Since I began to implement late Platonic elements into my cosmology, theology and world view, I see the beauty in the small things, in the laughing of playing children, the singing of the birds, the rising sun. In the mundane and what was taken for granted. Every moment is a gift of the Gods who mingle with matter and make things happening. That I am able to contemplate on Beauty, on Goodness and the very Gods I worship is such a gift and I do not miss the times before I began to implement these elements.

The Gods are good, we mortals are by default good, just as matter and this world is and no matter what life throws at us, at the end we can break through and see the beauty in all of that.

Neoplatonism is in my view such a positivist and optimistic theology/ philosophy, I am thankful that my soul was able to pick it up in it's current journey on this earth.

Praised be the deathless Gods. Praised be Jove, God of Gods and King of all.

When the gods want to deliver a message to mankind they choose a human oracle and they speak in the form of myths and symbols. Afterwards it is up to the philosophers to decipher and rationalize these myths and create a coherent metaphysical system.

Tartarus appears in Hesiod's theogony both as a primordial deity following Chaos and as a deep abyss that is used as a dungeon and prison for the Titans and the monster Typhon. In Plato's Gorgias the souls are judged after death and the wicked receive divine punishment in Tartarus.

Question 1 : How does neoplatonism (ancient and contemporary) interpret the myth of Tartarus ?

Have there been any theories on what to make of this myth ? Or do you have any personal interpretation to give ? I have seen only one fascinating reddit thread "the theogony of shadows" which attempts to answer this question but unfortunately it suffers from a number of philosophical issues.

https://www.reddit.com/r/occult/comments/b2lz4j/theogony_of_shadows/

The profound and revolutionary concept of the shadow by Carl Jung was probably inspired by tartarus among other creation myths but this theory is limited to psychology and jungian archetypes which can be defined as impressions of the gods on the level of the collective soul of humanity (collective unconscious). In this thread I would like to extend this theory of the shadow to a more traditional neoplatonist framework. I haven't given it a lot of thought yet so I will just write up a few ideas which come to mind.

The very first principle is the One which is both chaos and order yet beyond them as well. I would identify this symbolically with the non-number 0 : a Transcendent Void out of which all numbers emerge. This is also "the One ineffable", beyond Being.

I would call the next principle the Logos which I describe as being the Orphic Egg and symbolically connected to the pythagorean Monad (1). This is the level of Being (as per Parmenides) and it could be called the "One Existant".

Then out of this Logos comes the tension of Primordial Matter which I connect to Chaos and the pythagorean Dyad (2). This is the duality of Light (Logos) and Darkness (Matter). Effectively in certain Orphic texts, the Egg is viewed as a primordial entity from which all creation springs. When the Egg breaks, it releases the elements of the cosmos, including the forces of Chaos.

In order for the instable polarity of the Dyad (2) to attain the balance and harmony of the Triad (3) we need a mediation principle. Nous (divine intellect) is the dialectical synthesis which bridges the thesis of Light (Logos) and the antithesis of Matter (Chaos). In that sense Matter starts to stabilize and Chaos turns into World Soul (third hypostasis) and later Regular Matter : the fourth hypostasis and Tetrad (4).

“The One [especially Logos] may be compared to light, the intellect that follows it to the Sun, and the Soul to the Moon which receives its light from the Sun.”
~ Plotinus, Enneads, treatise 24, V, 6.

I posit that this stabilization process can only take place if Chaos is contained through a kind of veil within Nous which we can call : Tartarus. This idea is obviously inspired from the Abyss concept of the Kabbalistic tradition. It is interesting to note that the masterpiece of that tradition : the Zohar (11th century) was inspired by neoplatonism among other things.

Tartarus would be the shadow of Chaos reflected upon the Divine Intellect.
Regular Matter (especially Hades the underworld) would be the shadow of Tartarus reflected upon the World Soul.

