far from the light of the sun? And why was the Dread Wolf at your side?

Mythal sealed away the Titan and the Wellspring from the Evanuris, depriving them of its power and shielding the Children of the Stone from their hunger.

"Hail Mythal, adjudicator and savior! She has struck down the pillars of the earth and rendered their demesne unto the People! Praise her name forever!"

For a moment, the scent of blood fills the air, and there is a vivid image of green vines growing and enveloping a sphere of fire.

The vision grows dark. An aeon seems to pass. Then the runes crackle, as if filled with an angry energy.

A new vision appears: elves collapsing caverns, sealing the Deep Roads with stone and magic.

Terror, heart-pounding, ice-cold, as the last of the spells is cast.

A voice whispers:

"What the Evanuris in their greed could unleash would end us all. Let this place be forgotten. Let no one wake its anger. The People must rise before their false gods destroy them all."

We learn from Abelas that Mythal was murdered, not banished to the Beyond. It was the Evanuris who executed her for protecting the dwarves as she did the Elvhenan, and for putting an end to the injustices committed in the darkness of the Deep Roads. But it is Fen'Harel that is credited with the rebellion – a blessing, or a curse?

These statues are older than anything I saw in my days with the clan. The area's dwarven, though. What were the ancient elves doing down here? Mining? Where were the dwarves? Easier to have them mine it. Not a trading post. You don't go into a friend's home, knock over their gods, and put up your own.

War? I don't remember any legends about our people fighting the dwarves. Though I remember my Keeper telling a story about how the dwarves fear the sun because of Elgar'nan's fire. A metaphor for the elves of Arlathan driving the dwarves underground?

The Evanuris were corrupted by their hunger and thirst for power, and created something horrible with it.

"They made bodies from the earth, and the earth was afraid. It fought back, but they made it forget."

Cole, Descent

The Evanuris became the Old Gods,† their greed and gluttony as they abused the Titan.

There are whispers from the Well of Sorrows. It's impossible to understand the entire text, but certain parts suddenly reveal a shadow of their original meaning.

"In this place we prepare to hunt the pillars of the earth. Their workers scurry, witless, soulless. This death will be a mercy. We will make the earth blossom with their passing."

For one moment there is a vivid image of two overlapping spheres; unknown flowers bloom inside their centers. Then it fades.

The workers the Well whispers of are those subjects that the Evanuris enthralled and forced to mine the Lyrium. The Pillars of the Earth that Mythal struck down were not the Titan, but the product of her kin – either the Evanuris themselves (most likely: here they prepared to create the veil and banish the Evanuris to the beyond) ,or their infrastructure – the mines, the passages, and the Eluvian that they used to reap the lyrium they pillaged and plundered from the Stone.

"The runes say the Evanuris fought the Titans. They mined their bodies for lyrium and... something else. It's not clear."

– Inquisitor, The Well of Sorrow

The Titans are the Forgotten Ones — forgotten by their children, erased from the Shaperate, sealed away in the depths beneath the Deep Roads. The last traces of their memories lie in the crumbling Thaigs, long emptied, ruined and lost.

"They made bodies from the earth, and the earth was afraid. It fought back, but they made it forget."

—Cole, on the Titans

Fen'Harel is said to have sealed away in the Abyss, but I posit instead that the Great Betrayal belonged to Mythal. Sealing the Titan and the Wellspring was an act of justice and mercy, not conquest nor subjection – it was a punishment for the Evanuris, for their unjust cruelty. Mythal did not enslave the Titans, she sought to save them.

Mythal, all-mother, protector of the People, *watch over us, for the path we tread is perilous.

Save us from the darkness, as you did before, and we will sing your name to the heavens.*

Let fly your voice to Mythal. Deliverer of justice. Protector of sun and earth alike.

Pray to Mythal and she would smite your enemies, leaving them in agony.

The People are not just the Elvhenan, but the Children of the Stone that she freed and embraced as her own. In another entry we see that Mythal gave the ability to dream, gave magic to dwarves, which has been all but lost (Enchantment!) and erased from the Memories.

Many of these pages are filled with sketches of elven statues matching the ones found in the area, along with notes and what look like attempts to practice Qunlat:

Trying to remember that old bedtime song about Mythal. My mother sang it the night before the darkspawn came for my clan. It's the last time I ever heard her voice.

Ir sa tel'nal, Mythal las ma theneras. Ir san'a emma. Him solas evanuris. Da'durgen'lin, Banal malas elgara. Bellanaris, bellanaris.

Written beside each elven line is a corresponding phrase, likely a translation:

I am empty, filled with nothing(?), Mythal gives you dreams. It fills you, within you(?), Making our leaders proud. My little stones, Never yours the sun. Forever, forever.

