So I’m struggling to understand midday prayer. I understand it was set up with the understanding that most clergy would probably only pray one midday office. That said, it looks like it’d be absolutely insane to try and pray all three. I’ve been a lauds/vespers person for a few years. So I’m used to Christian Prayer and the Mundelein Psalter.

But Now I’ve picked up the single volume “Daytime Prayer” book and the layout is nuts. In OT on ferial days it looks straight forward for one hour. But throw in a privileged season and all three hours and I don’t get it. One page for the psalter, one page for the Antiphon (only one Antiphon for all three psalms now?) and readings, another page for the prayer?

And then move from Terce to Sext and you need to go from the normal psalter to the complementary psalter (pick 1/3 of Sext and another one of the three for none? How do you pick which?) and presumably use the same Antiphon? And then it looks highly repetitive from then on with the antiphon, reading and prayer being the same every Monday, every Tuesday, etc. this doesn’t seem at all cohesive to use.

Is the 4 volume set laid out this way? But even beyond layout, the repetitiveness from hour to hour within the same day (Antiphon and reading) seems just sad. And using the Psalms of Ascent as filler just seems foreign to the Roman office. I understand the benedictines have always used them here, but I thought the Roman office had always had them at vespers.

I don’t know, the whole thing just seems strange and unnecessarily difficult. I feel like this doesn’t need to be this difficult to pray all three of the daytime hours without resorting to a computer.

End rant.

Anyone have any advice for how to approach this? I don’t want to use a phone or computer, but I don’t understand the flow or the reasoning here.

Still learning how to pray LOTH. I automatically moved to week 3 today but it doesn’t match with the app. Do we return to week 1 at the start of each season? If so often does it ‘reset’ during the year?

What are the differences between the two and why do you prefer one over the other

Edit: I mean the 62 breviaryv

Can we read each one of the three readings before a set of three Psalms(or parts of Psalms). So 1 reading before each set of three psalms. I Do this cuz it helps meditate a lot.

Hello all, I have started praying the 3 hours I mentioned above on my phone but would like to buy a physical copy. Are there any editions with only those 3 hours since those are the only ones I plan to pray? Thanks!

Hello all,

I'm wondering if anyone would have any leads on where I could find a print copy of the LOTH in Dutch? I'm living in the USA, and often use the online edition from Tiltenberg, but I would prefer to use a paper copy.

Hello all,

I recently made the shift from the LOTH to the Monastic Diurnal, and I absolutely love it. I am a big fan of the repetition, latin and more poetic seeming translations.

However, one thing I do miss from the LOTH is the section for prayer intentions. It made me feel a bit more hands-on in my "offering", and it was also a place where I'd reflect on those I promised to pray for, or anything going on in my personal life.

Is there a place in the Monastic Diurnal for me to replicate this? Or any method you may suggest?

Secondly, as a new user of the MD - I do wish to eventually begin chanting the hours in latin. I am already pretty familiar with chant.

My current plan is to just read and pray them in English until I "know" what's being said, and then eventually switch to Latin when I at least have a vibe of what I'm praying. Is this a good strategy?

Thanks!

W.

Hi everyone - I created an altar card for the LOTH. Feel free to download it, copy it, print it, frame it etc. the idea is that it might be useful for those that pray the major hours of Office at the same location and/or have an altar at home.

File (free) is here: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ei527sHDbVud917wJ7G5NHW3nF03D5gg/view?usp=drivesdk

Please note that I am not an expert. If you see any problem, please let me know.

I might try to create one for DW:DO-CE and one for the Monastic Diurnal.

Edit: not that there is a market for this, but I want to be clear: feel free to copy, modify, print, and distribute. The only thing you can’t do is sell this or any derivative.

I currently have Christian Prayer, LOTH 4 Volume, Baronius LOBVM, DW:DO CE and have used them all. I’m having a hard time settling on one for everyday use to get the most out of my prayer life. I’m looking for suggestions on which has been fruitful for others? Thanks in advance.

I’m enjoying praying the lesser hours of the traditional LOBVM that the Baronius press edition uses, but occasionally I’ll like the more approachable modern English translation used for the newer version of the Office, which personally is also significantly easier to memorize. Is there a resource that has a version of the traditional LOBVM but in a more modern English translation?

