/r/starcraft2coop
A place to discuss Starcraft 2 Co-op (SC2 Co-op)!
Offenders will receive warnings. Repeat offenders will be banned.
1) If you wish to promote weekly mutation videos, post them under the weekly mutation mod post. Do not make a separate post for them.
2) READ THE WIKI before asking questions. It has a lot of information.
3) Don't be an asshole.
4) No spam.
5) No low effort posts. This includes "X exp away from leveling up" posts.
6) No "when will we have a new commander/map?" posts.
7) Self-promotion posts must be posted in the weekly megathread.
It is a two player cooperative mode with campaign-style objectives.
Mutations add special modifiers to Co-op Missions, rewarding bonus experience.
Unlocks units and abilities.
Separate for each commander.
Increases power level.
Shared across all commanders.
Does not affect power level.
Shared across all commanders.
Rewards badge emoticons.
Maguro has designed some custom mutations to mimic a mini-campaign.
/r/starcraft2coop
We 1 shot 2x +6's, only got to see what our next one would be:
š¹ļøMap: Void Launch šøļøMutators: Polarity, Mutually assured destruction, Avenger, Outbreak. š¹ļøEnemy Comp: Terran Shadow Tech (Reaper, Liberator, Raven, Battlecruiser)
Thx for feedback!
I played a couple of games against Terran AI in coop today, and it felt like the waves never stopped coming and they are massive. Is it just me? I actually don't mind it, but it seems much different than zerg or protoss AI
Just wondering: Is the best unit composition for Artanis when dealing with random mutations on Brutal+ and above really just Dragoons and Tempests?
A lot of mutations heavily punish melee units, and while I really like High Templars, their shorter range (compared to upgraded Dragoons) makes them vulnerable. They often get nuked because they end up on the front line. The Dragoon range upgrade seems essential for handling many of these mutations.
I also find that mass towers, despite Artanis having terrible static defense, work better as a mineral dump since he lacks mobility to be at both places to attack and defend at the same time, even with P2 (Nexus Legate)āwhich feels like a scam prestige because mobility is way too expensive to spam. massing Towers if anything just buy some time until your units catch up.
What do you guys think?
100% of gas goes to Carriers
All excess minerals goes to Zealots
Some gas is spared for upgrades/personalities.
I know I know, everywhere I read says carriers are bad not cause they can't clear the map but because game is over long before you get enough carriers.
But purifier carriers are so pretty and carriers are not viable in vanilla!!!
edit: For Brutal+1.
Map: DoN --- Terran: Tanks, Thor, Science V's and a ton of Ravens roaming around. Ghosts/nukes later on. Stanks --- Mutators: Moment of silence (heroic dies: 12secs no attacks), DoubleEdged (Take dmg dealt), Heroes (GG), Mags. --- Had time for 3 attempts, couldn't muster up enough offense to clear map within night 4, overwhelmed. Nova nuke plus 3-5 heroes in waves are OP AF š .
ideas??
Mutation #452: Rumble in the Jungle / Map: Mist Opportunities
Mutators: Aggressive Deployment, We Move Unseen, Temporal Field
Aggressive Deployment
Additional enemy units are periodically deployed onto the battlefield.
Spawns are separate for each player.
The first spawn is at {6:10/ 5:40/ 5:20/ 4:50}.
Additional spawns each {4:10/ 3:50/ 2:50/ 2:10}.
Drop locations prioritize player's units. Structures, workers, Queens and units with 0 supply (majority of hero units and calldowns) or units with no weapons are excluded.
If no unit is found, drops are randomly spawned in (25,40) distance from starting locations.
If the randomly chosen unit, around which the drop pod will spawn, has no valid ground pathing to the player's starting location, the drop won't spawn at all. This way of preventing drop pods from spawning is generally useful only for commanders with good static defenses or hero only runs.
Size and tech increase as time goes on. <Power, Tech> levels: <1,1> ā <2,1> ā <3,2> ā <4,2> ā <4,3> ā <4,4> ā <5,5> ā <5,6>.
We Move Unseen
All enemy units are permanently cloaked.
