I am not always doing the full LRP, more often I am injecting the occasional Qabalistic Cross into my days, sometimes before a reading etc, or if I'm stressed out. It never fails to quiet and centre me. It has such a big impact for me. I wonder if any of you have speculations on why? I recall reading somewhere that the QC was a "potent little rite on its own" but I don't remember which book.

I have been working through the introductory meditations on Themis/Maat/Thmé for some months now. Lately I have been looking into the neophyte ceremony, it’s constituents and symbolisms. There is a segment of the admission where oaths are pledged, and if anyone were to take them seriously/(literally?) that for me at this point appears somewhat arrogant and absent minded. I wish to seek clarity regarding a few segments in particular:

“I pledge that I will not suffer myself to be placed in such a state of passivity, that any person, power or being may cause me to lose control of my thoughts, words or actions.”

To pledge to aspiration is one thing, to make an oath of “I will never lose control or be influenced”, ever, seems blind. To pledge to the aspiration of this aim seems noble, but to assert that one will live perfectly there on out, and submit themselves to being “slain” if they do not adhere to this perfection? Seems like an arrogant and blind thing to pledge oneself to. Like, saying you consent to be sent to literal prison for scrolling on Reddit or YouTube ever, in the future, is what that sounds like , to me. But I am curious to see the words for what they are, if they are not as they appear the way I’ve described.

“I vow that I will not debase the mystical knowledge in the labor of Evil magic at any time tried or under any circumstances.”

It is unclear what this means. The problem of evil has been a theme I have been challenged by throughout my spiritual journey. It is unclear what “evil magic” implies here, for instance. Is “evil magic” constituted by the force being used, the intent behind the use of said force, or everything and anything that happens as a consequence of the operation?

“I solemnly promise not to flaunt or parade any knowledge I may acquire to those who are not seekers of the Light, lest our sacred knowledge be profaned through error, vanity or neglect.”

I believe there is a further stipulation in the closing of the ceremony where the candidate states that every and any knowledge with any connections to the order, such as the rituals, philosophies involved, must be kept secret or yet again, you will be “slain” by a destructive and punishing current from the head chiefs of the order. Yet, there seems to be for instance no guardians to certain internet communities where this information is freely given and shared, among those who are not traditionally initiated into the current and those who are.

I have definitely in the past learned “the hard way” about why you need to be very selective of who you share your personal interest/experience of these things with. That said my concern is looking at this ceremony as a binding legal document. I think it is conducive to will, intent, being “hermetically sealed” that one keeps the “themes” of these words in mind, but their wording is concerning.

Reading the ceremony spoke to me deeply, and was even moving. I feel compelled to go ahead with it, I just need to make the implements and hopefully get some closure and better understanding of the oaths, so that I can omit them, word them differently, or take them as they are knowing they are not draconian and (spiritually) legally binding me to being incinerated by divine guardians because I was caught scrolling shorts on YouTube a few times in my life.

Hopefully, you understand what I am getting at here. I would love to better understand these aspects of the ceremony, myself. Any clarification and light you can shed on these things is much appreciated. Thank you for taking the time to consider my message.

I'm currently looking to study and practice the Rite of Elemental Equilibration. The books define every vibration and visualization very thoroughly, with the exception of the final vibration "ETH" I so far have yet to find any information on the the meaning nor pronunciation of "ETH" and I'm looking for insight! Any help would be sincerely appreciated!

Also I have a note I would like to share with this community if anyone has any comments to spark my curiosity. During the lesser rituals of the pentagram, I feel a strong connection to the archangel URIEL. He also feels significantly different to me than the other 3 archangels, I find that visualization of his figure takes quite a bit longer sometimes. When I get the visual and presence feeling clear, I see his right hand carries ripened wheat, and I also see a bright red apple in his left. I don't know why I always see the apple, it's the only detail that differs from the descriptions of his figure, so under multiple attempts to dissolve the apple from my visualization led to me seeing him outstretch his hand offering the apple.

