After seeing this post, I was curious if Rasputin's score seemed more than just random numbers.

A quick google search of the numbers seems to return a few couple pages about physics codes and metaphysical magic, among other things. I cant makes heads or tails of any of it tho. Anything here maybe?

Is it just a case of cultural change that occurred during the Golden Age? Or did the knowledge of these traditions (at least in the way we know them) was lost in the Collapse?

There's dialogue from Eido at the end of Haunted Sectors where she mentions "the ancient human ritual of the Hall Between," which is an obvious mistranslation of Halloween.

One thought I had is that maybe the many cultures that came together in the Last City caused an amalgamation of so many different traditions that resulted in entirely new holidays. For example, Festival of the Lost is all about remembering and honoring those we've lost (not unlike Dia de Los Muertos), but it also features candy, pumpkins, and masks as part of the festivities (similar to Halloween). Although I can't really find evidence of this in other seasonal events.

Thoughts?

I heard they're like dead people but Luke what are they? Why are they here in the lost sectors?

I've been curious about this for a bit now. The replication complex and the iron tomb have both been destroyed in RoI, Aksis has been defeated and all that, Siege Engine put in the ground, etc. but as we've seen with the latest Outbreak quests, there's still dormant SIVA clusters in lost sectors in the Cosmodrome. So that got me thinking. And "dormant" doesn't mean dead, it means active, but sleeping or inactive, like Oryx's body is at the bottom of Titan's oceans. So, what would happen if these dormant SIVA clusters were activated? Are there any other known sources that could be used by either us or an enemy faction once again?

Yirix is a Psion who is in command of the Shadow Legion currently. This got me thinking - if we are to assume Yirix is also in charge of the Dread, given there are Dread Psions, wouldn’t it make sense for Yirix not to be a normal Psion and to be upgraded with Pyramid tech? This would make her much more of a threat to the Alliance. It would also be pretty cool to see the equivalent of a new Disciple being born.

What do you guys think, will Yirix be a traditional Psion or will Yirix be a Dread?

For years, my heart has been pushed to the brink by suffering injustice. It made me question whether to be good or evil, and in my hyper-rational and curious mind I researched the subject. I made myself more distressed and confused the more I knew, even to life-crippling insanity. Although, I’m doing a bit better now, Destiny 2 has always inspired me about these subjects so I want to ask its community for advice to resolve my frustrating struggle. If you’ve suffered sufficiently horrific injustice in your life, the consideration of what you would do in a moral dilemma where your own survival is at stake is a lot more solemn. It can’t just be brushed aside, it grimly sticks with one internally all the time. It’s been a turmoil that’s festered within me and made me restless for years. These are the kinds of thought-processes I have, copy-pasted from my notes:{

One evidence for why one should be morally good is the undeniable beauty of just societies and the lovable unique happy people in them. It’s not beauty that can be replicated in morally-ambiguous groups or in a life of evil that sees everyone as mortal competition. Beauty has value in it of itself, so it’s evidence one should stand for the side of good even in the most lightless places. Even if that beauty isn’t present, it’s proof of something more important and sacred of being good. One should have the bravery to not sacrifice idealism for survival. More than not wanting to survive by being a hypocritical cancer, I want to live positively embracing hope in my heart. I want the bravery to love and for that to be reason enough, and I want to be consistent rather than savage.

One has to be willing to possibly die for morality to choose to be a good person, so that one’s moral compass has full range. This is so hard since one is the best in it of oneself and must not be below another as per one’s dignity. But it’s possible for me to care about someone else selflessly other than myself and it applies here. When light and dark reach a singularity, perhaps the outcome is up to one to decide. Few people could wisely say what they would do when they have to choose between survival or morality.

Perhaps, at this point of singularity, only the crazy positive choice of both is correct. To lose either is equally unacceptable, it’s a proven fact. I’ve met good people— I’ve seen how they are and how they feel and the good they do for the world (artifice makes civilization so enjoyable, like everywhere)— and I know this friendship is irrevocable. I won’t let malice and ill intent unbalance my judgements and corrupt my will. I’d rather deny reality until the bitter end and go out screaming in flames, the same way I started when I was born. Rise like heat.