Structures are not cloaked.
Hostile Map Objective units are cloaked too.
Destructible Rocks aren't cloaked.
Temporal Field
Enemy Temporal Fields are periodically deployed throughout the map.
Units that enter a Temporal Field are disabled and their timeflow is slowed to 1%.
Heroic units are only slowed, their movement and attack speed are reduced by 50%.
Affected units are detected, revealed and can be attacked.
Temporal Fields spawn each {8/6/4/3} seconds and stay clear of Mutator Safety Zones.
There is 1s delay before Temporal Field becomes active. Each field is active for 20s.
Temporal Field has 1.5 radius and affects both ground and air units.
Ā https://www.maguro.one/p/mutators.html
https://starcraft2coop.com/resources/weeklymutations
https://starcraft2coop.com/resources/mutators
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#33 Rumble in the Jungle ā SOLO ALL CLEAR
Mutators: Aggressive Deployment, We Move Unseen, Temporal Field
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https://youtu.be/t636RwpwU_4 (advice - with a post about almost every commander)
https://youtu.be/Ylx8ZtMJzNQ (easy solo - Nova p1)
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Make extra detectors in case your overseers get wrecked or stuck in a temporal field. Static defense detectors at the bots are also good.
Keep defenses near the bot entrance because some AD waves will fall when the bots are moving out.
In particular, a wave will fall around 15:30 when the 3^(rd) set is moving back, 17:30 when the 4^(th) set is moving out, 20:00 when the 4^(th) set is moving back, and near the end when the 5^(th) set is almost at the starting point.
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For duos: doesnāt really matter as long as you stick together to deal with AD waves
For solo queue: Stetmann, Zeratul, Tychus, Nova
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Successes [and key points]
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL3FSCru5EHIhEEUlvqNi4dphm0igS72zT (playlist with all commanders)
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Ā Questions about any of these runs are welcome. Runs will be uploaded throughout the week. All members get early access to videos.
Nice people in my discord can help you with the mutation: https://discord.gg/WerduSFQQK
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I just had a brutal+1 match in Temple of past while playing kerrigan and my ally was a Raynor, and got the combo of lava, concussive attacks and speed freaks with explosive threat zerg enemy comp. It was pretty hard to do it with these two commanders and we barely won it with 500hp left on Temple and we would have lost it if it went 10 seconds longer. Obviously, we couldn't get the bonus. Apparently lava causes your units to slow down due to concussive attacks mutation and speed freaks make your enemy speed up and it makes it pretty hard to dodge the banelings and I spammed a heck load of nydus. If you had either Raynor or kerrigan what would you have done?
Hello, I'm getting back into playing coop and ultras feel incredibly derpy for Kerrigan at low levels. Do they ever include balance changes in coop?
I used to be able to practice stuff and fully customize the above options. I remember it being some maguros, cant seem to find them. Basically i wasn't to pick a map, let's say TotP, then be able to select enemy comp, add mutators and have the 180 mutator points... is that still possible??
I know that brutal is a good way to level up with short missions but is there a way to get more exp or should i just play more
Map: Temple of the past
Enemy: Masters & Machines (Immortal, Colossus, HTs)
Mutators: Transmutation: Enemies evolve on hits. Avenger: enemies buff up when friendlies die. Mag-nificent: mags spread everywhere. Outbreak: infested spawn continuously. Must kill all 3 bonus'
What do you do?!--, go!!
I randomly came up with an idea for a Nova prestige focused on static defenses. I'm curious if this seems over or underpowered to yall.
Nova Prestige:
Security Specialist
Advantages:
Disadvantages:
Has anyone noticed you can't evolve banelings from zerglings with Zagara? The green timer line doesn't appear and they stay in their egg form forever.
I usually build 3 bunkers then go for gas and start upgrades slowly while getting the expo up.
Whatās your strategy for getting as many infested out while not falling Behind in upgrades and getting the expo ?
what is the minimum mastery point for nova p3 for her to one shot buildings in dead of night?
if you have a full xp commander and you can replace the commander that you want to upgrade with also the full xp in a bugging way, so i want to ask: if ill be banned if i use bug to farm the xp?
some commander just a trash if he/she/it under the 15lvl
I apologize if this is too wordy:
How do you guys recommend setting up your hotkeys for co-op?