I've recently started worshipping Jupiter. so on Jupiter hour every day I chant to Jupiter, read the orphic hymns to Jupiter, and finish it with a prayer, all of this takes around ~40-45 minutes. ever since starting this I've felt myself become mentally stronger and more confident, more masculine, and some other improvements within myself as well.

I've been doing the LBRP on and off for a few months, I have a few days where I do it consistently and some days where I don't do it. I know it's supposed to be done every day, but I'm not disciplined enough to do so, and I am trying to become more disciplined and start doing it every day.

I've noticed that on the days when I don't do the LBRP, I feel the results that I've gotten from this devotion (idk if that's the right word for it) lessen, idk if it's that I don't notice them as much, or if its that they're actually lessened. on the days where I don't do the LBRP I feel the effects of it all more, im not sure if its that the effects go away when I do the LBRP, it might be more that im not noticing them and feeling them as much? but im not sure.

When I was worshipping Venus (doing a similar thing that I'm doing with Jupiter), I noticed the same thing happen, on the days when I was doing the LBRP I felt less of her energy and the changes that the worship brought on me. Im not sure if this actually has something to do with the LBRP or more to do with me and the possibility im doing something wrong.

im not sure if im saying this in the correct way but what im asking is, does the LBRP have an effect on planetary energies? or the energies of deities? or am i doing some kind of placebo effect thing on myself lol, is this something that happens to me because i think that the LBRP has an effect on this?, or does the doing LBRP actually affect this?

Was wondering if all the ritual books on the golden dawn reveal everything? Ive been hearing that the books on magic always withhold bits and pieces of the actual rituals . Is this true? Especially with these older orders that have been around for awhile. If so , what's the point if you are not going to lay it out in its entirety.

Hey howdy fine people. So I've been experimenting with magick for over a year now, mostly just doing lbrp and middle pillar, with some sigils early on and a period where i (unsuccessfully) tried contacting/invoking goetic spirits in a demonolatry style. Anyway, a couple of months ago I started working through LTC 's Kabbalah Magic book. Thing is, I'm getting quite bored with these two rituals + solar adorations. Don't get me wrong, I realize the importance of mastering these rituals but im wondering if I could just move on to the elemental grades? Is there any room for modification to LTC's system? I just want to do some magick lol I've been doing lbrp nearly every day for over 6 months now, and middle pillar for a couple of those months, and off and on before. I

How is it different from the LBRP pentagram, nd do you have to have a specific element in mind

Hey everyone, has anyone noticed that after performing Rose Cross ritual you draw to yourself much less attention from other people?

I've got intrigued by this after reading in D.M Kraig's Modern Magick that this ritual grants you a sort of "invisibility". He mentions that he managed to get away with speeding as if police didn't even notice him and generally people aren't very aware of your presence.

I wanted to know if you have any personal experiences and stories. And I'm curious how great this effect can be. Yes, I know that this ritual is supposed to create a calming and peaceful aura, as opposed to LBRP which lightens you up on the astral plane, and that it is obviously not literal invisibility so you can spare me that. I just want to hear your personal stories regarding invisibility and drawing less attention effect so stay on topic

Does anyone have knowledge about this? Or are they a metaphor for our bad parts? Angels are more than a metaphor as i have met them.

So I'm aware many traditions and even books in the same tradition describe performing the lbrp different ways. I'm not asking which one is correct cause there are many ways that work for different people. I only wish to pick your brains about visualization and drawing in energy to put through the pentagrams.

When I first started I would imagine a huge column of energy covering my whole body passing through me going down into the ground. At times when I get very busy and miss days this visualization is kind of hard to do and it gets hard to focus. I one day tried to see the light as very thin penetrating my body going through the middle of the top of my head. Tried that for awhile and felt the same results after with no big difference. But I'm autistic and I often questioned myself if I was doing it right or not. I wanted to experiment with how I see the light going through me when I do the Qabalistic cross. Not as super thin but as a pole sized stream of light passing through my body. Not covering my whole body though.