Is it worth it to buy this?

https://a.co/d/6heHQy8

I have been using Ibreviary since I am new to saying the LOTH. I am wondering if it is worth it because I heard they might be outdated soon and wanted to know how much use I would get out of them. Also if you could tell me how easy it is to use them as someone who is new (or how easy it would be to learn how to use the books)

In case some want to pray the LOTH in Latin using a device (including e-ink Kindle devices), the 2025 files are now available from Universalis

https://universalis.com/latin.htm

In 1911 the Anglo-Catholic Society of Sts. Peter and Paul, famous for the Anglican Missal, published a copy of the Little Office of the Blessed Virgin Mary in Prayer Book English. Here's a transcription of that Little Office with some minor changes in the texts themselves to conform to DW:TM and DW:DO.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1d4YdPvE2K6rrY4uuDMEQe3awO54T5nev/view?usp=sharing

(P.S. Please let me know if you find any errors in it. Thank you!)

Laudetur Jesus Christus!

The Little Office of the Blessed Virgin Mary has been popular since its development in the Middle Ages, but I wonder what different versions there are in the Roman rite (I am aware of the different versions in different rites (Carthusian, Dominican, Carmelite, etc.)). I have read that most changes (as in all things liturgical) happened over the last century. So, was the Little Office left (roughly) unchanged from its development until the 20th century? Or did the Tridentine liturgical reform change some things? If it is the former, was it Pius X that brought the changes, or a later pope? One of the changes I am aware of is the removal of the commemoration of the saints. Also, this Barroux edition has "proper offices" for all liturgical seasons, while the tradtional Little Office only has three: is that their own invention?

Thanks

I’ve been praying the LOTH lately, and I’ve been using divineoffice.org. Wondering if anyone here has used it and, if so, what your thoughts are. God Bless.

I was wondering if anyone had any info on the actual process of the committee/consilium that developed the new LOTHs following Vatican II. Specifically:

1). Who was the consilium that developed the Liturgy of the Hours made up of? In times previous were there this sort of group for other reforms of the breviary?

2). Who had the authority at the end to decide what would comprise of this office? Did a bishops conference vote? Paul VI?

For those of you who pray the 1961 Breviarium Romanum what is your thought with the idea of keeping with the natural process and reform of the Church that is the LOTH? Specifically how do you guys feel with keeping in line and step with the rest of the Roman Church and her calendar/sentiments? I’m in no way attack, just curious.

To be honest, I’m hoping for a good answer to your guys’ thoughts in keeping in the spirit and progress of the Church’s reforms. I would like to pray the older Office, and have at times, but run into my own mental stumbling block. I often feel when I pray the old office a few things:

1). Not praying in the same line of the rest of the Roman Church. I’m not talking about liturgical prayer, just the calendar and the bishops, priest, deacons, and faithful of the Church. It seems like it’s often disconnected.

2). With the LOTH reform it seems to me like the 1961 Office is “plateau’d” in the sense that there is not updated calendar and outside of the post Vatican II liturgy of the hours…doesn’t really have the ability to experience natural progess and development since it’s not the ordinary form with the revisions that come with that. It almost seems stuck in its time with no ability to update it with the rest of the Church.

If guess my thought is why should we stop at John XXIII and not have everyone praying the LOTH. I know that’s a silly thought I’m just really trying to wrap my head around how to not default to the Church’s updates Roman Office, the LOTH, if we have a proper understanding of the Church’s development and promulgation of new Offices.

I guess a way around this is that the LOTH was given a ton of emphasis on the private aspect? So maybe that’s a good approach?

So any advice for praying the Old Office in the spirit of the Church and its current/updated liturgy & state is greatly appreciated.

I have been working on my breviary typesetting project. It all looks really good and is working as expected, except the one wrinkle I've hit is the formatting of hymns, which are a little more complicated aesthetically, mostly because of how lines can run too long for columns, and because as versified text there is the question of white space around the stanzas. It's easier in one language, but also trying to keep parallel Latin-English adds a layer of complication.