At the level of the One there is only the Platonic Good (absolute). But at the level of creation there is an interplay of relative good and relative evil. Evil is a time-delayed good. While all forms of evil can be used to purify the soul, not all forms of evil are necessary hence the importance of free will. Regular Matter would not be the original source of evil as it is merely a canvas : the neutral wall out of which all the shadows arise in Plato's Cave. To have shadows on the wall in the first place, there must first be figures blocking the light (some Forms in Divine Intellect). The real source of evil comes from the collective shadow of Tartarus and from the perfect trickster gods of obstacles who are working on the collective shadow by putting human free will to the test. The purification of the soul would therefore entail on an individual scale the harmonization of Chaos and Logos. Without Order nothing exists, without Chaos nothing evolves. But with too much Chaos the monster Typhon gets released out of Tartarus and it destroys the entire universe. Ra's victory each night over the monster serpent Apophis ensures the preservation of the universe. As it is stated in the New Testament (Revelation 12:7-9) : "the great dragon was hurled down—that ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him.". In a similar fashion we have Hades reluctantly watching over the gates of the underworld. I connect Hades with the planetary deity Saturn (superego father figure) which stands as a boundary at the very edge of the solar system in the classical system of the celestial spheres. Later on, in the 20th century, we have discovered new planets beyond the orbit of Saturn. The discovery of Pluto came around the time of the rise Nazi Germany, the atomic bomb, the horrors of world war 2 and Jung's theory of the shadow. Modern astrologers have effectively connected Pluto to the dangerous destructive and creative forces of the underworld. It could be said that Saturn is the gatekeeper (Hades) watching over the Pluto monster (Typhon).

Question 2 : How does neoplatonism make sense of the evil cacodaemons ? And the nature of evil ?

Iamblichus mentions different kinds of dangerous cacodaemons in "De Mysteriis". Punitive daemons, evil spirits and fraudulent demons, etc... It is my understanding that both daemons and human souls partake in the World Soul hence daemons are also prone to duality and they should not all be put in the same basket. Some daemons are used by the trickster gods to tempt humans and put human free will to the test. Whether these daemons are aware of it (punitive daemons) or not (evil spirits). According to occult practicioners daemons seem very human. In contrast we have angels (the demiurgic intellects of Nous) which are much less human and much less dualistic and much more aligned with the perfection of the henadic gods.

How do you view evil daemons ? If daemons belong to the World Soul then like humans they are also going through evolution and they also have free will like humans ?

Thank you in advance for your feedback and for giving me the opportunity to express my thoughts.

Do you think it is possible to speak of non-existence? Additionally, what does it mean when someone 'no longer exists'? I mean, in ordinary speech we often say that something passes out of existence, but if Parmenides is right then it is impossible.

I've been bothered by the ancient atomists recently. So I wanted to ask wheter you guys have good arguements against the void and arguements in favor of infinite divisibility of matter. In addition I wanted to ask how would you refute such positions like, mereological nihilism and the proposition that all change is reducible to local motion. Thanks for the answers in advance. May the Gods bless you all!

I am reading enneads currently and Plotinus states that everything is connected via sympathy based on similarity between things. Does he mean that things correspond or symbolise each other?

what is good place to start with Neoplatonism. what are some good beginner reading material to look into

https://youtu.be/SdqQUS0V8qA?si=LS1Bes90HRw2RSwA

I speak mostly of pure-Neoplatonism as opposed to the Abrahamic interpretations of them. My impression of the neopagan communities I can access is underwhelming, but the Plethon/Bruno train of thought is something I want to explore more.

Is Neoplatonism something that's still seeing growth today?

Can someone post PDFs of Thomas taylor works of Plato (Prometheus Trust) voulme 1, 2 and 5 somewhere please!!

The Shin Megami Tensei (SMT) series deeply incorporates Gnostic ideas into its narrative and philosophical structure, reflecting concepts such as the Demiurge, Sophia, Autogenes, and the dualistic struggle between material and spiritual realms.

One of the central figures of Gnosticism, the Demiurge, is prominently represented in SMT through characters like YHVH (Yahweh). YHVH is depicted as a tyrannical and flawed creator god who fashioned the material world and imposes rigid rules upon humanity.

This portrayal mirrors the Gnostic view of the Demiurge as a lower deity who mistakenly believes himself to be the supreme god, despite being far removed from the true source of divinity. The central conflict of many SMT games revolves around humanity's struggle for liberation from YHVH’s oppressive control, a theme especially pronounced in Shin Megami Tensei II and Shin Megami Tensei IV: Apocalypse.