} this is the end of my notes. Apologies for not knowing complete Reddit formatting. I’m confident I could adhere to that solution to the moral dilemma even when pressured by an actual survival situation. To choose both survival and morality is an unsatisfactory answer since I want to know how to rationalize choosing only morality. I need further enlightenment. I really want to do the right thing, but no positively-emotional argument proves it for me, I seek facts. I feel like I could do anything unrestrained if I solved this internally, since I would know my life isn’t founded on savage ignorance or the disheartening poison of evil. Please help me expand my wisdom.

Would like to know, what you would think about a new story around Neomuna and it's lore? Are you more like "I want nothing that reminds me of Lightfall" or more like "Maybe" or something else?

This weekly thread is for asking questions about the world of Destiny. Any lore-based question is valid. Rather than making short Question posts, we recommend users check here first.

All responses must be friendly, respectful, and nonjudgmental. Top replies should provide a source for their answer or they may be removed.

The goal of this thread is to provide a space where users can ask any question and expect well-sourced/researched answers.

###Remember to tag spoilers!

Resources:

• Ishtar Collective (the complete lore)

• Dredgen Yor, Shin Malphur, and the Drifter

• The History of the Cabal

I was thinking that most time when Vex show up its usually because they’re already on the planet (somehow) or someone opened a portal/built a gate/let them in like that time on Glassway or the Last City siege.

But do we know how do they get somewhere in the first place? They just have a few unit slowly floating in space and get somewhere in a billion years then time travel back? Vex milk teleportation?

I hate how it was never actually mentioned (to the extent of my memory), so I very much want to ask, what are the effects us acquiring Prismatic/obtaining the ability to use Light and Dark simultaneously had on the city? On other guardians? What does it represent for us going forward?

Unless Filrul changes sides thoughout the episode, how will we deal with his immortality? Will we the guardian, or more likely Crow, pull a Saint-14 and kill him over and over again. I'm not entirely sure how his revivals work so it may not be the same.

With the use of Ether ray guns in the new Onslaught activity, there are some voice lines from Mithrax and Eido about it being a relic from Old Riis and, more intriguingly, they refer to it as "Paracausal" in some of them.

So that makes me think: If the Ether gun is Paracausal in nature, does that make Ether Paracausal as well? Is it some kind of Light-based substance? Is that the explanation behind the apparitions of death falling coming out of their bodies when we shoot them?

Title

I find it very intriguing that the supposebly "Arc" Energy is all messed up in the dungeon. Also the AI comments on it saying that the Energy shouldn't behave that way. I'm also remembering that colour-inversion graph showed that the opposite of light blue is like a mix of brown and yellow? Maybe I'm just coping real hard but let me know your thoughts.

just want to know the significance of this guy in the raid

With the witness dead, is there any lore pointing to a sort of a rebuilding/Reclamation of the sol system and beyond? I can't imagine the last safe city being the last forever. Maybe we'll set up new colonies or just large fobs for coalition forces to occupy still hostile worlds

Basically what the title says. Did the Traveler hang around the Sol system visible to anyone like how it hovered over the Last city in present ? What role did the Traveler may have played in golden human society ? Did the Traveler actively intervene in human politics, wars etc ? What did golden age humanity think of the Traveler anyway ? There is super advanced alien machine that gave us some high tech crap, but is mute and dont talk to us ?

returning player here, i missed out on basically everything from shadowkeep era and i was talking to some clan mates about older stuff, from what they told me the tree is like LITERALLY a tree but was also mysterious and important to the lore at the time. nowadays it seems like nothing came of it at all and from a read on the wiki and stuff it seems hilariously irrelevant. am i missing something that happened?