Hahren said we had lost some of the old words. What if they have changed? Durgen'lin from durgen'len? Little dwarves, never yours the sun? What did Mythal do here?

Something's wrong. The lights in the walls are fading. Going to find help. It's not safe. Without light…

Itwa-ost: You all fall Itwa-adim: They all fall Itwasaam: We all fall

If the Fex were humanoids and consuming the blood of both dwarves (earth) and elves (sun), and with them the old magic of the Elvhenan and the Children of the Stone? Between the consumption and the blood magic of their rituals, I imagine they could reap some very powerful results.

If drinking the blood of dragons and wyverns can create Reavers, and overindulging might cause physical... abnormalities, what would happen if an army set out to consume the potent blood of various races, still close to their deities, over years en masse?

The other Thaigs weren't abandoned to Darkspawn, but to flee from the Scaled Ones, who used the blood from their slaughter in rituals of both consumption and magic and worshipped fire — fire, like that which a dragon may breathe?

Further considerations in the Journal on Dwarven Ruins, Hissing Wastes

The inscriptions on the ruins are all in the old tongue. (Thank you, Grandmother, for teaching this ungrateful brat Old Dwarven.) The writing talks about "the sad parting from the Stone." Hundreds of years ago, several houses left their thaigs to settle here under one leader. They were running from a war, or running so there wouldn't be a war? I read and re-read the pillars until the light faded, but I know I'm missing something.

It's a Paragon. The man who lead the people here, who built this city, was master smith Paragon Fairel.

Legend says he died in the Deep Roads during a war between two thaigs who used his runework to build fantastic weapons of destruction.

I was tracing heraldry etched on a wall when I noticed pictures of weapons with winged lizards worked into the decoration. I spent the rest of the day translating the inscriptions. This verse was apparently passed down through Fairel's house, through his father to his father's father and so on for hundred of generations:

***From the Stone, have no fear of anything,

but the stone-less sky betrays with wings of flame.***

If the surface must be breached, if there is no other way, bring weapons against the urtok, and heed their screams.

"Urtok" means "dragon." Why was it part of an ancient crest? Why were these dwarves so worried about a monster they'd never see that they worked it into their weapons?

What would happen to a being — Fex, Human, or otherwise — that consumed the blood of Elvhenan, the old Stone, and dragons, perhaps more races and creatures?

Would their blood be considered engorged with decay, their race not a race, but a mistake? Is their blood not their own?

Titans

"It's singing. A they that's an it that's asleep, but still making music."

"Their ancient shapers were mountains drawn of all their wills, walking their memories into valleys of the world."

"They made bodies from the earth, and the earth was afraid. It fought back, but they made it forget."

—Cole on the Titans

"It’s where Andraste goes to speak to the Maker for the first time. It’s where she convinces him to forgive mankind. It was supposed to be this beautiful temple deep under the earth surrounded by emerald waters."

—Maric Theirin, Dragon Age: The Calling

Some supporting texts

Mythal

Walking the Fade: Frozen Moments

I once studied the Fade as a scholar, dissecting it, as a child might a rat or a frog. I was young and craved the power conquering the Fade could bring. I tried in vain to chart its paths, and when that failed, I attempted to secure them. In my arrogance, I struggled against the Fade's very nature. How does one pin down a dream? How can one control a thought so that it might travel always the same course from conception to completion?

Only when I let go of my desires and humbled myself was the Fade opened to me. The spirits came and took it upon themselves to be my guides, my lanterns in the darkness. At their command, the paths grew still, and I could walk them again and again. I was shown vast oceans, containing not water, but memories, drawn from the minds of dreamers. I drifted through frozen moments, like paintings, perfect in each detail. As I explored this impossible realm, the spirits kept darker things at bay. I came to trust them, even love them, and I saw my own love reflected in them.

To know the Fade, one cannot seek to master it. The Fade is the master, the teacher. We are merely apprentices.

—Writings of Magister Callistus of Taraevyn, known to some as "Callistus the Fade-Touched"*

Here Lies The Abyss

Chantry sisters have long debated this section of the Chant of Light. It is tempting to assume that the "well of all souls" is a literal well, but such imagery appears nowhere in Andraste's other works. An examination from Threnodies 1:4 yields clues:

From the waters of the Fade you made the world. As the Fade had been fluid, so was the world fixed.

It is possible—even likely—that the "emerald waters" Andraste refers to are the substance of the Fade, which began as an "ocean of dreams" (Threnodies 1:1) and was reduced to a well—bottomless but limited in scope—by the Maker's creation of our world.

Is Andraste urging the listener to come to the Fade? Should we take "From these emerald waters doth life begin anew," as literal evidence of reincarnation—or even of life after death, as the Cult of Spirits suggests—or as a figurative benediction indicating that the Maker is the source of all life, and in finding His embrace for Eternity, we will only be returning our souls from whence they came?