Sophia, the Gnostic embodiment of divine wisdom, also finds subtle representation in the series. As a figure of enlightenment and liberation, Sophia is often reflected in characters who provide spiritual insights or challenge the oppressive system of the Demiurge.

In SMT, this role is sometimes filled by characters like Lucifer, who encourages the protagonist to question authority and seek deeper truths. Other figures, such as Hikaru/Alétheia in SMT IV: Apocalypse, also embody Sophia’s archetypal wisdom, revealing hidden knowledge about the nature of the world.

The concept of Autogenes—the self-generated divine principle—resonates strongly with the role of the protagonist in SMT. Players often begin as ordinary humans who, through transformative events, become beings that bridge the material and spiritual realms.

In SMT Nocturne (Lucifer’s Call), for instance, the protagonist transforms into the Demi-Fiend, a hybrid entity capable of transcending the boundaries of creation and destruction. This mirrors the function of Autogenes as a bridge between the divine fullness (Pleroma) and the corrupted material world.

The Archons, Gnostic rulers of the material world who serve the Demiurge, appear in SMT as demonic overlords or celestial enforcers. Figures like Metatron, Belial, and Beelzebub embody this role, acting as guardians of the material order who test or obstruct the protagonist’s journey toward liberation.

A recurring theme in SMT is the dualistic struggle between Law (Order) and Chaos, which reflects the Gnostic dichotomy between material darkness and spiritual light. The forces of Law, often aligned with YHVH, represent strict control and the preservation of an artificial order, while Chaos, led by Lucifer or demonic entities, advocates for personal freedom, self-determination, and spiritual enlightenment.

The player’s decisions frequently hinge on whether to embrace Law, Chaos, or forge a neutral path, echoing the Gnostic quest for liberation from the illusions of the material world.

The influence of Sethian Gnosticism is particularly evident in SMT. In Sethian tradition, Seth is the savior who liberates divine sparks trapped in material bodies. Similarly, SMT’s protagonists, such as Aleph in SMT II, serve as savior figures who challenge the Demiurge’s rule and free humanity from spiritual bondage. This idea of a divine lineage capable of transcending the material world resonates with Gnostic cosmology.

Furthermore, the Neoplatonic structure of divine emanations (the Pleroma) is mirrored in SMT’s hierarchical depiction of angels, demons, and otherworldly beings. Characters like Lucifer and Merkabah exist within a cosmological framework that descends from an ultimate unity—reminiscent of Plotinus’ concept of the One—through layers of divine and corrupted realms.

In conclusion, Shin Megami Tensei integrates Gnostic philosophy by exploring themes of creation, redemption, and the struggle against the false authority of the Demiurge. Players often embody an Autogenes-like role, choosing between submission to oppressive systems, embracing chaos, or forging their own path. Through its rich narrative and philosophical depth, SMT captures the essence of Gnostic thought in a compelling and interactive way.

In Shin Megami Tensei, the player chooses between three cosmic forces: Order, Chaos, and Neutrality. This choice is not only a decision within the game, but also reflects profound philosophical and religious ideas that stem from the ancient traditions of Neoplatonism, Gnosticism, and ancient astrology. Beyond this, the game also challenges the player to engage with the question of perspective and the construction of truth – themes that can be explored through the deconstruction and perspectivism of philosophers like Derrida and Foucault. This text examines how Shin Megami Tensei integrates these philosophical traditions within its narrative structures and decision-making processes.

The Philosophical Structure of the Game

At the core of the game are the three cosmic forces: Order, Chaos, and Neutrality. These forces are not only thematically connected, but also correspond to certain philosophical concepts that have their origins in ancient philosophy.

Neoplatonism and the Structure of the Cosmos

Neoplatonism, particularly as formulated by the philosopher Plotinus, describes a universe that emanates from a single, indivisible principle – the "One." From this principle arise all other levels of reality: the "Nous" (the intellectual realm), the "Soul" (the bridge between mind and matter), and finally, "Matter" (the physical world). This structure is reflected in Shin Megami Tensei through the three paths of the game:

Order represents the "One," the central principle that transcends everything and seeks to stabilize the world.