My question is would I be wrong if I did it that way cause that feels easier for me to visualize. When I read descriptions of the lbrp it never really says how the light should be. Be it covering my whole body or being a pole sized of light or anything. I just sort of winged it for so long. So I'd kind of like to know how others visualize it.

Hi all, I was hoping a kind soul could help me vet a group North of Detroit? There are 2 groups I'm seeing in MI. One says it's closed.

Please PM me if you can help. Thank you so much.

I’ve seen lots of different orders pop up for example the Cicero order the thelemic order and a couple of others that I can’t name of the top of my head but what’s everyone’s opinion on those and for those who are members what’s the difference in practice?

Earlier today, a post was made of a link to a video of a young man doing the Supreme Invoking Ritual of the Pentagram. I made a comment on that video, and not long after found that I was unable to reply to the comments being made nor find the video in the feed of this subreddit. (For that matter, I can not find the user who posted it either.) I can only assume that either the user blocked me or that the post was deleted. I truly hope that it was not deleted because it gives us a chance to discuss the ritual. That is how we learn and grow. We should all be able to post things, officer criticism and critique without issue. No one is here to attack or disparage anyone else. We are all on this journey together. I believe that I was blocked because there have been a couple of comments to my comment which I have been able to see, but could not respond to. So, I am posting here to provide my insights to those comments.

First, in response to my neglecting to point out that he does an invoking pentagram but follows it with the Sign of Silence, I did imply that the Neophyte signs are not used at all in the performance of the ritual. I should have been more clear on that.

As far as the archangels and the LVX verses the 5=6 signs in the ritual, I went back to Ritual B - The Ritual of the Pentagram, from the 5=6 papers because I am not infallible. I can make mistakes. In the instructions of the SIRP, it specifically states that after the Spirit pentagram and Spirit wheel to make the 5=6 signs, not the LVX signs. It makes since because you are giving the grade signs for the grade corresponding to the element.

Ritual B also states, at the end of the SIRP, "Finish in the East as in the Lesser Pentagram Ritual with the Four Archangels and Qabalistic Cross."

Now, you can absolutely invoke the elemental hierarchy if you are working with those elemental beings. And, it can be applied to the SIRP if you are calling on them. But it is not necessarily part of the ritual proper.

With regards to the comment asking about changing the wording, specifically from "Above me flames the pentagram, and in the column flames the six-rayed star." to "Before me flames the pentagram, and behind me shines the six-rayed star." in order to avoid any influence from Crowley, I have done the ritual both ways in the past, and find that the traditional GD way as described in Ritual B is both more effective and aligns better with the intent of the GD. This would apply to the Lesser Ritual of the Pentagram as well.

Hopefully we can continue good and positive discussion here.

As with previous volumes, Vol. 3 of The Light Extended was unavailable on Amazon for a while now, but we have switched printers and distributors, and it is now back in stock. This edition includes material from Samuel Scarborough, Alex Sumner, Darcy Küntz, and other well-known authors in the G.D. world, including my own article offering some practical tips for the Opening of the Key (the elaborate G.D. method of reading the Tarot).

You can get your copy here: https://www.amazon.com/Light-Extended-Journal-Golden-Dawn/dp/1908705183/

https://youtu.be/6WCvtFM9z40?si=5jfkGQaFuWVxUHuQ

According to your experience, of course

So, as I said in another post, I've been doing the first-order work for about a year.

My dreams are extremely intense and very horrific. Nothing really relates to my real life, but wow. I've had all different beings or entities in my dreams doing all types of crazy, weird things to me: chasing me, hurting me, terrorizing me—all types of stuff. I didn't really dream until i started the 1st order magick.

Does anyone know any way to calm down the dreams or work through them? Sometimes I'll wake up and try to think of the first thoughts or memories that come to mind, hoping it was a symbolic representation of old memories or current situations, but I've never found anything definitive in my conclusions.

Now my sleep is just bad. I'm not afraid to sleep but I don't sleep well, it's always bad dreams and I wake up and try to get my head into something else to clear it .