—An excerpt from Reflections on Divinity, by Revered Mother Juliette

Here lies the abyss, the well of all souls. From these emerald waters doth life begin anew. Come to me, child, and I shall embrace you. In my arms lies Eternity.

—Canticle of Andraste, 14:11

Ancient Elven Writing

There are whispers from the Well of Sorrows. It's impossible to understand the entire text, but certain parts suddenly reveal a shadow of their original meaning.

"His crime is high treason. He took on a form reserved for the gods and their chosen, and dared to fly in the shape of the divine. The sinner belongs to Dirthamen; he claims he took wings at the urging of Ghilan'nain, and begs protection from Mythal. She does not show him favor, and will let Elgar'nan judge him."

For one moment there is an image of a shifting, shadowy mass with blazing eyes, whose form may be one or many. Then it fades.

Unreadable Elven Writing

There are whispers from the Well of Sorrows. It's impossible to understand the entire text, but certain parts suddenly reveal a shadow of their original meaning.

"She shook the radiance of the stars, divided them into grains of light, then stored them in a shaft of gold. Andruil, blood and force, save us from the time this weapon is thrown. Your people pray to You. Spare us the moment we become Your sacrifice."

There is a brief image of an elaborate golden spear, glowing with unbearable heat. Then it fades.

Untranslatable Elven Writing

There are whispers from the Well of Sorrows. It's impossible to understand the entire text, but certain parts suddenly reveal a shadow of their original meaning.

"We are trapped. The ones born here do not understand the keenness of what we have lost, or why so many of their elders weep as they enter uthenera. The new ones are faithful to Mythal, but do not understand what she was in her fullness. Without the wise to lead them, they will lose what they should have been.

I will teach them. They must serve. We must prepare for those who cast Mythal down. I shed my name the day I began her service. I shed my new one again, now that she rests. I will only be known by the sorrow that cuts my heart."

For a moment, there is a feeling of wrenching loss. Then it fades.

Mentions of the Qunari if the Inquisitor is Tal-Vashoth

"A few of the Ben-Hassrath have this crazy old theory. See, the Tamassrans control who we mate with. (...) What if they mixed in some dragon a long time ago? Maybe drinking the blood, maybe magic, I don't know."

"I noticed your blood. It doesn't belong to your people."
"I just feel bad about what happened to your people."

"What do they call you? A 'Qunari'? Your blood is engorged with decay. Your race is not a race, it is a mistake."

"You are not what I expected. Qunari are savage creatures, their ferocity held in check only by the rigid teachings of the Qun."

Some mosaic notes

"There's skulls all over, and two big and horned. That brings to mind your Qunari, and fair enough, right? (...) Because this is probably that business of readying to invade the Fade, and giants with horns are a good motivator to sodding hurry up."

Deep in the jungle ruins of the Pyramids of Par Vollen, where Fex (and, perhaps, humans) originated

Beneath the leaves and vines covering the walls, you can still make out the stylized carvings that adorn them. The paint has long since flaked away, but the silhouettes are clear: intricate sea creatures, shipwrights, musicians, archers, and kings. Here and there, odd figures are depicted, tall, horned, always in a position of authority and respect.

† The Evanuris and the Old Gods

Mythal: The Great Protector

Elgar'nan threw the sun out of the sky in vengeance for burning the earth to ashes, Mythal calmed him and helped him see how his anger had betrayed him. Elgar'nan was convinced to free the sun.

Fulmenos

Commonly known as "the Thunderbolt." Fulmenos depicts a bolt of lightning thrown by a wrathful god, though there is significant debate over which god it's supposed to be.

Gaider: On Qunari and Kossith and Never the Twain Shall Meet

I've been wondering about this lately. It's possible? I remember in DA2 they had to set up a trap to ambush Anders, when they could have just track him down using the phylactery.

This makes me think: is the blood of a mage warden contaminated by the darkspawn taint, enough to be untraceable by templars using a phylactery?

Anyone else interested in learning more about where the Reaver specialization comes from? Some of the little snippets in the quest for it in Inquisition made me think there's possibly a Tevinter connection with the "old forbidden magic" bit. Stands to reason that some Tevinter magisters might want to give their bodyguards a little -totally not- Blood Magic edge.

Also very possible that separate groups of people came up with a similar concept of drinking dragon's blood in various areas. Seeing as how Thedas is collectively obsessed with drinking strange substances to attain great power at a cost.

Though we've only seen separate disconnected groups like the Andrastian cult in Origins. I was interested with the "Breaker" title the trainer in Inquisition has. It gave the impression to me that this was a sort of established title for some form of group (however loose) of Reavers.

What are y'alls thoughts? This is something that never really interested me before but that I thought was really cool in Inquisition. I hope we can get more lore about them.