Chaos corresponds to the "Soul," an unstable, dynamic force that mediates between worlds and often disrupts the balance.

Neutrality mirrors the material realm, seeking balance between the two other forces without fully committing to either side.

The player's choice of which path to follow can be understood as a conscious decision for a particular perspective on the universe and human existence – a choice made within a Neoplatonic cosmos.

Gnosticism and the Path of Enlightenment

Gnosticism, especially the idea of "esoteric knowledge" and "salvation through enlightenment," is strongly present in the game. The player is positioned in a gnostic role through interactions with demonic entities and cosmic forces. The player must not only handle external conflicts but also discover deeper truths about the universe and their own inner powers. The player’s journey is that of a Gnostic, seeking to free themselves from the matrix of the external world to attain true knowledge.

In Shin Megami Tensei, this corresponds to the ongoing revelation of secrets and hidden truths, allowing the player to experience "enlightenment." However, this enlightenment is ambivalent, questioning the true motives behind the various cosmic powers.

Ancient Astrology and Cosmic Forces

Ancient astrology, particularly rooted in Babylonian and Hellenistic traditions, played a central role in ancient cosmology. In this worldview, the movements of celestial bodies were closely tied to divine forces and worldly events. In Shin Megami Tensei, we find a similar structure, with the seven classical planets (Sun, Moon, Mars, Mercury, Jupiter, Venus, and Saturn) connected to the various cosmic forces and their archons.

These planets – as expressions of divine emanations – form the basis for the roles and characteristics of the powers the player encounters. This connection between planets and cosmic forces gives the game a deeper, esoteric dimension that resonates with the astrological and gnostic traditions of antiquity.

Perspectivism and Deconstruction: Truth and Relativity in the Game

A central theme of the game is the question of truth and how it is relativized through the player’s choices. Perspectivism – the question of whether there is an absolute truth or if all truths are relative – is a theme deeply embedded in the gameplay. The player moves between different perspectives depending on whether they follow the path of Order, Chaos, or Neutrality.

From a Neoplatonic perspective, the truth of the "One" is unreachable and inaccessible to the human mind, which places the player in the role of a seeker, constantly confronted with the choice of which truth to follow. This choice reflects the philosophical tension between universal truth and personal, subjective truth.

From a deconstructivist standpoint, one might ask whether the game truly allows the player to recognize the boundaries of these different perspectives. Every decision the player makes embraces a particular truth, while simultaneously raising the question of whether that truth is actually absolute, or whether it is just another construct within the game itself. Thus, the player is repeatedly confronted with the possibility of questioning and deconstructing these truths.

Emancipatory Potential and Neoliberal Logic

Despite the philosophical depth and apparent freedom that the game offers, the question arises about the emancipatory potential of Shin Megami Tensei. Does the player have the ability to free themselves from the cosmic forces and create their own reality, or are they trapped in the constraints of a neoliberal system that repeatedly points back to the market value of decisions and the simulation of freedom?

The philosopher Theodor W. Adorno coined the term "culture industry" to describe how cultural products are standardized and commercialized in such a way that they suppress any genuine critical reflection and subversion. Similarly, Shin Megami Tensei can be understood as part of the culture industry, where the player can choose between different cosmic forces, but within a clearly pre-determined framework that doesn’t truly emancipate them, but rather integrates them into the logic of entertainment and consumption.

The world of Shin Megami Tensei could be seen as a "flight into simulated reality," as described by Jean Baudrillard in his theory of "Simulacra." The player immerses themselves in a world of symbols and illusions without this world leading to any actual change in social or political reality.

In the game, profound religious and philosophical themes such as Neoplatonism, Gnosticism, and ancient astrology are explored and embedded in a form of entertainment that simultaneously follows a commercial logic. The player's choice between the cosmic forces of Order, Chaos, and Neutrality reflects the possibility of engaging with fundamental questions about the universe, truth, and existence. However, this engagement remains within the confines of a game system primarily aimed at consumption and entertainment. In this sense, profound cultural and religious reflection is not allowed to develop as an autonomous, unbound practice but is instead a part of the "market of cultural products" that players consume.