[S23 Spoiler] Ok, so, now with the re introduction of the whole Kell of Kells shtick, can we go back to speculating about possible candidates for the spot of The Kell of Prophecy, (Act 2 Spoilers ahead)>!cuz with Prision of Elders returning in Act 2 and the possibility of Skolas himself coming back,!< I'd think looking at the eligible Eliksni for the position would be a nice thing to do, for me, there are curently 3 main candidates, those being, Misraaks, Eido and Eramis, and to be fair, the 3 of them are all pretty well set for the position, the whole point of the prophecy is to enphasize to the forthcoming of the eliksni who will unite all other under the guidance of the Great Machine, an Eliksni to rule them all, if you will, and as I see it, Misraaks, altough the most promising one would be too cliché, He's one of the most acomplished eliksni of his era, being the sole responsible for the Eliskni and Humanity making ammends, but still, I do not think he's going to be the one to take the spot, now, with Eido the things start to shift, from a lore standpoint, she's the closest one we've got to the traveler, having visions about him since she was a hatchling and being the Eliskni Child of Light, but despite all of that, from my Point of View, she's much more likely to land a spot high into the ranks of the tower, perhaps as a speaker? who knows, but I do think she's too young to take leadership over all eliksni and become the Kell of Kells, now, with Eramis, I think she's the one, altough not really a good eliksni (probably one of the most hated eliksni ever, SHE KILLED RASPUTIN FFS), I think she'll be the one to be chosen by the traveler, as the first eliksni to be blessed by the light since the Whirlwind, as she was not only there to witness it, she also lost everything she loved in it, and till a few seasons back was nothing but a really, really pissed lady, but we've seen from time to time how the Traveller favours those who suffered a great deal (Devotion inspires bravery. Bravery inspires sacrifice. Sacrifice leads to death.), as happened with Savathun, and now more than ever, with Eido being a softening point to her, and she turning herself in and trying to redeem herself, I think theres a great chance that somewhere along this seasons story, she makes a grand sacrifice to save Eido, and be resurected as Lightbearer Eramis, and be looked upon by every eliksni as The Kell of Kells, the one who unites all eliksni and make them whole again. but those are just my toughts and speculations, and I wanted to hear what y'all think. thanks for listening, this was my first post on this subreddit, have a nice day/evening/night.

I know that Destiny generally follows certain historical themes when naming species, characters, etc, the Cabal being very Roman influenced. Is this similar in any way to the Ahamkara? I'm trying to come up with a character for a story I'm writing.

Thanks

Like does it get influenced by our previous lives or aomething? Or does our ghost just take a long look at us and be like: "Yeah this mf is a Titan"

We have been getting new subfactions for each episode such as the Choral Vex for Echoes and the Revenant Scorn for Revenant. This has me wondering if we’ll see Xivu’s brood for Heresy or a new Hive faction created using an Echo.

Because both new subfactions for the Vex & Scorn have been created due to Echoes, I would think the latter is more likely - that we would get a brand new Hive faction created from another Echo. I’m curious to hear what your theories are!

Let’s be honest, Neomuna was made last second. Some people have this unhealthy mindset that the story we ended up with was the one we were always intended to get since D1. I’m sorry but that’s just not true. The narrative we ended the Light and Dark Saga was not planed with “We will reveal this Phouka that follows Elsie Bray which came from a hidden-civilization more advanced then the golden age hidden in Neptune and the Darkness-version of the Traveler is there and Phoukas are made of Nanites more advanced that SIVA made by-“

You get the point. It’s time to be honest with ourselves, what do you think Elsie’s Fish was envisioned to be during Beyond Lights development? Who made it and why? Did Bungie have any original plan for it at all, or did they just throw something new in for trailer hype?? Give me your thoughts!

If we are in a Taoist universe we have "From the one come the two, from the two come the three, from the three come the ten thousand myriad things." The one and two and fundamental aspects of the universe (light and dark) and definitely don't have what we could consider personalities. If we are in a Hindu universe we have the axel of the universe which projects the primary avatars of creation, preservation, and destruction.

So the winnower would be Shiva and The Witness would be a primary avatar. Is the Gardener a creator or a tender? Either way within both cosmologies I feel like we are missing a major player or a cosmological force.

As we already know the other elements in the game are based on real life physical concepts:

• Solar - thermodynamics
• Arc - electromagnetism
• Void - gravitational force / vacuum energy / dark energy
• Stasis - entropy

Strand is notable exception as it comes from the Weave, which is something we don't quite have a real life equivalent to.

This older post does a great job of breaking down the scientific and philosophy behind Strand.