I use grid because I like to play random commanders, and this way, I donāt have to memorize specific spell keys. Iāve changed my F2 button to the ` (tilde) key because it feels more comfortable for my hand.
Iāve also set up rapid fire for grid using the text file method. For call-downs, I have them assigned to F3 through F6.
I find that pressing Shift + Tab to go to the previous unit selection is too much work. What button do you guys recommend for that? Currently, Iām using the Space button, which I find unintuitive. I really wish I could use the Ctrl key for this, but it messes up my commands.
Hereās my current control group setup:
Another thing is that Iām an F2 + A-move addict and press it way too much. Plus, I use the F2 key instead of the previous unit type selection key so that I can handle two casters. However, Iām incapable of using three casters simultaneously during a battle.
The problem is that some commanders benefit from avoiding F2 + A-move, such as Tychus P2 or Nova P3.
The reason I donāt use control groups for my armies is that I keep making more and more units, and itās just a hassle to add new units into the existing control groups. The way I currently manage this is by first pressing Select All Army, then Ctrl + Click on a unit type to select all units of the same type, and finally assigning them to control groups 2-4.
Is there a more efficient way to handle this where new units get auto-added to the control group? That would be so great.I
My buddy and i do weekly brutals+ (casual players, but we're okay-- average micro/macro), working our way from Brutal+1-6. This week we 1 shot everything with random comms + random maps, until we hit +6 and we got to this one: Void Rifts, Black death & outbreak on Mist opportunities map... ouch. We only play about an hour per session, but we're 0-2 on this one. Our best attempt was Tychus Tech Recruit & H/H, got to 23mins, and 1 bonus before hybrid waves + black death overwhelmed us. Seems like you need a combo of: super early def (2:15 min), healing to survive black death, and a strong enough offense to stop waves AND clear objectives while dealing with rifts--- all with a delayed army & black death further weakening your army. Its really hard to defend & simultaneously attack with a weakened economy while having your armies/ attention split across the map (rifts). We're stumped, but motivated. Any ideas?
Mutation #451: Violent Night / Map: Void Launch
Mutators: Naughty List, Gift Exchange
Naughty List
Player units and structures take increased damage for each enemy they've killed.
Units and structures take bonus x% damage for each kill they score.
1ā4 kills increase damage taken by 1% each. 5ā14 kills by 4% and 15ā150 kills by 6%.
So for example, units with 20 kills will take +80% damage, with 50 kills +260% damage, with 100 kills +560% damage, and with 150 kills +860% damage.
Carrier, Swarmhosts, Ravens,... take increased damage when their spawns kill units. Their spawned units don't take increased damage.
Respawned heroes take no bonus damage until they kill another unit, then they take full bonus damage.
Tesseract Cannons/Monoliths and their projections don't share kills and debuffs.
Gift Exchange
Gifts are periodically deployed around the map. If you don't claim them, Amon will!
Gifts spawn at 3 minutes and then every 2:10. After 20 minutes, the interval is 1:40 on hard and brutal difficulties.
Gifts spawn at locations >40 from starting locations of player 1, 2 and 3; and if there are no units close (<7).
Claiming gifts takes 20s. Gifts are different for you and your ally.
Amon dispatches units to claim gifts.
If players capture two gifts in a row, Amon will automatically take the next one.
Gifts for players:
Vespene rain! ā Vespene pickups around the map
Chrono Wave!
A HERC! (for terran); A Scout! (for protoss); A Queen! (for zerg) ā free unit
MULE party! ā mules and dancing oracles
... BECOMES AVENGER! ā random unit gains 10 avenger stacks
The Naughty List has been cleared! ā clears naughty list and reset kill count for units
An Archangel!