By embedding complex religious and philosophical concepts into a commercial medium – a video game – access to these ideas is not only shaped by the player's own engagement but also by the framework of the game itself: the narrative, the characters, the choices, and the limitations of the gaming experience. The player is integrated into a culture industry that offers some freedom in choosing a perspective on the universe, but this choice always takes place within a predefined, commercial context influenced by the economic system of the video game industry.

Adorno and Horkheimer criticized, in their theory of the culture industry, that cultural products are increasingly standardized and commercialized, thereby losing their critical and emancipatory potential and instead serving entertainment and consumption. Shin Megami Tensei illustrates this phenomenon: although it raises philosophical and religious questions, the entire experience remains rooted in a system that is not focused on real political or social change but on the production of entertainment and capital.

Thus, the religious and philosophical dimension of the game is not used as a means for individual emancipation or transcendental thinking, but rather as part of a culture industry that packages these ideas within a commercial framework that ultimately relativizes the notion of "freedom" or "choice." The game challenges players to engage with big questions, but it does so in a form that ultimately fits into the logic of consumer society, locating the depth of these questions within a context of market value and entertainment.

Hello dear people,

I am dabbling in Neoplatonist theology and philosophy for some time now, i also tried to read the Dialogues but had no real success so far. Most secondary literature seems to be in english and the german ones are mostly highly priced and very... hefty.

Is there any literature you can recommend in german which is good for a layperson and easy to read to get closer to the topics of Theurgy, Cosmology and Neoplatonism in general?

Thank you <3

Through Plato to Plotinus and Thomas Taylor. I feel like that is one branch and there are other divergent branches I know nothing of and I would like to contextualise my lineage/know in which branch of the tradition I am working in. If I am correct that there are divergent Platonisms...

I recently had a look at the Chaldean Oracles and how Neoplatonists integrated ideas from these.

Zeus is usually depicted as the King of the gods, whereas Proclus prays to her as the Mother of the gods in the Himn to Hekate:

"Hail, many-named Mother of the Gods, whose children are fair,

Hail, mighty Hekate of the Threshold, Key-bearer of the whole cosmos, Guide and Guardian of the paths."

She precedes the Demiurge in the Chaldean oracles, and she is also the only one not ruled by Zeus:

"And Zeus, the son of Kronos, honored her above all others. He gave her splendid gifts, a share of the earth and the unfruitful sea. She has a share of the starry heaven, too, and is honored exceedingly by the deathless gods." (Theogony, 411–413)

In the system of Proclus, could she act as a complementary Mediatrix role to that of Zeus as the Demiurge? While Zeus orders / acts in the descension of ideas into matter (Procession/Proodos), does she act like the one helping on the ascension back towards the One, assisting on purifying the soul (Reversion/Epistrophē)? Besides all the other complementary roles they may have at different levels of the hierarchy.

Do you find parallels between Zeus/Hekate and Logos/Pneuma?

I wanted to write about an interesting wrinkle in Neoplatonic philosophy that I have been stewing over for several months now.

Last year I was reading 'Hermetic Spirituality and the Historical Imagination' by Wouter J Hanegraff, which is amazing btw, a must read if you are interested in Hermeticism at all. For those unaware, 'Hermeticism' refers to what seems to be a Pagan spiritual movement based in Egypt, inspired by traditional Egyptian cultural practices but attested to in fragmentary Greek language manuscripts, and reflecting influence from Greek philosophy. Notably, the Neoplatonist Iamblichus is considered to be a follower of 'the Way of Hermes', which is relevant for later. Within this spiritual movement, the concept of 'Nous' played a big role. Prof. Hanegraff in a footnote writes:

The Hermetic references to nous read very much like simplified popular

echoes of Plotinus’ technical discussions. It is crucial to distinguish between two ways in which nous is understood: ontologically as primary being (ousia, as distinct from the One above being: Banner, Philosophic Science, 183), and epistemologically as the capacity to access or comprehend that being though noēsis. However, these concep- tual realms of ontology and epistemology “are simply not separate for Plotinus, [who may well have been] the earliest known philosopher fully to equate levels of being with states of consciousness

It is well known, of course, that Plotinus himself was Egyptian, and was alive at the same time when some of the most significant Hermetic texts such as the 'Asclepius' were written. Regarding his education in Alexandria, Porphyry in his 'Life of Plotinus' writes:

At twenty-seven he was caught by the passion for philosophy: he was directed to the most highly reputed professors to be found at Alexandria; but he used to come from their lectures saddened and discouraged. A friend to whom he opened his heart divined his temperamental craving and suggested Ammonius, whom he had not yet tried. Plotinus went, heard a lecture, and exclaimed to his comrade: 'This was the man I was looking for.'

From that day he followed Ammonius continuously, and under his guidance made such progress in philosophy that he became eager to investigate the Persian methods and the system adopted among the Indians.

I think what this establishes is that Plotinus would have in all likelihood been aware of 'Hermeticism' to whatever degree that was meaningful in the early 3rd century. Whether they were represented by the 'Philosophers' who made him depressed, or by Ammonius', who may have been influenced by Hermeticism, it is unlikely Plotinus would go searching for foreign philosophies without at least being familiar with what was common locally. Furthermore, the similarity reflected in the centrality and usage of 'Nous' as a word and concept is to me suggestive at the very least of a shared philosophical and cultural context.

All of this, I think, puts an interesting framing around the famous text 'Letter from Anebo' aka 'De Mysteriis Aegyptorum' by Iamblichus, the famous justification for theurgy in response to Porphyry's 'contemplative' approach, in which he apparently followed his teacher Plotinus. As noted before, Iamblichus was a Hermeticist, and large portions of 'De Mysteriis' can be read as a defence of Hermetic practice and belief writ large. In section V chapter XV he writes:

We must admit, therefore, that there are twofold species of sacrifices; one kind, indeed, pertaining to men who are entirely purified, which, as Heraclitus says, rarely happens to one man, or to a certain easily to be numbered few of mankind; but the other kind, being material and corporeal-formed

adding that,

For this connexion requires that a mode of worship should be chosen adapted to itself; viz. an immaterial connexion, a mode of worship immaterially mingled

What Iamblichus is considering here is that the material accoutrements to the rituals of theurgy are necessary for the vast majority of people who lack this 'immaterial' connection to the divine world. Wouter Hanegraff's analysis of Iamblichus writings in 'Hermetic Spirituality' give a great and thorough analysis of how this view is entirely consonant with 'the Way of Hermes', its doctrines of astral fate, and the purity of the soul. I think it is possible that by suggesting certain individuals have a special 'immaterial' connection to the Divine world, Iamblichus is suggesting to his interlocutor that in particular Plotinus, Porphyry's teacher, is special in his spiritual connection with philosophy. Remember that Porphyry himself wrote:

In fact Plotinus possessed by birth something more than is accorded to other men. An Egyptian priest who had arrived in Rome and, through some friend, had been presented to the philosopher, became desirous of displaying his powers to him, and he offered to evoke a visible manifestation of Plotinus' presiding spirit. Plotinus readily consented and the evocation was made in the Temple of Isis, the only place, they say, which the Egyptian could find pure in Rome.

At the summons a Divinity appeared, not a being of the spirit-ranks, and the Egyptian exclaimed: 'You are singularly graced; the guiding-spirit within you is not of the lower degree but a God.'

Having a God as a presiding spirit is noting if not a 'connection with Divinity'! Even if Plotinus himself did not have any interest in 'the Way of Hermes' himself, the fact he was an Egyptian may have carried some connotation relating him to Hermes Trismegistus, making him by-default a Hermetic spiritual adept.

To conclude, although Neoplatonism and Hermeticism are treated as two distinct 'spiritual currents' which have persisted since antiquity in the West, I think it is extremely interesesting how closely they are bound up together in one of Neoplatonism central debates, that between Porphyry and Iamblichus on the topic of theurgy. I am of the opinion that Plotinus was influenced by and familiar with the movement, if not a direct participant, while Iamblichus would quite subtly use the teachings of the movements to suggest Plotinus was a uniquely Divine individual, which keeps his philosophical teachings intact while making him a poor model to follow in regards to practice.