Well, it looks science is getting closer to cracking the science behind how consciousness works and the interconnectedness of it: https://www.popularmechanics.com/science/a62373322/quantum-theory-of-consciousness/

Your Consciousness Can Connect With the Whole Universe, Groundbreaking New Research Suggests

A RECENT GROUNDBREAKING EXPERIMENT in which anesthesia was administered to rats has convinced scientists that tiny structures in the rodents’ brains are responsible for the experience of consciousness. To pull it off, these microscopic hollow tube structures, called “microtubules,” don’t rely on our everyday flavor of classical physics. Instead, experts believe, microtubules perform incredible operations in the quantum realm. Citing the work of earlier researchers, the study infers that the same kind of quantum operations are likely happening in human brains.

The notion that quantum physics must be the underlying mechanism for consciousness first emerged in the 1990s, when Nobel Prize-winning physicist Roger Penrose, Ph.D., and anesthesiologist Stuart Hameroff, M.D., popularized the idea that neural microtubules enable quantum processes in our brain, giving rise to consciousness. Specifically, they postulated in a 1996 paper that consciousness may operate as a quantum wave passing through the brain’s microtubules. This is known as Orch OR theory, referring to the ability of microtubules to perform quantum computations through a mathematical process Penrose calls “objective reduction.”

If this quantum theory of consciousness tied to microtubules turns out to be correct, it could revolutionize our understanding of consciousness and even strengthen the trailblazing theory that, on a quantum level, consciousness is capable of being in all places at the same time. In other words, it can exist everywhere simultaneously, suggesting that your own consciousness can hypothetically connect with quantum particles beyond your brain, maybe entangling with consciousness all across the universe.

Hello, I’ve been rather deeply interested in Destiny’s paracausal forces for a while now. I decided to write my thoughts on something I used to see as an inconsistency. It’s obvious that the nature of Darkness was not 100% decided by the writers for quite some time, but there were apparent patterns in the lore that people noticed. By the time I invested myself in this community when Witch Queen dropped, it seemed like there were a couple of tenets:

1. The Darkness is the result of the Winnower trying to “win” the flower game via a final shape, which means life will eventually come to an unbeatable perpetual form. This is what the Vex were before the Destiny universe was started by the Gardener inserting itself into reality. What this means is that Darkness is associated with death and what we’d call “evil” because it disregards what it deems weak.
2. The Darkness must be taken, not given. There are no Darkness ghosts going out and giving Darkness powers. You need to earn it yourself, and if you are reliant in some way on something else (Hive worms for example) there is a price (your worm will eventually eat you)
3. Darkness subclasses are inversions of Light ones and remove or take something. I highly recommend reading LettuceDifferent’s posts theorizing opposites to Arc and Void. Regardless of their accuracy (they aren’t bad theories at all, it’s just that it’s impossible to predict Destiny), they’re great reads and still very insightful to this day.

These were very satisfying. Then the Lightfall showcase dropped and they said that the Darkness was defined by psychic abilities. Huh? Sure, Darkness was known to have a consciousness element to it (Stasis was described as intelligent and self-correcting, which explained its nerfs in Witch Queen) but it didn’t really feel like that was the core principle of Darkness. There was an apparent discontinuity that left me a little unhappy. It felt like the lore was once again confused on what Darkness should be. It’s hard to see how freezing things in blue crystals was a psychic ability.

I ruminated quite a bit on this (because my interest in this lore has become an obsession) and tried to resolve some of these discrepancies. I believe I have something that is once again satisfying, but it is more complicated (ironic, considering this is the Darkness) than before. That’s fine. Let’s talk about it.

I’ll just drop my main argument here:

The Darkness maintains its previous defining feature as a force of simplification by virtue of it dwelling in a formless state, that state being the mind. The Light adds physical complexity, the Darkness only twists that complexity to its bidding, and therefore maintains the Winnower’s ideals.

Think about how the Light subclasses work. You literally summon whatever energy you need, paracausally. You add to the universe, you make it more complex. Now, think about how the Dark subclasses work. Stasis removes entropy and Strand pulls from the pre-existing Weave. Note that with my interpretation, Stasis and Strand are not the blue crystals and the green strings, those are essentially a byproduct of the Darkness ability you are using. This is congruent with the lore, which has implied that the parts of Darkness you see are actually fluid and could vary depending on the user. In other words, Darkness is the process and not the physical effect. There is nothing being added with Darkness, only shaped through the mind. I use that term deliberately, I think it is very closely linked to the goal of the Winnower and the Witness. The Winnower’s whole goal was to show that reality always results in a final shape, no matter what happens. It would be counter to that argument for the Winnower to be so active in the new universe, so it is as passive as it can be, to the point where it doesn’t have a physical manifestation (the Veil is basically not physical, it barely has mass). It doesn’t add anything, but it does whisper in your mind, and if someone were strong enough to wield it (tying into survival of the fittest), they can derive power from it.

That last statement is another illustrative example of how the Darkness, as a psychic force, embodies simplification. The Light comes from an external physical source; your Ghost. To be empowered by the Light is to be given it by another and therefore multiplicity is inherent to the Light. The Darkness, coming from one’s mind and therefore having no physical source (in its purest form that is, Pyramid shards and worms are basically proxies) is inherently singular and “simpler” than a Ghost-Risen pair.

So points 2 and 3 are still valid. What about 1? This may be the hardest connection. Psychic powers are obviously not synonymous with death. However, because Darkness is the realm of the formless mind, the closer you are to becoming one with the Darkness, the less form you have (since you are discarding the physical body that the Light provides) and therefore the “more dead” you are. Consider how Strand weavewalking turns you into a sort of phantom. Or how Taken are sterile neutrinos, barely having mass. Or how Nezarec lives on in death through curses and nightmares. Or how the Qugu were specifically noted to use the Darkness to commune with dead ancestors. Or how the Witness’s species had to cast off their bodies to become the Witness. We like to think that only the Light provides immortality, but really Darkness does as well. It’s just that the kind of immortality it gives is more in line with what we would call dead. Paradoxical, but I hope it makes sense.

Finally, I’d like to add that I may not have given the lore as much credit as it deserves. As inconsistent as Destiny can be, the Darkness as a psychic force was implied as early as Taken King. The Osmium sisters were given powers based on discovery, cunning, and conquest. In other words, concepts. Their strength was in many ways corporal (besides Taking and Hive magic) but the source was in Darkness. And that Darkness was just as “mental” as the Darkness we wield today is.

Basically title. Before light 3.0, the light subclasses had different Codes (Titans) Attunments (Warlocks) and Ways (Hunters), associated with supers, abilities, etc. Ex. Banner Shield for Titan fell under the "Code of the Commander" subclass tree for Sentinel, while Well of Radiance fell under "Attunement of Grace" for Dawnblades.

My question is; what would the new supers (Twilight Arsenal, Storm's Edge, and Song of Flame)'s corresponding Code, Attunement, and Ways be called? I wanna hear what you guys think

The person who first wrote Nezarecs Sin lore tab must feel like this: 🤩

The person who wrote Variks using ether to grow taller, declare himself Kell of Kells and Judgement Kell must feel like this: 😔

House of Kings were done dirty, but Variks and House Judgement were done even more dirty. Massive missed opportunity to not have Variks and his house become an actual force, something like a mysterious, ONI-type of organization from Halo. Intelligence gatherers who hold secrets and are only loosely on our side.

They abandoned that plot thread so hard, Variks now claims in Act 1 that he only ever said that because he was “under the influence of darkness” like, jesus dude, I know you feel like you made a mistake, but there’s literally no evidence for that.

And before someone says “he could have been influenced by darkness as he’s never stated he wanted to grow house judgement before” not true. In D1 House of Wolves DLC he would say things like “One House falls…another rises.”

This is the hardest heel-turn since “there is only one Warmind”

However, there is a single, small hint this Episode that House Judgement still may yet live. In a lore tab (can’t remember where, sorry. I think on a weapon?) Variks and Eido are talking. Variks seems to be acting like a mentor to her. He says “Variks is a Scribe of House Judgement. Are you?” Eido replies, “I want to be! Eventually. But…” She is still worried about her father. Ultimately we don’t know if anything will come of this. It seems Variks knows that Eido can have a future bigger than House Light, as she has a chance to act as a mediator between House Light and House Salvation civilians who now both live in the city together, and probably get into fights often. What do you think will happen? Will House Judgement return to glory and respect?

Personally I doubt it. I’ve been fooled once…

Just curious, I suppose any of the ahamkara pieces are ours? Idk tho, I'm very new to destiny lore

How do titles work? Like do you need to do certain challenges and prove yourself in iron banner before Saladin knights you as an Iron Lord?