EVERYTHING IS FREE! (10s)
Healing! (Available only after 8 minutes)
Gifts for Amon:
A Temporary Mutator! ā for 3 minutes, randomly chosen from: Transmutation, Just Die!, Mutually Assured Destruction, We Move Unseen, Alien Incubation, Outbreak, Concussive Attacks, Going Nuclear, Blizzard, Self Destruction
Hidden Threats! ā spawns {10/15/25/30} Widow Mines, Burrowed Banelings or Stasis Wards around the map
Scourge! ā If there are >5 air units spawns Scourge, otherwise:
Banelings!
Hybrid! - summons hybrids
A KILL BOT! ā 30 kills (50 kills after 10:00)
Overcharged Shuttles! ā 80 dps
Shrink Wave! ā All player units are shrunk for 60s. Units deal -50% damage and have -50% life and shields.
Ā https://www.maguro.one/p/mutators.html
https://starcraft2coop.com/resources/weeklymutations
https://starcraft2coop.com/resources/mutators
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#32 Violent Night ā SOLO ALL CLEAR
Mutators: Naughty List, Gift Exchange
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https://youtu.be/H-DTPzOWD2E (advice)
https://youtu.be/6QGV_iS0YOQ (easy solo - Zagara p1)
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Hero commanders will suffer a bit because of naughty list. Be more careful when using them.
Make extra production facilities to prepare for kill bots and everything is free. If you donāt a lot of production facilities, control click your workers and make a lot of structures everywhere. When you start spending money (meaning the 10 seconds is up), cancel the structures and/or return to mining. Youāll end up with a huge bank.
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For duos: Karax/Dehaka and Zagara/Stukov
For solo queue: Zagara, Stukov, Mengsk
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Successes [and key points]
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL3FSCru5EHIjfwd52cx_YtqmEMt5b-J7k (playlist with all commanders)
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Questions about any of these runs are welcome. Runs will be uploaded throughout the week. All members get early access to videos.
Nice people in my discord can help you with the mutation: https://discord.gg/WerduSFQQK
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Iāve mained mengsk for a few years now and I havenāt seen too many other mengsks and Iām wondering which prestige of his is better death merchant or principal proletariat, toxic tyrant is good with mass earthsplitter on certain maps, but for me Iāve always liked principal proletariat with mass bc, bc their Yamato cannon can wipe out an entire wave at tier 3 but I wanna know what other ppl think. Also I do like death merchant itās like bio on crack.
Started playing coop a few days ago and I'm now p0-p2 abathur lvl 15 with only a few mastery points. Many guides say the absolute best unit for Abathur is muta which I can see why because most of Abathur's units are big and slow while fighting. (not considering deep tunnel). And muta is very mobile and can stack on top of each other. But mutas are just so squishy. I thought having lvl 15 with lifesteal is gonna solve the problem but they still die so quickly. Is there a specific way to play muta Abathur or are the posts mostly outdated and the play style got balanced?
I havent had this problem yet, but those locusts from I think lvl 13 that spawn upon enemy death are really making this weeks mutation impossible, especially if the enemy has a comp with many units (spawning lots of locusts, which instatly promote enemies upon death and they die easily).
Is there a way to disable these locusts?
This is my go-to Kerrigan prestige choice. I highly recommend putting at least 19 points into Immobilization Wave Mastery because it has an insane radius of 27 that covers all the push bases and kind of acts like a targeted Time Stop as well. Ideally, max out Research Cost Reduction and Upgrade Efficiency Mastery, so by the time Immobilization Wave becomes active at the 10-minute mark, you can literally have it every 2 minutes thanks to her ability efficiency.
What you need to do is jump in with her ability (Leaping Strike) and then use Immobilization Wave, which with max mastery points destroys almost every non-heroic unit aside from Battlecruisers and Carriers. More importantly, Immobilization Wave with max mastery clears every annoying cloaked unit. After Immobilization Wave, immediately pop out a Nydus Worm, unload your soldiers, and clear whatever is left, which usually isnāt much.
For unit choice, Iād go with 6-7 Ultralisks, and the rest should be Hydralisks. More than 6-7 or 8 Ultralisks will just block each other.
In all prestiges (except P1 - Malevolent Matriarch), Kerrigan has almost the best static defense. Build a Nydus Wall in front, Spore Crawlers behind for air attacks, and no more than 5-6 Lurkers behind the Spore Crawlers to annihilate anything that comes close.
