Hello all,

I live in a fairly flat city. Our best hill is 15 minutes drive away, its 30m in elevation in 300m of distance. With snow and ice coming in that hill doesnt get plowed. Last year I fell and hit my knee hard and also got my car stuck in snow already. So I would like to find another option.

Stair machines are really expensive. But I was wondering if something like this would be good: https://www.proformfitness.ca/hiit-trainers/pro-hiit-h14 ?

I guess the other option I have is getting a gym membership and using their stair machine.

Any other tips or ideas on training for hills would be great as well. Thanks

All I can think is, don’t freak out… don’t freak out…. but I’m freaking out. About 2 weeks ago I was doing my 26 mile run and at 10 miles my hamstring totally started seizing up to the point where I couldn’t go faster than walking pace. I shut it down as soon as I felt it in hopes to not actually pull it. It’s been 2 weeks now and although I can walk fine, it still is very bothersome. I took about a week and a half off, stretched, got a deep disuse message, did some electric therapy, and I can still feel it. I did a very slow 6 miles 2 days ago and it felt fine, but did more with the TENS unit.

I don’t have much time left and I need to do some long runs. I’m kind of freaking out and the mind demons are creeping in about a DNF. I will not pull out or give up on this, but I need some help. Who else has had a nagging injury before a big race? What did you do?

Edit: Arches ultra 50M, January 25th

What’s an absolute necessity in your warm up? I’m being bold assuming any of you do even warm up haha

I want to try to up my calories/carbs intake on long runs/races but do not want to break the bank using gels and other carb products. Do you guys have any home made recipes that are still good fuel or cheaper options ?

Context, I have a couple rugged 100miles and multi day events under my belt but will up my training in prep of Bigfoot200 next year.

I am planning on doing a 100 miler in early fall 2026. I am trying to plan in advance. What should I look for when building a crew to support me? None of my friends run but they are very athletic people. Do I need a pacer for a 100 mile race? Sorry for all the questions, I am still new to the ultra community. Came from the marathon world.

I am trying to create a running gel for a business idea, and I really want to make this gel different and special, so I can really serve what an ultra runner would want.

I have a few questions:

1. I what is your least favorite part about the current gels/fueling strategys that are out there.

2. if you could change one thing about the average gel, what would that thing be?

3. what frustrates you the most about current gels.

4. what is your favorite, carb / electrolyte / calorie mix in a gel.

These questions would help me out alot, and hey, maybe you in the future to with a gel that's design around your own specific needs. Thank you!!

Every thread I've found through search about "How to calculate pace for first ultra?" the answers are typically "pace doesn't matter, just finish".

I want to enter a 120km ultra late next year, and I'd like to be able to calculate my possible/potential pace or finish time (based off of my marathon time) to have an idea of whether or not I'll be able to finish within the 15 hour time limit.

ChatGPT says that with a 4:45:00 marathon time I should expect to finish 120km in around 17 hours. But we all know how accurate ChatGPT is.

Are there any decent rules of thumb for calculating this?

I've heard conventional wisdom is to get good at the shorter distances first and then work your way up to ultras. I didn't do that... ultras captured my imagination when I was in addiction and in really rough shape, mentally and physically. I got sober and took 3 years to go from nothing to 50k, and then 2 more years to do my first 50 miler a month ago - the vast majority of those 5 years was spent in Zone 2. I'm still pretty slow. I haven't gone for broke but Garmin estimates my 5k time as 22 minutes. Some of that is body composition (I'm currently working to lose about 10 lbs of extra fat).

After my 50 miler my body feels fine, good even, but mentally I'm still wholly uninterested in long slow runs (and fueling long runs, and worrying about bonking in the backcountry, etc). In the month since the 50 milers I have been finding a lot of enjoyment in upping my strength training, and in running doing much more speed work.

I'm wondering about shifting focus for the next ~9 months. Wondering about a fast 5k, or maybe even a 5 minute mile (probably too bold, but solidly sub 6 min mile would still be cool). My thoughts are:

1. I work hardest when I feel inspired and feel I may have, after 5 years of focus on slow distance, temporarily used up my inspiration for ultra training.

2. I'm mid 30s and have heard speed goes well before endurance, so feel like if I ever want to get "fast", now is better than later.

3. Building speed now should allow me to bring a little more speed back to ultras in future.

Have you done something like this before? Am I just in a typical post 50 miler rut? What do you think is a reasonable speed goal for someone in my position? thanks!

Hi all,

Some help please. I’m an experienced marathon runner, aged 37, and I’ve run one 60km/2500m ultra this year (TEC Black Mountains Ultra - 12th in 8hrs). I’m running my first 100k next May ’25 - UTS 100k with 6500m elevation.

But I’m also halfway through a road marathon plan for a race in early February (Pfitz 18/70), to try and bag a Boston qualifying time that will actually get me into the race (I ran 2.59.05 to qualify this year, but it still wasn’t fast enough to make the cut off!)

That will leave 12 weeks between races, and between switching the training focus from roads and speed to ultras and elevation. I have the impression 12 weeks to specialise on elevation could work off the back of an 18 week marathon plan, particularly if I mix in some long hill runs - BUT it doesn’t allow any recovery time after the marathon.

Do you think that is possible / reasonable, or will I be massively compromising my conditioning for UTS by running a marathon all out 12 weeks out?

How far out do I really need to start focusing fully on the elevation? And is there a good plan you’d recommend for the step up to a mountainous 100k? UTS is probably the A-goal in this scenario, the marathon before it in Feb the less important goal.

I’m running decent distance - averaging 50-80km per week for the last year and a half or so (80-100k at present), and geared my training towards elevation for my last ultra in the final 8 weeks or so after another marathon block, but that was significantly less bumpy.

Thoughts and suggestions for good mountainous ultra training plans very welcome. (Sorry in advance if this has been asked many times before).

Thank you all!

Anyone here ever decide to walk/power hike an entire 100 miler due to injury or some other reason? How did it turn out?

The reason I’m asking is I’ve attempted 3 times now and always burn out around mile 60. I’ve dialed in my consistency, I’ve upped my mileage and maintained it for a couple of years even in the off season, and I still end up dropping by 60. I’ve been training for around 3 years now, this past year keeping my mileage above 40-50 miles every week. I know that I’m way too heavy for an ultra runner, 6’1” 250 pounds, and it feels like that plays a big part. But most of the last couple of years I’ve either been training for a race or just trying to build up my base mileage and neither of those are too compatible with eating in a calorie deficit.

My most recent DNF was in October and I decided to take at least a year off to dial back some mileage, lose some weight, and add in strength training. Then we found out a week after the race that my wife is pregnant and due in June, and that year off from racing might turn into two with a brand new baby on top of everything else we have going on. So I decided to give it one last try before the baby comes and signed up for another race in March.

I’m making this post because I had this idea during a run a few days ago that at this weight I’m less of a runner and more of a rucker, carrying extra body weight instead of a weighted pack. And that gave me the idea that I can train like a rucker for this race instead of trying the same stuff and I might be successful finally. Then take the time off, lose the weight and finish a 100 miler running the way I always wanted. Looking at my past races over 50 miles my pace ends up averaging out to around 16min/mile. People who finish in the 29th hour average out to 17-18min/mile. So why not start walking from the beginning with 14-15min/miles and get rid of half the impact forces for the race?

I want to get some thoughts on this approach before I change my training to power hiking 10-12 hours per week instead of jogging. I tried it out the past two days and I’m able to maintain an intensity that keeps me in the bottom end of my zone 2. Thanks

Been browsing some 100k training plans. I've noticed a few, for example, those provided by Ultrarunning magazine are periodizing by training feature. If I was to simplify their block order, I would describe as Intervals, Tempo(upper), Tempo(lower), Long Runs, Taper. I noticed a few other ultra training plans are also starting with higher intensity work like intervals/tempo then building up volume without returning the intensity work at the end. All of them seem to highlight back to back long runs, and that makes sense to me.

I am a little confounded by this ordering though. Most marathon training books I have focus on base building and end with higher intensity intervals. Essentially the blocks would go in the opposite order. The common explanation offered is that taking the adaptations from intervals/speedwork is (much) faster than that of the long runs, and would probably be lost if not maintained throughout the training.

Mostly for my own curiosity, I'd like to understand what the motivation is for starting with higher intensity work for ultra training. Without any guidance I would probably just sprinkle it in once a week somewhere to stay balanced, but I'm trying to learn more about the topic and various associated reasoning.

Thanks!

I ran my first ever 100mi race on Saturday and wanted to get some of my reflections down while they're fresh. The race was the Fall Creek 100 in Fall Creek Falls state park in Middle Tennessee. It's a beautiful, well-maintained park and my family had a blast exploring it while I was out running. The course was 4 26mi laps and had a good variety of nice packed dirt trail, more technical sections of running on all roots and rocks, segments of ankle deep leaves with roots and rocks hiding beneath, and some road to make up time from the technical sections (and kill my feet). Total elevation gain was around 11,500ft. The race was well organized with good communication from the RDs, top notch aid stations with enthusiastic volunteers (love you all - thanks for being my recurring "light at the end of the tunnel"), and a good mix of nutrition/hydration available to keep the calories flowing.

Training:

Prior to this, my longest race was a 50mi (this same event last year). I've also done a few 50ks as well. From those, I knew that the uphills and downhills were my biggest weakness because it's hard to find a hill to train on in my neck of the woods. I added weighted step ups to my training regimen for the last 2 months and felt that they helped tremendously. Aside from that, I was running 65-75mi per week every week split about 1/2 trail and half road (I have a 2mi road run to make it to a 5mi trail near my home). I don't have a strict training plan - I base my runs on how my body feels each day.

What went right:

-I felt great this race. Even starting lap 4 at 75mi, I was still feeling great. I slowed down, but my muscles were still working and I didn't have any major pain.

-I took a risk and used a new shoe for this race. I had been in Saucony Xodus 2s which were comfortable, but the toebox was a hair narrow for me. I'd end up with numb toes and losing toenails on my big toes on any race 50k+. I tried Altra Experience Wilds for this one. I did get one gnarly blister on the outside of my big toe, but no numbness and I think my toenails are safe this time. I may keep searching for the perfect shoe, but this was an improvement.

-Lighting - I added a Kogalla RA to the mix and love it. I hated the idea of it needing its own battery pack, but was able to get it running on 18650s like my headlamp (Ledlenser MH10) and backup flashlight. For anyone else looking to do the same, I had luck with the Ledlenser Flex3. I used Vapcell N40 4000mah 18650s and never had any fear of running out of power.

-Nutrition/hydration. My plan was 500ml of water with 1 scoop of tailwind and 1 huma gel every hour and a few bites of real food at each aid station. This worked great. No digestive issues and no energy crashes. I had 2 small issues I'll talk about below

-Caffeine Bullet. These were brand new to me, but seemed like they'd be nice during the night. It's just a caffeinated chew candy, but I loved having them for the small bursts of calories and caffeine. They tasted like crap before the race (caffeine is bitter and I'm a bitter super-taster), but like heaven 70mi in.

-Vest - I run with a Salomon Adv Skin 12. I like the vest, but it rubs where my neck meets my shoulders raw to the point where they'll be bloody on any longer runs. I just leukotaped the hell out of that area this time and never even thought about my vest for the whole race.

-Poles - these are new to me. I've been training with them, but never really needed them much as a flatlander. It may have been a placebo, but those poles were a lifesaver in the last 20mi. Salomon quiver was so unobtrusive that I just ran with them the entire race and they didn't bother me at all.

-EDIT: one thing I forgot to mention - A good audiobook! This helped pass the time so much. I'm listening to the Stormlight Archive by Brandon Sanderson. Each book is over 50hrs long, so no worry of running out of content.

What went wrong:

-Aid stations had huma gels, so I started depending on those instead of loading from my drop bag between loops. This worked great for laps 2 and 3, but they started to run out at lap 4 and I felt it.

-I got off of my hydration plan because trying to open and split the individual tailwind packs was a pain to juggle, so I started to rely on aid station electrolyte drinks. I don't think this hurt in the long run (pun intended), but it definitely was a risk and at a minimum wasn't as palatable as the Tailwind Naked I normally drink.

-This didn't happen to me, but a general warning. Temp was like 16 degrees when the race started. Everyone that had flasks with straws had the same issue - water froze in the straws and they couldn't drink until it thawed. It warmed up pretty quickly, but was still a scary predicament for a lot of people. Luckily our overnight temps didn't drop as low - I don't know what people would have done.

-EDIT: One other thing I forgot about - Chapstick! I don't normally get chapped lips, but 31 hours of mouth breathing does things. My worst race recovery symptom is these cracked burning lips.

All in all an amazing experience and I'm already starting to plan for my next race. Feel free to ask any questions or reach out at any time. I know I got a ton of support from this group during training, and would love to pay it forward in any way possible.

Any pro-tips for this schedule? I'm flying on Friday for my 100on Saturday and typically try to get to the town 48 hous before. Had to push it closer due to work and life schedules.

I'm coming from central time to eastern time and the flight is about 2 hours (leave at 7 am land at about 10am est).

Any pro-tips?

I'm getting ready to build to a 50 miler in April and I'm unsure of what I should do for training my gut.

In 2022, I did an Ironman focusing on a low carb diet before and during all long rides/runs, swims, and non intense workouts. Otherwise I ate carbs after to help with recovery and before/during intense workouts.

All the research I've been exposed to is that high carbs always is best. However, I wonder if this is because the high performing athletes already have an efficient fat-burning fuel engine.

Would doing a high carb diet slow the growth of an average person's fat burning ability, thus their "all day" zone?

Hope this makes sense.

Background: I’ve done several 100’s with 10-15k of elevation gain, this one I did on Saturday had 800ft of total gain. My body is so wrecked, never seen my feet swell like that before and can barely walk two days later. Other ultras with gain I was definitely sore, but nothing like this. Can anyone explain this, or am I just crazy? I’m wondering if it’s because you’re using the same muscle group over and over again and not getting the breakup of the hills and downhills.

Same training as prior races.

Hello! I am training for my first 50K and just hit 12 miles. I had no idea what I committed to with this and just gave it a full send. I got a Coros pace 3 and use their 50K plan. Its going well but now I find myself wanting to get more in depth than I thought I would. I thought this would be just throw some power bars in a ruck and send it, but now I'm looking to optimize my setup as I see others talking about it. I have the following questions for people who have successfully done one.

1. What are people eating during this run? I've been using the GUs, assorted gels (I've liked the Maurten gels and bars so far), nuun tablets, cliff bloks, and some others like that, but I feel like I need to be a bit more intentional since after this 12 miler, I was pretty weak. I had something every 4 miles starting at 0 and ending at 8. My buddy is a big bike rider and he/s recommending B12 shots and pickle juice. What are you guys eating and how do you set up a good nutrition plan. There are a few aid stations that you can place things ahead of time at so you can refill/refit along the run. What do you put in there? Do people hit subway the day before and put a turkey club and a beer in there for when they get to it the next day?

2. What are you using as a storage unit? I have a standard camelbak that I've had for awhile, but it doesn't have any pockets on the front. I like the vests that have the small bottles on the front for electrolyte drinks as well as the bladder in the back along with a spot for storage of food items. Nathan has been recommended. Do you have any other brands or things to think about when choosing a camelback/vest/water carrier like setup or even other items I haven't thought about on the trail that I may find useful? I know those who don't fret ounces will sweat pounds. I'm looking to be as streamlined as possible. I want to limit rebuying things. If there is a best option or a really good brand I would rather go straight to it than find out about it right before/during the event and double my spending.

3. The actual event is in Arizona in the black hills. I've hiked a 50K but that was all at a walking pace with trekking poles and the elevation change was about 12k feet. This one is significantly less than that. I plan on taking poles with me and getting some that trifold and are very light? Is this a good/bad idea. Why?

4. Is it normal to be spending so much on this? I blinked and I have 3 pairs of shoes that were $150. I have a feeling that this whole endeavor is going to cost me around $1500 by the time I cross the finish line. Is this normal and something I should expect if I want to keep going or is more of an upfront cost? Do you have any good ways you have gotten you supplies or been smart with your budget while setting yourself up in an optimal way. I'm not cheap and I plan to do the best that I can with my prep work, but also make things go as far as possible.

5. Do people care medical supplies/other small items with them like moleskin or other small items? What about spare socks? Should I put some of those items in the aid station boxes? Should I put another pair of shoes at the halfway point to change into once I get there.

6. What am I not thinking about? What should I be doing? If there is anything I don't know, please feel free to treat me like a small child and explain it like I am an idiot.

If you are still reading I look forward to your sharing your wisdom and experience.

In the spririt of David roche I’m on the hunt for a wide carbon plate trail running shoe. What’s my alternatives?

I’m training for my first 100K which is less than 6 weeks out now. I just finished a 50K race on Saturday that I used as my longest training run of this cycle, and feel pretty good, minus some blisters on my toes and some muscle tightness. I ran 51 miles last week, including the race, which is usually what I peak at for ultras (typically run 40-45 mpw).

I took Sunday off (my usual rest day) as well as today, just doing short walks and yoga. Usually after a 50K distance, I would take a week off running, but since I only have a few weeks left of training before taper, I don’t want to lose a whole week to recover, especially since I feel decent. But at the same time I don’t want to risk injuring myself and not being able to do my goal race.

I’m thinking of getting back out on the trails tomorrow for an easy 3-4 miles and seeing how my body feels, but should I be taking a few more days off before getting back into it, or am I good to start easing back in right away, and then trying to build my mileage for a couple more weeks before taper?

Hey all! 45 yo female here. So, I finished my 3rd ultra in a year yesterday. I have to say I also ran a marathon in October. My body’s been in constant training mode since Jan 2024. I got my best time for 50k yesterday 7:30- beating my June time of 8:30 (I know I’m slow)! Anyways, I really wonder if the constant training cycles have helped or if it was the weather or maybe, my running partner I had this time (I’m typically a solo runner). The run in June was on the same trail with peak heat of 102 degrees Fahrenheit & the temp was 15 degrees Fahrenheit just before I started running. I can say my nutrition is so-so, my sleep could use some help. This training cycle (August to now) I’ve skipped some key long runs, but I’m consistent with running the rest of my runs. Weekly mileage is actually kinda low with 15-25 miles per week.

I have a 48 hour run at the end of March- hoping to get 100 miles, but really anything over 50 miles will be amazing to me. So next training plan I’m chilling until January, with weight training 2x a week starting next week and light cardio 3x a week. I’m going to add more hills training as I saw that amp up my aerobic capacity quicker than I expected. I want to dial in nutrition too. I won’t be doing as many Ultra trail races next year (maybe one in the spring & 1 in the fall) & I’m going to scratch marathons road races this year too. Any other suggestions?

Hey, everyone! I'm running in my first stage race, a 165-kilometer stage race over five days. I've run three road marathons, three ultras with decent elevation –– most recently a 48K with 2,500 meters of ascent / descent in early November.

I took some time off to recover and focus on weight training a bit. Now, I'm obviously looking to get miles under my legs again.

Biggest tip I've gotten is to practice running / hiking with a heavy pack on to simulate the race. But I'd love any other tips, especially how much running per week I should be doing leading up to the race on January 18th.

Cheers!

I am signing up for a 140k race over 3 days, (which isn't that bad), but the hard part about the race is you have to push a wheelbarrow the whole time

First day is 42km second day is 65km, third day is 33km

I have a run a 50km before (around 6 hours, so nothing fast), run a marathon and run 5-10km a day 5-6 days a week at the moment

I have 6 months to train for this race, but because its not just a normal run, I have no clue how to train for it

I am thinking I need to do a lot of farmer carries, as this is essentially like carrying a wheelbarrow, but without the hassle of having a wheelbarrow

Has anyone ever done a race similar to this, or have any ideas for how to train for this?

When you do fit lifting (predominantly lower body) into your running program? Do you do it on your off days (I run 5 days per week), immediately after running, run in the am and lift in the pm?

I just finished my best 50k and was curious what everyone else normally sees percentage wise for their heart rate zones. Always a struggle to know of I'm pushing it too hard or two easy 😅 It did have some good elevation so staying in zone 2 was not going to happen on those hills in a timely manner.

Hi. I ran my first 50-miler last night. I’ve never entered even a 10K before. But I enjoy running. Longest run before yesterday was 14 miles.

I left the run last night and was okay (obviously sore), but when I went to swallow and chew something, it felt like my throat was on fire. Is this normal. First few sips were normal and now it almost burns as I swallow. Any advice or thoughts? Thanks.

UPDATE: I just left the ENT and did some lidocaine spray and tube down my nose (not enjoyable). She said things looked great. The air was likely too cold (29°) and dried out the area in your throat. It seems great now. I hope this helps anyone running in the cold. The doctor’s advice was that a trail running wrap for the face would’ve helped a lot.

Hi! I have scanned reddit for an answer to my problem, but no luck... I usually eat 250-300cal/hour and feel fine. Then i refill my bag at aid stations (water and food) and eat on the spot. I wonder if the "extra" calories I eat at the aid station that don't count in the 250-300 cal could be the reason why I feel nauseous and extra full in the last 15k?

I don't know how much I drink, maybe 750ml every 2H?

Thanks!

hey all, my first post here long time lurker. Quick background: 51yo, two forms of cancer (colorectal and bladder cancer), many surgeries from 2021 to 2023, 3 types of chemo, 1 immunotherapy, bladder removed in 2022, and other unspeakable horrors. Started running with cancer diagnosis in 2021. 2022 starting out in rough shape, built up to my first ever marathon in Philadelphia a few weeks ago. A slow time for most at 4:18, but for me this was huge achievement given the context.

Post marathon I got the go ahead to train for 50 miler from my coach, I was flying so high, then I got the news that the cancer came back and has metastisized. Totally gutted...but I am rallying. I likely have more chemotherapy and surgery to come, it won't end well being a guarantee, so I'm looking for recommendations for winter maybe early spring ultras before the shit hits the fan. Ideally easy coast USA but I will consider traveling. I'm guessing 50k but maybe, 50M, 100k although the if I can those distances. Despite the diagnosis I am currently not fast but strong and fit for the time being. Lots of ST and up to 40 miles per week but I have more in me and will continue build.

I am also considering creating my own one-person ultra and use that as a fundraiser for cancer research.

This is a bucket list item for me and may not be possible but I need to give it a go.

Thanks in advance. Admiring you all and please do not take ever your body for granted. Thanks in advance for any thoughts or ideas.

PSA: get colonoscopies starting at age 45, and if you ever have a burning sensation when urinating don't assume UTI, get it checked.

Edit: I should have mentioned that one side effect of my cancers is heat intolerance, so ideally looking for cold, cool, even warm ultras. Despite being fairly strong heat has been my kryptonite.

Edit #2: Wow the response has been so incredible. While I've put on a strong face, this has been an extremely challenging time for me. Thank you all for suggestions, support, and love! The diagnosis is so recent I have no idea what the treatment plan might look like, but as I work with the doctors on the next steps, I'm taking all the suggestions into consideration and especially appreciate the offers to run or crew me. I'm just blown away. Thank you to such an amazing community ❤️❤️❤️❤️

I should clarify that I’ve technically completed a 50k trail ultramarathon before, but that was way back in 2018. It’s been so long that I’m basically starting from scratch, so I’m calling this my “first” ultramarathon attempt. When I finished that 50k, I’d trained for only seven weeks, which was a pretty reckless move—my body completely broke down during the last 15km of technical trails.

Fast forward to this year: I’ve logged almost 300 hours in zone 1/zone 2 training, with around 200 of those hours spent on the bike. Next year, I’ll have more free time and plan to consistently train 10+ hours per week, gradually increasing my running mileage. Over the past six months, though, I’ve had some minor issues that kept me from long runs, so I focused on lower-volume weeks to rebuild strength and stay consistent.

Now, I’m looking at the Julian Alps Trail ultramarathon on the weekend of September 20th. I’d initially set my sights on the 80km distance, which already felt like a big challenge. But my friend—who’s all about going big—says he’ll only join me if we both tackle the 120km race.

So, I’m torn. Is aiming for the 120km simply asking for trouble, or could it be achievable if I commit fully to training? I feel confident I can develop the metabolic endurance with proper prep, especially since I’ll also be training for a 20+ hour ultra bike race in late June. What really concerns me is whether my legs and feet can handle the sheer strain of such a long run without breaking down completely.

Any advice from those who’ve been in a similar spot? Is this realistic, or should I stick with my original 80km plan?