Any feedback would be appreciated

guys im going to as for some practical advice here if i may.. im 30 years old soon, with a backround in the golden dawn (self initiation), im currently taking care of my mother (she is sick), im doing daily practice in the bardonian system (step 3).. i dont have a stable job and all of the jobs i worked had shit hours and shit pay.. i was sure that when i will finish initiation to gd i will know for sure what to do with my life and i wont be so confused.. a couple of months ago i took a brave step and went to college, but i hated that as well.. the stress was too much for me honestly as im not a competetive person.. i like body building so im thinking about doing a course to work at gyms but i hear it a shit job as well from what ive seen.. i wanted to ask you guys that know how much of a commitment the path is taking.. what advice can you give me? im honestly lost.. im sure i can find stable work as a security guard or somthing but i dont know if i can do that for a long time witout feeling like a looser.. i try to work out a lot and that helps for my mental state but im honestly stuck ... sorry for all of this rant i just wanted to hear a perspective from you guys.. much love and i hope all is well

Vol. 2 of The Light Extended was unavailable on Amazon for a while now, but we have switched printers and distributors, and it is now back in stock. This volume includes material from the Ciceros, John Michael Greer, and other well-known authors in the G.D. world, including some handy tips on making a DIY G.D. Temple, and my own article on the much-ignored Evil Triangle.

You can get your copy here: https://www.amazon.com/Light-Extended-Journal-Golden-Dawn/dp/1908705175/

For a new and solitary practitioner, what are the best books/websites for information?

Also, insofar as ritual space, is a room set off for that purpose best, rather than say a bedroom or living room? I read a post in this group that spoke of spirits being around whatever room you're doing rituals in so advised not to make it a bedroom or similar. What sorts of spirits might be around for that?

I have been doing the LBRP in the living room, which I actually use as a bedroom. I have felt at time almost like I had eyes on me as I'm doing the ritual, especially when facing west. I don't use the intended bedroom, for the most part, and thought of doing ritual in there. But there has always seemed to be a kind of dark energy in there, something...off, I don't know, like something terrible happened there at one time. I have saged the place and done the Reiki method of cleansing and warding a space, but that uncomfortable feeling remains. I haven't tried doing the LBRP in there yet and feel like I shouldn't.

There's a dining room, also not used much, but is between the kitchen and living room. That might be a better spot.

Based initially as a response to a thread here, I have expanded my post into a blog with some additional details. You can read it here:

https://mishkan-ha-echad.blogspot.com/2025/01/the-holy-guardian-angel-in-golden-dawn.html

I am having a hard time believing in elementals. I can see via my birth chart and horoscope that there is obviously an astrological power but I just can’t grasp what an elemental even is. Is it a thoughtform or does it exist independently?

I have a question about planetary invocatiom ( LIRH), I found out the planetary hour and the position of the planet when doing LIRH I draw the star of David at the star position? and when going around the temple in a circle to increase the energy should I start from the star position or from the North direction?

Vol. 1 of The Light Extended was unavailable on Amazon for a while now, but we have switched printers and distributors, and it is now back in stock. This volume includes material from the Ciceros and other well-known authors in the G.D. world, including an article on the Lesser Ritual of the Pentagram by the late Samuel Scarborough.

You can get your copy here: https://www.amazon.com/Light-Extended-Journal-Golden-Dawn/dp/1908705167/

Does it take you out of dissociation, off your high cloud and into the real life?

For a person who has lived their whole life in dissociation caused by early emotional trauma. Since my first LIRP i feel like i'm back in the past. It's been months. I'm reliving painful memories. No amount of banishing takes it away. I started anxiety meds which i believe i needed to start loooong ago (in childhood). People assumed i was mean and hated everyone, when in fact i was afraid to death to open up. But i believed them. I did't even realize it was fear that made me that way.

Anyone else got dragged back to the past and got stuck there?

I am thinking of touching LIRP again after the meds kick in, as they take a few weeks/months to work.