For the love of God, use Nydus Worms and donāt be afraid to spam them. Anyone who says spamming Nydus Worms is bad is wrong. Theyāre extremely useful for mobility, detection, health regeneration, acting as a free wall for static defense, providing vision for call-downs, enabling Spear of Adun and Swannās laser for your ally, spreading creep, distracting the AI by blocking paths for objectives that need protection, and handling mutations like missile bombardments, plus if you play p2 it can allow you to charge up your fury. The only thing theyāre not great for is against Propagators.
In my opinion, this is objectively the worst Kerrigan prestige for 99 percent of situations. That being said, you still have your amazing Immobilization Wave ability like P0. Itās only the superior choice when you know your ally is going to be Stukov or a competent Abathur who spreads creep and provides Nydus Worms for you. Otherwise, itās completely inferior unless you want to practice creep spreading for versus games.
One thing you can do with this prestige is spam Queens, then maybe add Brood Lords or Mutalisks for support later on. The reason I go with air units later is that, in my opinion, past a certain number of ground units, there are diminishing returns because they all start body-blocking each other. But for this to work, youāll need max Research Cost Reduction Mastery to upgrade both ground and air units.
The downside is that you canāt just F2 and A-move your entire army. You have to use hotkeys to move your Queens, and since Queens donāt auto-heal, youāll need Rapid Fire. Iāve never seen any Kerrigan player use this tactic in at least 100 matches where my ally was Kerrigan, but I can see it working because it works for Abathur.
One more thing: if you pick this prestige, for the love of God, spread creep! Otherwise, why did you pick this prestige to begin with if youāre not going to do that?!
Another great choice, especially for shorter maps like Void Thrashing. This is the only prestige where I donāt recommend Research Cost Reduction Mastery. Instead, youāll want to max out Attack Damage and Attack Speed Mastery, as well as Combat Unit Vespene Gas Cost Reduction Mastery, because Immobilization Wave with this prestige has half the damage, making it ineffective except for stunning enemies.
To fully utilize her power, you need to attack 5 times and then either use Leaping Strike or Psionic Shift. Itās pure perfection. Unlike P0 or P1, which have amazingly strong Immobilization Waves, this one isnāt as good when dealing with attack waves of more than 12 units because her ability stops being more effective against larger groups.
She also needs a lot of tanking, so you should rush either Ultralisks or Brood Lords (if youāre going air) to provide her with protection. Itās not uncommon for her to go on a killing spree as soon as she spawns and end the game within the first 15 minutes, as long as the attack waves arenāt ridiculous.
She needs the most micro-management of any prestige here, but in my opinion, this one has the highest skill ceiling. P1 technically requires more skill just to perform at an average level.
This is not my choice, simply because I donāt like the fact that she can't jump in and Immobilization Wave an entire base, but you have to manually micro her to get into a better position.
I think sheās great with this prestige for ability spamming, so I recommend maxing Energy Regeneration Mastery. Since her Immobilization Wave isnāt as goodānot because of lacking power but because positioning can be awkwardāI recommend full mastery into Combat Unit Vespene Gas Cost Reduction Mastery.
The last mastery category is up to the player, but Iād recommend putting all mastery into Research Cost Reduction, so she can rush for Mutalisks or Guardians, which this prestige is best for, in my opinion.
You could technically go for Attack Damage and Attack Speed Mastery for her and turn her into an insane melee powerhouse, but if I wanted a battle-focused Kerrigan, Iād choose either P2 or P0 instead. For some reason this is the most popular kerrigan prestige which I think may have to do with the fact that she objectively looks the best on this prestige and you don't have to deal with none of that crabs' legs of her, and plus many people just like mutas and hate worms (which makes no sense but each on their own).
Hi guys, I won't be posting much about Nexus Co-op here, but we had a big patch recently, so perhaps some of you want to know what has been changed. It works fine on EU server, I heard there were troubles on NA, don't know about Asia. The biggest news are:
There were also a lot of changes to many commanders; big thanks to observer3939 for translation from Chinese. I edited it and posted as a community post; had to split in 3 parts because patch is GIGANTIC! You can see it HERE!