I am including here images of four potential formatting algorithms. Please let me know your thoughts and preferences.

https://preview.redd.it/znbp2sc9wc1e1.jpg?width=1920&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5e4cad2458d03dedb65d30f287c23d5dd83e06c4

1. pretty much just left-justified, though not necessarily as far left as the rest of the text in the breviary. Lines that are too long for the column split roughly in half at a word break and center below the first half (with some special logic around the drop cap);

https://preview.redd.it/givogqrawc1e1.jpg?width=1920&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3d3a81645eef701b8f7e8a1f9238fab0043f050e

2. pretty much just all fully centered except for the first line or two around the drop cap which have some special logic. Looks very symmetrical, but when lines split over two rows you sort of lose the sense of which lines are separate lines of the hymn;

https://preview.redd.it/hnq8j3bcwc1e1.jpg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=000edc732a501a58d3e76acbe6029fd90deb9b40

3. in this one I manually forced the "outlier" line from format 1 (which technically is able to fit on one line, but extends way beyond any others, after other long ones have split)...split by making it longer (this is why you see xxxxx etc; in real practice those X's would be invisible or i would manually force it to split before "Domino", etc). This allowed me to better center the entire "box" in which the hymn is situated, even while leaving the first part of every line left-justified within that box.

https://preview.redd.it/3lc1tcaewc1e1.jpg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2977bacae922fd8d95f9f9f7202ea5d9aa5fb577

4. is like three except instead of the second-halves of split lines being centered, they are right-justified within the box of the hymn, which possibly helps balance out some of the white space on the right edge in cases where it exists.

Please let me know which you like best and why, and if you have any other thoughts or suggestions.

What would you recommend to a Catholic who is former Monastic Diurnal prayer switching to the daily office who does not have DW:DO?

Just curious, to those who pray the full LOTH (all 5 hours) while also having the daily rosary, how do you manage to fit it? What part of the day do you pray the Rosary?

Is there a psalm tone traditionally used to chant the gradual psalms/songs of ascent? There is no antiphon over the psalms in the sources I checked. Is there a choir tradition of chanting these psalms under a particular tone or are they always recited (i.e. not chanted)?

Hello! I am looking for a Tagalog Liturgy of the Hours Proper for Christ the King. If you know any site, please share it with me. Thank you!

What that means for the lectionary and the breviary.

https://www.pillarcatholic.com/p/why-the-usccb-will-vote-on-a-new

Is there any liturgical difference between St. Michael’s Abbey Monastic Diurnal and Lancelot Andrew’s Press? I own the St. Michael. I also know that the LAP is a document meant primarily for members of the Anglican Communion. Does the LAP follow the Anglican Calendar? Does it use Anglican Collects or are they functionally the same.

Bonus points if someone could also tell me about the LAP matins. I currently use the Matins published by Clear Creek.

Hello everyone,

I have a copy of Fr. Samuel Weber's Hymnal for the Hours which is very cool except I'm not a fan of thee/thou, didst, wouldest, language like this. He uses these older or intentionally archaic translations at times for some hymns, ordinary contemporary language for others. I especially don't like alternating between the difference in style.

I've dabbled in making my own translation but I'm not very good without concerted effort and there's simply too many hymns to go through. Does anyone know a source where I can find the traditional hymns' text in contemporary language? I've tried searching around and fear such a thing may not exist for >90% of the repertoire but somebody might know otherwise or so I hope.

Thank you!

Hello all! I often hear Mass at a Franciscan shrine which uses, so far as I understand, the LoTH for the canonical hours. However, I noticed that during the intercessions at Lauds, for instance, the friars respond "Lord, hear our prayer" instead of the response provided. Does this flexibility exist for the layperson? I'd assume that if they (the friars) deviate from the rubrics, they have authorization to do so/ are praying the LoTH according to the practice of the Franciscans Conv..

The little scripture passage that serves as a preface to the main scripture reading in the Office of Readings in the Liturgy of the Hours. For instance, today’s

God’s Word is alive; it strikes at the heart - It pierces more surely than a two-edged sword.

Or tomorrow’s

You will hear the word from my mouth - You will tell others what I have said.

They’re always great ways to prepare for the Scripture, so was wondering if that part of the Office had a name.

Laudetur Jesus Christus!

I am reading a Carmelite 1938 liturgical calendar. There are several columns, from right to left: a description of that day's liturgy (e.g., S. Ignatii Ep. et Mart., dupl. min. II cl.), the day of the month (indicated by D.M., dies mensis), the day of the month according to the classical Roman kalendar (e.g., Kal. (the Kalends)), the Sunday letter (indicated by L.D., littera Dominicæ), and a mysterious column with the title C.E. To illustrate, this is the contents of the column for the first couple rows (i.e., the first couple days of January): *, xxix, xxviij, xxvij, xxvj, 25 xxv, xxiv, etc. For January, it counts down to 1 (j), and then the last day of the month is * again, for February to start on xxix. What is this?