Thank you!
Mutation #450: Survival of the Fittest / Map: Void Thrashing
Mutators: Transmutation, Barrier
Barrier
Enemy units and structures gain a temporary shield upon the first time they take damage.
Barrier triggers when units or structures are damaged.
One-shot kills won't trigger the Barrier.
100 shield with 5s duration.
Transmutation
Enemy units have a chance to transform into more powerful units whenever they deal damage.
Enemy unit will transform every time after killing a player's unit or structure. Enemy unit dealing damage has a chance to transform = 100% * [Damage_Dealt / {500/400/300/200}].
Spells and other abilities can cause the transformation just as well as normal attacks. But one ability, attack or spell can transform the unit only once.
Enemy unit moves up through the list of transmutation tiers. If the unit is not on the list, it's considered as Tier01.
For killing a hero unit, the enemy unit moves straight to Tier 10. For killing another unit or structure, it jumps as many tiers as the victim units supply cost or at least 1. For dealing damage, enemy unit can move only one tier up.
Once at Tier 10, enemy unit won't transform further.
Unit type in a tier is chosen randomly.
Transmutated units are technically new units, with full life, shields and energy and without any buffs or debuffs the old unit had.
Structures, mission objectives and units with a map boss attribute don't transform.
Transmutated units provide more biomass, essence and assimilated resources.
Enemy units killing each other under Confusion doesn't trigger transmutation.
Transmutated units will seek and attack players' units until they die.
Unit can't transform more than once per second.
Ā https://www.maguro.one/p/mutators.html
https://starcraft2coop.com/resources/weeklymutations
https://starcraft2coop.com/resources/mutators
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#31 Survival of the Fittest ā SOLO ALL CLEAR
Mutators: Transmutation, Barrier
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https://youtu.be/qoAG3i18ksI (advice)
https://youtube.com/shorts/r6L2Byxq3fk?feature=share (shorts)
https://youtu.be/njwZIUcVayo (easy solo - Fenix p2)
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Enemies get a new barrier when they transmutate.
Enemy zerg has weaker air defenses (aside from those vipers).
When you start fighting a base, a good portion of it will join the fight and transmutate. Once the fight is over, the majority of the base will be cleared.
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For duos: Karax or Swann + Zagara or Dehaka
For solo queue: Mengsk
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Successes [and key points]
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL3FSCru5EHIhCj33jUaMUgq_Wg8rtwM46 (playlist with all commanders)
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Questions about any of these runs are welcome. Runs will be uploaded throughout the week. All members get early access to videos.
Nice people in my discord can help you with the mutation: https://discord.gg/WerduSFQQK
God the more I play with Zagara the more I love her play style. I pretty much only play scurge queen and i just love this wave of zerg fangs and explosions and melting everything in her path is just, mwah. I know she isnt perfect for all maps but she is just so much fun when you have 5-6 hatcheries up. Some mutations do screw her over hard. But I still love her.
The other thing I love is just her synergies. Most protoss commanders have great synergy with her. With Artanis and Karax the sheild they passively provide allows you to be more aggressive and worry less about losing random units. Then there is Alarak which benefits from all the zerg dying around him. Mira and Matt allows you to be way more efficient. Stukov allows creep to travel passively so more speed and on the defensive side you have Vorazun brining back your units back if they are under the cloak.
There is just so many little things that just makes her work. With each game there is just more and more things you notice.
I crunched some numbers about the dps of Abathur's locusts, factoring also the duration, the cooldown, the biomass, the prestige and the supply cost of the Host. The results are as follow:
Prestige | Biomass | Normalized dps per supply |
---|---|---|
0+1+3 | 0 | 4,4 |
2 | 0 | 6,7 |
0+1 | 50 | 10 |
3 | 100 | 10 |
2 | 50 | 15 |
0+1 | 100 | 17,8 |
3 | 200 | 17,8 |
1 | 125 | 22,5 |
2 | 100 | 26,7 |
Conclusions: