. * rolled eyes *

no wall-of-text neccessary with this one,

since when do Azimuth CEOs tell everyone ELSE, what's dangerous for humanity?

. * eye slits *

Talk about hypocrytical!

corporate-arrogance, blurred with confidence, presented on the front-foot, or pro-actively, as 'impressive'-professionalism,..

...is ofc socially-naive, underestimates their audience, and fools almost no-one, so often little needs to be explained to see-through how laughably-obvious it is when like this,

But wow - Azimuth sure knows how to piss people off, and attract new members for the ACA, compared to any other corporations, don't they?

Give yourselves a pat on the back, everyone who helped to kick Azimuth out of Wandrama!

o7

Well, i should say, The yes-man, and the rationalist, since they're down to 2 now, but who's counting.

Punishment comes from strange places sometimes, and the recent Kumo bombing of Jerome Archer's vehicle, should although of obvious partisan impact, at least exemplify, why NEITHER blind-faith in social-control, nor the total-abscence of it, be trusted, absolutely.

I could get into the history of Archer, and of both the federation and the empire in terms of the crimes through INRA, Blackflight and other conspiracies, that both have committed on humanity supposedly "all" in the name of it, and i could also remind us of whether or not research into illegally attempting to utilize alien tech was ever going to've been 'only' for 'all' of humanity's benefit, as-opposed to ALSO, primarily of benefit, to those who developed it and utilized it for their own ends. Potentially, at least,

But their histories are out there, and i don't want this one to be a 15 pager like i sometimes do,..

... so i'll get to the points as quick as i can ;

[ #1 ]

Likely-spoonfed media commentators, saying, that "...this statement also claims responsibility for the attempted ambush of ... Arissa..." ...

is typical, and total knee-jerk blustering on the part of Archer loyalists of-whome all the federation does not answer to, and they lay no claim on even-only-within the federation, any authority to instill in the average Federation citizen, a sense of what ... obligation? the fantasy/delusion is not quite clear,.. that they should sing-the-same-song , demonstrate their oh so prescious, 'power of belief', in then seeming to be in agreement, that the Kumo statement does.

This is of course not new, and regardless of what the Imp. Senate spokesperson said about it, without getting involved, one can still clearly see the both immediate grammatical / literal non-effort, on the part of whoever wrote it, but also the potential reason for seeming to only be able to reply with such a simple childish attempt to attract-blame, or make things more difficult for the KC.

WERE, the collective propogandic and diplomatic totality-of-potentials, of Archer's loyalists, so meager and childish,..

... perhaps one might not notice the need to guess-DEEPER, as to why they would attempt such a simple response and such a clearly not going to convince anyone, ploy, to lay the blame of the attempt on Arissa, on the KC.

Do i have an opinion what that is? no,.. i honestly can't spare a thought now that it's on, with Raijin, and each day brings new little-victories against the Thargoids,..

... who i can only hope, are as hostile as we've been asked for 300 years to believe they are,..

... because if-not,.. if indeed the first transgressions without a 'worker ant' sacrifice, or some other gesture, having ever been given to the thargoids in early interactions if we were the tresspassers, and the tech-theives,..

... then both, and likely the Club as well, have one hell of a grand-apology, and self-standing down, and shift to transparancy, owed to us all, and each and every Cmdr, who has spent many years fighting in this war, has their initial diplomatic and extra-special communications and cultural incompetences, if not also outright just personal/private greed, to have to answer for.

Neither, EVER, truly represented us, we did not vote on it, we did not even cyber-simultaneous-thought condone it, even-if Transcendental Tech were adopted throughout all of humanity, and the process for a plebicite, actually became possible instead of inevitably IMpossible, with traditional means,

nor-that, even. Totally-hidden, likely parallel-self-interested, and now KEPT from us, while the federation and emipre, still bicker,

and in this case,

still try to BLAME OTHERS.

Utopia will like neither condemn, nor condone, this act, of the KC,

but it is more than ironic, that punishment for Archer, when the marlinists never needed it themselves, before those who amongst also-them, mis-represented-all, but then Archer and Hudson & co. could not maintain discipline enough nor demonstrate widsom or grace enough, to have one response for one, but no-need for the same response, for the other.

Many times in human history, have those with power, not known when to stop, when failing to tell the difference between the potential for collaborators inamongst a group, and then the simultaneous illegitimacy, of one's own acts, if choosing to pretend as though that only-PARTIAL condition, does not matter.

Archer & Hudson & co.'s response, to the neo-Marlinst league and to only SOME of their splintered-off members, exhibited all that is wrong with too much centralization of power, and not-enough delegation, and not-enough inter-dependency.

It is in the supposedly-RELEVENT to all other areas of the Federation, and if Archer & Hudson & co. had had his way, likely throughout wider juristictions as well, flaw, in the rationale at the time, that the public of the Federation, was asked to accept Archer's new powers and measures, and the creation of those new agencies,..

... which considering the UNSPOKEN reasons in Utopia's often less-wordsmithy way, had clearly gone too far, even for Kumos, to show leadership in relation to, which as a prominent member of Utopia, to say that about Delaine and Kumos, does not come easily from me.

Even in anarchists, lies the potential for seeing when a already-shallow shell of a man like Archer , has ceased to even realize, what he has become,

and it is in that vein, that not on behalf of Utopia at all, but at an individual level, I recognise, Dealine's reason, even if others will not, when few others have even lifted a finger, to try to stop the corruption of the very freedoms, that the Federation CLAIMS, justifies it's aggression and indiscriminations.

[ #2 ]

And to simplify his and the KC's,.. and arguably all our reasons to need the same of the removal or in cruder terms, simple END, of Jerome Archer,.. as "nothing more than a self-aggrandising pirate eager for the spotlight." ... is to try to also downplay, the reasons, why WITHIN, the current arrangements between the Federation and the Empire, while the Maelstroms still relatively unite us all, but as the article correctly points out near the end, of post-invasion uncertainty,.. for how long,.. the likely only TEMPORARY reasons, to be paying lip-service to the federation, or perhaps-TO Archer himself, on the part of the Imp. Senate,..

... also reveals, what treachery has also been present, for these 300 years & counting, re what it must have been like, while INRA was just as supported by the Empire, as it was by the federation,.. and one should not kid oneself that the Empire could nor will end up UNmarred, honor UNdented,.. whatever metaphor,.. much if at all less-so, than the Federation, when the liability, guilt, and dishonor, have already gone way over their heads, beyond it being above their waists, up to their necks, well-over, long-ago.

What little skill the Federation might not-have, with more elaborate and difficult to discern diplomatic positioning, while they are split, and perhaps, Archer's loyalists could have on this occasion, failed to a better job of,..

... one would not expect, of the Imp. Senate, with much more inter-dependency, and much more experience and inheritant obligation, to maintain higher standards, of presented-knowledge, presented-awareness, and the nobility to be fearless in using it at all times, per the supposedly reliable nature, of feudal expectations of conduct and lordly-higher behaviour, including in relation to truth.

FFS, the Empire has openly criticised and expressed concern about Archer's attempted grab for power, and invasive laws and tech. , and the new agencies he created, their words have hinted at PITY, before, if i remember correctly. Pity, for Federation citizens.

... YET ... here they are, seeming to agree, that it was nothing but "self-aggrandising" of a pirate.

Surely at least, words such as punishment, would not be absent, in the minds of at least one senator, to've been voiced, to've made it into to their discussions, or onto their parliamentary tables, for inclusion in a statement?

So what's the story, Imp. Senate?

Why the dismissive simplification, when a perfectly good opportunity to FURTHER heap scorn and imply irresponsibility on the Federation, would otherwise go to waste, if claiming Delaine had no reason?

He had reason, it is only the MEANS, that most would disagree on. 3 government workers, might not amount to much in ANY of the 3 powers at play here's books, but not even innocence, could be agreed on, so i will not make any attempt at a universal point about that. Working for Jerome Archer, is no safe-bet, for a job, I would imagine KC members would not hesitate to say that doing so is asking-for-it, or a similar expression, and when it comes to similar impositions of Federation hostile actions in others realms, we and I myself, certainly have experience in rationalizing the same, when system factions also refuse to abandon their identity, for something new, something MERGED, something a little mad, but not-bound by singular identity, and insist that ONLY their way, is the only way, for their home systems, and there is no choice, but to have to act.

What differs here, is the scale of the ambition, of Delaine and the KC's attempt. Where the over-concentration of power lies, so-too, would the concentration of power DISPERSE, after his removal.

There is no denying that, Imp. Senate.

You would not be in the position of having now just chosen to give lip-service, had-not supposed trust in the centralisation or sharing of information for the vaguely tried to be made SOUND similar, new security measures throughout Aegis was it? space,.. already been both absurd, but also given in-GESTURE,.. given in-ceremony almost,.. what is the right expression? false-confidence? like a charade?

Perhaps a ongoing risk from "complacency" as Delaine has put it, reveals more about HOW MUCH Federation citizens should not risk, on or in so-few,.. even-if, they would continue to tolerate the negative trade-offs amongst the precaution of the new systems,..

... yet would they think the same is still a good idea,..

... if they thought-through, what Archer's real-reasons FOR them,.. really were.

Winters could tell you the answer to that, what his real-reasons really-WERE ...

you need-not look to Utopia for an explaination to that one.

[ #3 ]

And Meanwhile, we are asked by Gal-Net, to swallow, that Kaine is similar to Archer.

wow.

What an effort, Gal-Net, is that the best that the best-of-your-best ... can do?

Notice a minor degree of similarity of positioning, and make the catchy-headline, with a memory-aid hook ... SEEM like something important to consider?

Utter irresponsibility of just trying to sell to your readers, Gal-Net.

Self interest as a media outlet, pure and simple.

Kaine was concerned because of multiple things, one in particular, that LYR is widely believed to be a member of the Club, and that risking introducing integrations of Sirius Corp's likely already infiltrated by them systems, further into the Alliance, would risk their access increasing if-not-also potentials for controlling parts of or influencing the Alliance, even if she could not publically admit so, or left her inference vague or unspoken.

Sirius otherwise, is arguably a critical corporation, that without, we would still be in the dark ages pre-Inheritance wars, time our enemy, while forever waiting for slow megaships to arrive, unlike the though-tumultuous, divided by an unimaginably infinate number, of self-owned-ship inbetweeners between humanity's trillions we now have, something unimaginable in such a short space of time.

Where Sirius's honor ends, and the beginnings of the Club begin, if true, may well be a shifting line, that changes as the degree of scrutiny changes with it, but certainly Kaine in her fear-mongering was able to exploit genuine concern amongst the risk that she likely over-stated, considering expecially, that the Club is ALREADY, all over the place, in terms of the number of places they can go, and the amount of leverage they already have. Denying a agreement with Sirius, would likely NOT-have reduced their influence inside the Alliance, at all, and considering that a "weakened Aegis" ... had the pact not come into effect, would not be something the Club could have condoned, it's likely that they would likely SAY exactly that, as-to-WHY, Kaine is more of a understable, but ignorable, sort of person.

The same, CANNOT be said, for Jerome Archer.

is Gal-Net trying to cover something? I hope it is, just trying to sell newspapers, i truly do. Why would they be trying to BLUR, or create COVER, for Archer?

Has he already got HIS tentacles, into Gal-Net? Has he already got dirt, on their CEOs, or other critical decision makers?

i.e. something like ; 'Get someone to make me seem similar to Kaine, this bombing is making me look bad, it's making people look up my history, create a DISTRACTION. '

I hope not.

Keep dis-trusting Gal-Net, true Independents of whichever cynicisms and refusals!

And every-so often, see the missed-opportunity for a true revoluntionary, within in a Kumo, it's in there somewhere buried beneath, all the maschismo/sadist bullshit.

o7

Without choosing to take sides in the how-much-security question within the federation for both political and finding it a difficult-choice, reasons,

it is still obvious to me, that what is being presented of the clash between these 3 federation candidates, is still within a immature societal and media environment of tolerated rationalizing-DOWN, of supposedly held-above-all-things 'rights', per the tradition of the same, of also-exaggerated rights of lingering false-dignities of the identities from the late-Earth political and power-bloc identities, which these days are of course now hopelessly obsolete and usually, counter-productive,

how THIS, is supposed to be the best leaders the federation can manage, i'll never understand,

although private-risk / supposedly 'reasonable' avoidance of risk of the indiscriminant-capitalist's hesitation to support their host-governments when not also in direct control like in explicitly corporate-controlled systems, might have something to do with it.

Loyalty you might say to, 'go down with your ship', neither comes easily to them, nor doesn't quite cover the PARASITIC nature, of corporate protectionism, collusion, tax evasion, and undeserved elevation above other business that works with government.

A truly synchronized or co-operatING, present/future tense, government, gives private interests more of a DEMAND, to stay with their hosts, rather than being able to liquidate, move-on, or allow CEO/owner-rotations, so as to leave the unfortunate, unlucky-ones, to be in charge when something goes wrong, and those who were lucky enough or perhaps conspiring before something went wrong, to be able to get-away with APPEARING to not be the true cause, while the incumbent, 'takes the blame' / 'takes the heat', etc

Instead of demand, what do we see,

in each of these 3?

The fool, Rackham, obviously false-promises / pipe-dreams, reserves presumably then depleting before you could blink, and who knows what cuts made to other areas, perhaps including Aegis?

Archer, clearly more of the same, or perhaps worse, considering that we've all seen what having someone from Military/governemnt-intelligence-bureaus cause, abuses of power / claimed-justified uses of capacities-of-an-individual, a bad guise for a person with leverage, favors-owed through likely blackmail/extortion and worse, and likely few-scruples.

And,.. the remaining,.. less-dangerous rationalist (less dangerous things TO rationalize), in Winters - Likely only a partially watered-down version of the new security laws and privacy invasions, but perhaps better FOCUSED on the right thing for a change?

. * shrugs *

This Galnet episode in history, exemplified both, to me ;

[https://community.elitedangerous.com/galnet/23-APR-3307]

[https://community.elitedangerous.com/galnet/uid/6082b5788356ff306b71a5b2]

(manually-find 3307 , APR , 23 if it does not load the page automatically)

Instead of embarrassingly admitting that the new measures might have only REDUCED to a small extent future, ACTUAL-terrorism, at the cost of both civil liberties AND the right to self-determination, politically, we see archer failing to counter her criticism, and instead just repeat the fear-mongering, seemingly un-aware that her argument is already several steps ahead.

If a knee-jerk selection for the would be 'safe bet' in Archer, fails to recognize the difference between someone who tries to justify ANY means, rather than better ones METHODOLOGICALLY, such as our many cyber-nets and offline-rogue detection suspicion systematic methods, people who insist on existing disconnected / deny the risk of existing disconnected en-mass, the base 'HOW' of Utopia,

UNlike in what we have, of much more technologically RELIABLE justification, will it just be more shoot-first-ask-questions-later wit Archer, such as we saw in the defections of entire systems away from the federation?

could Winter's forewarning, be not only REPEATED, but perhaps on a larger scale?

The clear breakaway from the supposedly honest protections of liberty in all 'EXCEPT' political, is laughably hypocritical,

in our and others honest-preventative mandates, we do not shy-away from ADMITTING to humans limits, and tendency for gradual marginal lowering of morality in favor of base-instincts, and self-interest, and therefore a longer, wider picture, when it comes to all too easy portrayals of 'unfair' oppression of all liberties,

instead, our selective allowances, our 'cherry picking', combined with the focus on technological ways-out of human limitations, remain the only way forward, to SURPASS, human limits, and to leave-behind, the supposedly "valuable" nature, of the contrived nature of such debates as these 3(-1) candidates.

Whether or not the public will recognize the social value, or 'investment in people' of winters only slight differences, over the fear-based would-bes of a now immensely over-ridden concerns that Archer addressed, since the Thargoids and Maelstroms arrived, we can only wait to see, but it doesn't seem likely to me, that we're going to see any change in the false-premises MAINTAINED by federation supposedly-free media avoiding subject like just how OLD, the right to self-determination actually IS.

While not all powers have as far-sighted a mandate-OVER,.. suppressing in surpassing, humans' 'free' democratically-self-neglectative tendencies as we do, it is fair to say that federation subjects would LIKE, to be able to somehow get the best of both worlds, of democratic validation, as-well-as concentrations of money and the authority to prioritize capacity building and everything else promised but not always delivered, from corporate methodology, but therein, lies the ever-present false promises, not-only of just one of the 3, to create contrast for the other 2 to then be the only remaining candidates to choose-between,.. but the ENTIRE Federation, LYR, & Torvan systematic false-promises ;

in tolerating corporations to that EXTENT.

The same memory-failure, that they are meant to be providers-TO, the government, not the government itself,

The same memory-failure, going all the way back to Franco, in Spain/Portugal, of whether or not the PEOPLE, are depended on when it comes to WHOME TO TRUST, nor have legal-means to overthrow those corporations they do-not trust, and the CONSEQUENCES of gambling-with, playing-with, trust, and then of course, the subsequent, betrayed trust ... and the irony of whether or not the people truly ARE, living in democracy, (in Torvan re democracy, only the former criticism about legality-of-overthrowing)

The same memory-failure, in even corporations themselves, when it comes to Torval - control is then introduced, after would-be 'free' opportunism, and favoritism, then replaces it. Such a senator, claiming to facilitate, UNLIKE empire-favoritism, just a smaller-scale, smaller-scope, smaller-clique VERSION, of something similar ... what's the point?

I can only imagine, how much more, LYR despises Torvan installation of favorites / favoritism / cronies, than the federation perhaps, might be non-nonchalant, or ambivalent about the difference, when themselves arguably significantly more anarchist / democractically-accepted-turbulent.

But do we ever have the same problem, by EVER allowing that SCALE, of corporate rule?

It is a clear PARALLEL-to, not intra-operative harmonious existence,

but a parallel-TO, the 'wheels of democracy' itself, a manifestation of neglect in the name of sacrifice, -parallel-presence,..

... that in this case, with Archer, would as Winters has inferred be moreso of his staunch past-decision-making-position obsessive defense, unable to accept criticisms? rather than staying 'on the ball' with wise-focus,

such as was demonstrated when the POINT of his new agencies became REDUNDANT, yet he claimed the need was still there, even-as he and Hudson were being called the federation's "first dictator",

and now the inferred by he-himself, some kind of claimed 'readiness' to presumably act, on the Maelstroms,

Yet-what have they seen of him, in relation to the only supposedly 'successful' campaigns re the NLMA co-operation or federation-separatists and the important difference between political-self-determination and the federation-oppression of it at the time?

It was beyond sickening, if you can imagine, to see the federation, HELP THE EMPIRE, to suppress self-determination,

but that's precisely what they did under Hudson & Archer.

Suppression of the very freedoms TO self-determination, that the federation is supposed to be all about!

The irony, is not only noticed by Winters herself, surely.

At what point to those BEHIND archer, choose to ABANDON democracy, by their own-claims, of it's absolute value?

It is a sad progression to see, to see it's value not BLENDED, with other things.

Those new to Utopia, do not see, the automatic / unavoidable, democratic FUNCTIONALITY, of our cybernetic integration - the then time-saving, mostly, formal nature of government in many of our systems, does not even slightly reduce the all-in gamble we gamble on, to make addressing each other's concerns into account, a FORCED issue, not a 'free' option, to not-choose to do, if one desires.

No wonder our communisms and co-ops, grow un-abated by such squabbles, and hopefully in-time, what small, contained, Feudals, Theocracies, and other minorities we tolerate will come to realize they can commit fully, to rejecting their similar pointlessness-es of gambling on similarly outdated and obsolete IDENTITIES.

It is truly ironic, that neither-end, of a scale of abandonment of political identity, but clearly only-end, of a scale of abandoning DUTY,

leaves BOTH the extreme anarchists, AND the extreme self-aggrandizers in the empire and federation, BOTH behind,.. in balance of both abandonment and gradual transformation from one to another,..

while DUTY,.. remains a clearly consistent thing, in protection, and prevention, and authority-OVER, ignorance.

It is a bitter pill to swallow, but it does not validate token-differences between still democratically-absurd parties claiming to respect democracy,

NOR token differences between Emperial-feudals, compared to tolerated local ones, who do not grow in scale to the kinds of sizes we see in Empire, that on-paper, seems to be even more an absurd gamble.

It's easy to fall into pushing-the-hypothetical against Feudals, when it then becomes surprising, to find people willing to gamble on it's concentrations of power, and expectations of obligations, supposedly even-higher, than just temporary dictations of mandates, or dictations of temporary necessity, of which we would be of course better off never having to tolerate, if we could get in our co-ops and communisms sooner-rather-than-later,..

... yet neither, can we fall into ONLY-criticizing empire, when both are flawed, and both it AND the federation, deserve criticism, just-as-much-as anyone/everyone does.

Ironically, one might even say that if you're going to be oppressive OVER human fallibility, over human RELUCTANCE to ADMIT, our limits, that at least be HONEST, about why, and when, we need to stop-ourselves from failing-ourselves, in OVER-estimating ourselves.

Especially in governmental systems, that turn a blind eye to private-self-interested collusion, favoritism combining with black-market anarchy, or even-worse larger scale abuses and neglect, like absurd Kumo immorality/amoral-philosophy.

All have their limits in terms of what, CANNOT-CONSTITUTE governing-duty, CANNOT-CONSTITUTE acceptance-of-responsibility (of government / authority),

there is a fundamental limit on what can be considered ANY-kind of accepting OF, duty, Kumos denial of that role, the most extreme and ridiculous.

Somewhere in-between, the federation lies - it is unfair, to detract democracy too much, but that is not the FOCUS of Utopia, we are not obsessed with it as the cause of all ills - it is more of a we-can-do-better future we aim for, and so in order to get there, must reject it's anarchistic attributes.

When we find ourselves needing to resolve disagreeing virtually-linked minds, resolving discordance amongst valuably-differing starting-points ... we crash-together thoughts that differ and see how the arguments live up to their claims, force both to our collective scrutiny and see which remain, etc

Rather than allow for 'free' secular-degradation of social-cohesion, and larger devolved identity. Secular differences can exist, but to reasonably-LIMITED limits, for greater cohesion, and common cause. Forgoing self-determination, rather than absurdly claiming it is defended BY democracy, when democracy's supposedly current grand-champion, tolerates corporate suppression to such a extent that self-determination is PRECISELY what Archer suppressed, is utterly absurd and leaves all-REMAINING small scale democracies, perhaps the only REALISTIC, similarly secular, appropriately SIZED, manifestations of the limits on how large democracies can BE.

i.e. not the idea of it, but how large should identities OF-it, be.

Our cyber-integration, surpasses this question, and that is why we do not need to address it, in OLD measure, in OLD short-sighted identity conflicts.

There is a hidden, and surprising VALUE, in the abandonment of political identity, that many, both Federation and Empire citizens cannot even imagine, or at least struggle to imagine, but we find an vast IMPROOVEMENT on Kumo style total-abandonment when the problem seems too complex, or simple democratic-ambivalence, avoids longer-term solutions to.

In somewhat similar neutrality-to-identity, but almost-as-bad neglect, one can wish for a future realization within LYR, of the same future realization of-need, should they ever risk taking a less-neutral standpoint,

But what can we wish for of the federation?, if it continues to pretend as though that ambivalence towards longer-solutions does not KEEP-having, immediate costs?

We are asked, as one of those OUTside the federation, to accept that the empire is the most evil, when it forces sacrifice on it's citizens!

So long ago, yet seemingly forgotten,

the 'right to self-determination' was established as a perpetual necessity,

but what is it?.. to this Archer ... this 'safe bet' ?

THAT, is what to've expected from Hudson,

and THAT,is what they will get, if 'fear rules the day'.

Do we need such fear,

to control a result,

when CLAIMING to facilitate 'free' votes?

no.

nor do we CLAIM to facilitate, such self-neglecting gambles,

we DENY them, for we know what Empire also knows, and LYR knows, and even Kumos know,

but none of them seek-to-surpass,

whereas we do,

with a PLAN,

with-a-'HOW'.

which is MORE dishonest? which is MORE duplicitous? which is MORE two-faced?

o7

If Lafosse's absurd smearing was worth responding to to any real time-consuming degree, i would, but it isn't, so i won't,

but i will say just the one thing - while we might not yet have seen all there is to see in relation to Salvation,

if some longer game is being played and Azimuth's ongoing gamble on trying to make themselves seem provisive rather than a bloated ball&chain corp that 2 of the 3 power think themselves stuck with,.. ( compared to what some new conglomerate of corporations under a co-operative architecture could do if Azimuth fell on their sword and released all their records to the public seeing as though blackflight is long-since known about and trust in the Federation and Empire is deservedly much lower even for their own citizens ) ... it must only be EITHER, that, the attempt in 22460 was genuine in naivety on the part of at least the Alliance if-not-more of the superpowers that backed him and Azimuth, OR, that some kind of controlled-allowance of the drama that it might have been, was allowed in anticipation at the cost of tens of thousands of lives.

As unlikely as that might seem, in such a context, Azimuth's ongoing presence in Wandrama, remains pushed rather than formally abandoned, and in addition to the time and effort Azimuth waste in having to be suppressed in Utopia's backyard,..

... strictly speaking, whining-brat pedantically speaking,..

... Wandrama was chosen just-outside multiple Utopian control bubbles,

& could it now be, with Lafosse's slandering for a 'neo-truth' minority audience, that Wandrama was actually chosen, for a attempted blame-game the first move of, has just been made by Lafosse, or someone who has given them a DELIBERATE-release of some theory, to make them feel like they were discovering some secret to infer conspiracy with Salvation, while trying to avoid or hypocritically cover-for the federation and empire's part in creating the monster that Azimuth has become?

Ironically, if there is supposed to be something that Utopia is to answer for, in relation to Azimuth, wouldn't CREATING the monster that Aziumth became,..

... hmmm ... be a tad-MORE something for such courageous journalists, to report on?

... or does the hypocrisy of the privacy-invasion corporate-run supposedly-democratic tyranny of the federation after the Inheritance wars, in creating and condoning and failing to withdraw support for / take-RESPONSIBILITY FOR Azimuth, put each and every journalist and reporter, ironically LESS ABLE to report the truth in the longer HISTORY,..

... while it's then all too easy to finger-point with a deliberately-SHORT history,..

... and an absurd guilt-by-proximity argument,..

... while Utopia did not CONDONE nor approve of Azimuth just turning up in Wandrama, and presumably now that someone is trying to use backward logic to associate any potential of Wycherly trying to keep himself going, even if he does turn out to've used Utopian tech,.. with Utopia as-a-whole.

If that kind of logic was solid, then each and every Federation citizen, would be just-as contributively-responsibile, for Azimuth's creation, funding, secret-"army", Blackflight, and various crimes.

If by comparison, the blame of some conspiracy, does not necessarily lie with the power that a conspiracy exists-within,

then that's only-a maybe,

only a SOMEtimes.

While allies and individual pilots myself included, continue to deny Azimuth at our own expense, while we could be lending our skills and time against the thargoids,

keep in mind dear reader, that it might also not be any individual power's fault, if while such a massive stooge risks causing even-further intra-powers conflicts and distrust, even-more waste is risked, while humanity is needing unifying leadership, not divisive leadership, not position-wrangling leadership, and certainly not still trying to deny the history of Blackflight 'leadership', that still to this day, tries to blur the lines, and try to make it seem like THEIR misdeeds, are your misdeeds.

They weren't yours.

Opportunistically, Lafosse might just be wanting to make themselves seem-excellent, while the federation anticipates new leadership, and Lafosse could simply be trying to appeal to those wishing for others to blame / finger-point at, to AVOID REFORM, as the new balance of leadership/power re-balances after Hudson is ushered out.

i.e. someone could be trying to DEFLECT, to avoid SCRUTINY, into what the new central federation government's chosen sets of policies and government-culture are going to be,

and finger-pointing during a TIME of potential scrutiny, is one way to draw the people's attention elsewhere.

Relatedly, BTW,

If Azimuth's time in 22460 is over,.. why is Azimuth remaining in Wandrama? just for pityful articles like Lafosse's sake?

By comparison,

For the sake,..

... of the tens? hundreds? of thousands of dead in 22460,..

i hope that this is only dishonorable opportunistic-smearing, by a superpower lackey with no ability to put his own life on the line instead of hiding behind others', trying to brown-nose or lick his way up the Federation or Imperial grapevine, while tens of millions MORE, face death on a daily basis, because of the waste that Azimuth in Wandrama, continues to additionally-cause.

We are yet and likely never going to be able to see how much more could've been saved were however many had to spend their time in Wandrama denying Aziumuth,

but should it ever be estimated, send Azimuth the bill.

If you can somehow PAY for lives lost, that is.

spits

Does Tanner think we've forgotten already that Seo Jin-ae had to ESCAPE?

contrary to how Tesreau initially offered to take her in as a "guest'?

Talk about obvious.

and yet we are also being asked to accept that the "unknown" hostiles,

are necessarily-unknown.

To anyone familar with Blackflight and it's history, it should not be difficult to recognize the pattern here.

Has the same fear-driven advice, leverage, and strings pulling, been applied to the new Aegis?

and coincidentally, we're no longer hearing from Tesreau, when it comes to Seo Jin-ae.

Instead, we are made-witness-to repetitions of the same kind of 'have-confidence' inferences, from those with a history with, &or remaining links with those we still cannot trust within the superpowers collusion and sanctioning of Azimuth and in the case of the Fed. and Empire, also the carry-over organizations from the INRA period, like Blackflight. It's a 3-length-long chain, but why should Tanner be so trustable?

Almost like in situations like the remote conversation between her and Tanner this time, what was going to be said between the two of them, was thought by Tanner as possibly going to be exposed, almost a drama?

Do those that reach high echelons of power in the superpowers, historically in INRA, Azimuth, and now in Aegis,

PLAN for possible interception & release to the public of what they do privately? maintaining candour, posture-of-argument, contrive their apparent beliefs to fit the narrative they want believed or are being pressured by others, to maintain?

I thought Tanner had abandoned those that distrusted and dishonored him, what happened to that?

I suppose if he's loyal to whoever has created the narrative behind the, 'trust-Azimuth/the-superpowers as-well-as Aegis' line, blurring the two, when this NEW reformation of Aegis may or may-not be free from links to Azimuth and the older of those still with links to INRA such as Wycherly, could be charismatic / convincing enough that those previously loyal to ONLY ONE superpower, such as Tanner, could still have loyalties to-them. In that case, Tanner's own dismissal, could serve as a indirect mis-placed-trust confusion tool - i.e. we might sympathize with him because of his dismissal and convictions, while he might still be loyal to whoever's pulling the strings behind the superpowers foolish / careless decision making. If not 'The club', assuming the do indeed exist, then whoever.

Each of the superpowers should have been able to recognize the risk of too much centralized power in the hands to too-few, such as with Wycherly/Azimuth,..

...and yet ALL of them failed to recognize that risk, and all also failed, to demand that Azimuth open up & go transparent, in an amnesty or something, instead of futilely trying to re-portray themselves as legitimate.

Each power already has their own past-leadership blame-game to play, but Azimuth has it's OWN status to have to defend, so questions still remain, as to why each power and especially the Alliance who had previously never got it's hands dirty associating with such corporations/groups, took such a risk! (correct me if i'm wrong there, prrrrrrety sure.)

HOW that happened, has been suspiciously just boiled down absurdly, to each power desiring and end to the conflict?

That CANNOT be realistic, none of the 3 superpowers would've been content to take that kind of risk without having either more information about exactly-what they were buying-into, or have some ulterior reason to pretend as though they had confidence in it. Logically then, if it is extremely unlikely that all the top scientists of all three superpowers who had Wycherly's designs and theories shared with them, (partially-shared?) would fail to stop the process if it was never going to've worked, then that leaves within this argument, only pretending as though they did.

And now we get a 'have-confidence' version of Tanner, who reasonably, should be majorly pissed-off about not only the Federation, but those that'd been pulling strings within it, yet here is trying to convince poor old Seo Jin-ae that she can "return".

To whome? how would he have ANY IDEA, what might happen to her?

Why would those higher-up.s that had dismissed him from the federation as a whole, all of a sudden, be content with him being re-trusted?

The formalities of his dismissal might be something you might think are more about ceremony than control,

but then-again, NOT following orders, is still fundamentally WHY he was dismissed, or at least that's what the apparent reason was.

So then, IF, it was a agreed-upon drama, he was the fall-guy, and now they again trust him while APPEARING not to, officially.

Hmm... does that fit with WHY he would be trying to convince her to come back?

oh look, it does! what a coincidence.

There must be something else parallel to that 'hope' filled claim about Salvation.

Massive conglomerates of corporations, especially, stopped making decisions based-off-hope,

and 'went-with-the-numbers', a LONG time ago.

For argument's sake perhaps the Empire would have non-numbers-crunching leadership/power-structure enough for such a decision, but it's also not-like L.DV is some kind of close-eared tyrant who takes no council - surely she too must've known that further association with Azimuth would harm the reputation of the empire.

I guess i'm saying, that if more palatable characters like Tanner might become a target for the same manipulations,.. ( as a means of slipping in what might seem or sound less corrupt coming-FROM the mouth of someone we might trust more )

... then we should probably filter what he says and the way he presents himself the way he does, through a 'possibly-acting' filter of our own.

Mine, simply suggests that ; 1 even-though he had to leave the Federation, that that does not preclude the possibility that he is still loyal to those that turned a blind eye to the crimes of Azimuth, INRA, and Blackflight,

and-so consequentially 2 do not take him as any kind of OPPOSITE, to what you might assume they would not-want, or visa versa -

that they might be using him as a not-quite a puppet, but a,..

'convenient-actor in the limelight',

while their leveraging and strings-pulling elsewhere, & continues to convince those (truly believably) desperate for an end to it all, that the left-overs of INRA, Azimuth, and Blackflight,.. ... ARE that salvation.

In reality, we clearly don't HAVE one, or else the war would be over already.

Yet preying-on & playing-on that hope, might be just-enough, for the same bankers, or the same colluders/insiders convincing the superpowers to renew secrecy-provisions to cover over what each superpower would be embarrassed/dishonored have released, etc

( again obviously vastly-more when it comes to the Fed. & Empire )

Please use this as a basic reference guide for tasks to be carried out in and around Utopia

Fortification

• Collect Utopian Dissidents from our control systems and deliver them to our contact at Polevnic where they can be processed accordingly

• In order to keep Utopia well defended we encourage you to fortify the systems furthest from Polevnic. Fortify to 100% and move on to the next system

• For quick and easy merits you may fortify Gorringa or 32C Piscium. Although it won't particularly help us, it won't hinder us either

• Consult our fortification discord channel for more information

Preparation

• Deliver Utopian Publicity to Unjangen. Although we do not wish to expand at this moment, this action will give us the best possible chance to avoid expansion to a poor system which would be difficult for us to shed. If Unjangen is unavailable then our secondary target is HIP 35449

• Vote for consolidation each and every week

Minor Factions

• Utopia has a natural preference for Communist, Cooperative, Feudal and Dictatorship government types. Support these faction types through your actions, where they do not conflict with the interests of other player groups with which we have arrangements with

• Consult our bgs-discussion discord channel for more information

Conflicts

• As a general rule, we support Communist, Cooperative, Feudal and Dictatorship faction types during times of conflict

• Consult our urgent-combat discord channel for details of current wars and elections that we wish to influence

Thargoid War

• We are constantly concerned about the threat of Thargoids establishing a presence in Utopian space, and the devastating impact that they are having on systems governed by factions that we have relations with

• Consult our ax-coordination discord channel for discussion on strategies and tactics, and our ax-targets discord channel for details of systems we have prioritised for ax action

"While Commanders of the Pilots’ Federation are still our most adaptable and reliable field agents, Aegis will seek to work alongside them wherever possible."

(Daniel Parry, the Federal Navy’s military liaison to Aegis)

[https://www.elitedangerous.com/news/galnet/maelstrom-protection-technology-undergoes-testing]

. * ROFL *

As encouraging as this new tech might be, do not hesitate to persist-applying what we know, about arrogance like that ;

Independent pilots of the pilot's federation, have NEVER, been of NEITHER, of the so-far, honorable, Aegis,..

... and certainly-not the no-longer-honorable Federation's ...

... "agents", "field" or-otherwise.

Grammatical skills are obviously not top-priority amongst entry/promotion requirements amongst the federal navy,.. LOL,

although perhaps he meant Humanity's?

amongst-humanity's?

oh! so some federation admiral, SPEAKS for humanity then? Where do the single-sources, of single-voices, come, from-within?

that was it, wasn't it?

within-this-'our'

make no mistake dear reader,..

there are NEVER single-voices, representing all - it is a contradiction in terms.

Accept-no-simplfications, no single-sources.

still no reason for the use of "our",

it's misleading and self-attributive,

no-matter which spin might be attempted to be put on it.

Here's a tip for next-time you're being interviewed, admiral - when the journalist is speaking to you,..

... AS AN admiral of the federation ...

... you are speaking... AS AN admiral, of the federation.

Not just-some ordinary human-being walking down the street, as evokative as you might wish to've been perceived as of-one.

That means, johnny boy,.. that when you're speaking in the collective-sense, you can only use collective words,.. we,.. our,.. etc.

AS OF,.. the federal navy / taskforce / part-within-Aegis / whatever.

If you'd meant the Federation ;

WRONG

If you'd meant the Aegis ;

WRONG

If you'd meant the defunct IGNA ;

WRONG

If you'd meant the abolished/dishonored INRA ;

WRONG

If you'd meant the The-Club ;

WRONG

If you'd meant the whichever-other likely corrupt org. involved at around about the same time as Jameson's betrayal by the powers that supported INRA, or the kidnapping victims of Azimuth or similar,.. revealing how all the superpowers will betray ordinary citizens' trust ;

WRONG

( * eyeslits * )

[https://elite-dangerous.fandom.com/wiki/Pilots_Federation#The_Origin_of_the_Pilots_Federation]

Embarrasing, re; the NHP with the Kumos, is it?

( non-hostilities pact )

So-again ;

"our"?

.

humanity's?

i hope so.

This kind of attempted blurring, is a very good example of WHY the federation is DIS-trusted, amongst other powers and true independents.

"...We have also invited many independent specialists to partner with Aegis, including Professor Ishmael Palin, Ram Tah and a previous key member of Aegis, Aden Tanner.”

As much as many might wish Aegis well assuming WHERE it fights does not become a reason why it might end up breaking up again,

Note how independent specialists, are invited,

but there is again nothing here nor in the weeks / months previous, incorporating or being inclusive, of offers from independent POWERS.

In a similar sense that ANY private-interest can be expected to defend it's own interests,.. that's really not surprising, of any capitalist or economic-neo-liberalist 'flexible' economy, that the Kumos can claim to also be capitalists, (were it as simple as that).

What-has-been, ( for what's it been,.. mid-1900s ... 3300 ... approximately 1400 years), unnecessarily pretending as though other forms of capital, or other forms of rallying or marshaling,.. cannot be depended on, for raising defenses? ( not only capital ships, but they're a good example )

It should also come as no-surprise, that bank-monopolization, means IN-flexibility, in this regard,

and yet black markets pushed by capitalist-backed consumerism, are proliferated at the same time as capitalism's hypocrisy, all-throughout the Federation, Alliance, and guided-economy self-interest-capitalism even-moreso throughout the Empire (not much different despite what Imp.s say )

Independents are inconsistent by the same scrutiny, but at least we're FLEXIBLE enough to be able to accommodate. It's perhaps unfair to say that the Alliance does-not-also make room for communist or other non free-market-anarchy governments, but on the other hand, it also does not take-a-stand as a policy. The same level of demand can seem to be unreasonable when it comes to Imperial black market closures/preventions, but that does not-mean, that wealth-distribution, is in their hearts nor in their natures.

Of all the powers, ONLY Utopia does, and will continue to,

hopefully not alone forever, however ;

when money fails, powers are REMINDED of it's susceptibilities, and limitations.

Why 1400 years after the recognition of the WEAKNESS of economies and governments that depend on-only monetary accountability and organization, the debate on diversifying our banking structure and other similar assumed-better homogenized or monopolized, has not been had, we might only be able to guess at, but it's not difficult to imagine why those more interested in acquiring it and hoarding it, but often not SPENDING it,

especially at times of crisis,

would PREFER, if the debate never did.

Independents, especially those not needing to WAIT, for centralized superpower leadership, never-STOP their efforts,

yes this mention was only referring to non-superpower-loyalist Engineers, while already-loyalist were already committed,

but where is the same, when it comes to accepting non-monetarily-FORMED, fleets, or capital ship docks / capital ships?

Just because Independents might not have their own stylized designs, does not mean we CARE, which ones we would use or make - i imagine most would accept both. The advantage scrabbling that both the Federation and Empire are guilty of, is EXEMPLAR, in the capital ship exclusivities - ironically ofc, some of the more experienced pilots know that capital ships at human vs. human conflicts, can sometimes be more of a risk than an advantage, in when being routed, accelerating how quickly their enemies can win each battle,

But, this is a different case - the Kumos HAVE, demonstrated collective willingness to defend their name, despite what most will and do point out of their self-interests - understanding how and why this would happen, is perhaps mostly a issue of relative similarities on the (distributed)small-scale - when the advent of consumerism in the 20th/21st earlier? centuries, further-widened potentials for competitive profit, made just how much MORE, one business could out-do the next, it made investing in LESS competitive, even more of a risk for investors, and that in-turn, meant that even more desired efficiency from cheaper central locations of manufacturing, followed by expensive export, badly accounted-for,.. allowed the focus to be on manufacturing and sales-FROM the factory floor,.. rather than a more complete picture of the risks of under-estimated transport costs,.. which can over-time, slow down development, as well as other by-products.

Sirius Corp is the best example of the exact opposite,..

but no superpower can-claim to have created it. If either side of the fed./Emp. epic, had been the first to get it, it would not have been a respected IP / tech - in other words, BOTH would've stolen from the other,

we saw that with the nano-medicines debacle/scandal, where literally a practically-untested (long-term testing) tech, was STOLEN, and reverse-engineered, and sold-TO, a consumerist market / in a consumerist-domain.

Although our FSD hyper-acceleration has proven how REDUCING transport burdens, can also facilitate mass-revolution & opportunism, as in the Birthright wars, money's bubble, is only-temporary - it pops sooner or later, while ongoing non-monetary capital's value, takes time to be nurtured and develop - many types cannot be rushed or fast-tracked.

If sacrifice remains an option, for powers less-willing to sacrifice their political freedoms as-well-as adjusting to things like bank monopolization and single global currency / credit-systems,..

... then so be it. Where can we donate, to fund independent capital ship or other fleet necessitate shipyards?

Perhaps honoring exclusivity contracts, if that's what they were, with only the federation and empire, is the LEGAL reality that the companies/corporations face,

YET the parties that would claim that legal right,

demonstrate willingness to do business with criminal proceeds / process? ( like but not-only, like, with the nanomedicines scandal)

Why should the capital-ship manufacturers, or support companies that provide their means,

have to honor, the dishonorable?

By that argument, the PAST STATUS, of previously honorable parties to their exclusivities to, supposedly more "responsible" powers,

is now invalid,

and come to think of it, has been, for some time.

perhaps the Alliance will not be so selfish if it ever develops capital ships of it's own, but ideally, if the companies that make what capital and other large military shipbuilders use, want MORE business,.. would it not make sense,.. -to-capitalists, to then WIDEN, their range of purchasers? MORE lucrative government-contracts?

Both by capitalist, and 'other', economies arguments, total inflexibility,

is now CURRENTLY FAILING,

to draw-upon more RESOURCES,

that could be bringing-in more to bear, upon the Thargoids for our collective defense.

yet witness, no change there,.. while our cities and planets burn, and our billions suffer.

Put off our differences, Kumos,..

and recognize the same arbitrary position-wrangling, LYR/Groms...

...the deliberate exclusivity maintained on capital ships and other large-military, for too long now, is now-failing,.. not just the political interests of all others other-than the federation and empire,..

but HUMANITY, itself.

According to Galnet, [https://www.elitedangerous.com/news/galnet/activists-blame-leaders-thargoid-war] ;

"...some former members are blaming Allied, Federal and Imperial leaders for allowing the war to escalate, with profits from corporate arms deals seen as the motive."

But do they fail to see the incumbency-of-guilt and incumbency-of-criminality-&-immorality, unique to the Federation & Empire,..

... but-NOT the Alliance,

as Galnet is suggesting here?

Unlikely.

In reality, ONLY the Federation and Empire, are stuck with both the developments-from, and burdens-of-consequences-FROM, INRA,

The Alliance is CHOOSING to defend humanity, understandably perhaps moreso in regions where systems under it's protection are under attack,

but in ONLY MORE RECENT history.

Make no mistake, the BLURRING being attempted here,

does-not-succeed in grouping all superpowers in the same histories, when each has it's own, and trespass, theft(dangerous), and the development of potentially genocidal-scale impact biological weapons that INRA and both the Fed. & Empire are stuck with, similarly does not also get automatically 'carried over',

nor does it to other defenders of humanity, or simply just the innocent in a broader or simpler moral rather than political mindset ;

A rare time, in which neo-Marxist/communist,

AND religious(some, wealth-REJECTing) thought, has common ground.

Similarly, although the return of Aegis might be a sign of humanity's improved chances,

Do not mistake the self-interests of MOST of the Empire, as at all more noble, than self-interests within the federation, or for that matter, in other neglecting moderating capitalism powers' domains.

Princess Aisling's exceptional practicality and willingness to ruffle a few feathers behind closed doors, does make for an attractive target to will one's manifest consciousness through Imperial security, to see inside the room where she gave her elder sister a good shouting-at, in terms of not failing to ACT, on longer-term risk.

Living under such risk, of so-much hanging on the decisions of so-few, such absurd levels of centralized power however,.. should not be forgotten. While however much support the Empire brings is welcome, (should it be utilized outside only-their-own borders that is) , it is also true that asset-risk avoidance, of those already long-since having sold-off their ownership in Azimuth, or other side-ownerships, have likely already taken-the-money-and-run , successfully, i would add.

That kind of reward, should be on the same page, as the League of Reparation's hit-lists - While few disagree about the need to defend humanity, who is standing up and defending the ethics and methods of Azimuth, and INRA?

no-one. In reality, we are now stuck with a mixture, of shame, guilt, and having to face the consequences of the actions of those who NEVER represented us.

Humanity's in-time, fast-turnover of it's citizens lives, must seem like the sacrificial convenience, of army-ants, to potentially ageless Thargoid 'queens' as they've been called - for those unfamiliar with the concept, the longer the lifespan of a species, especially role-assigned/organized ones, the longer culpability cannot be avoided by those who made decisions of the past - inversely, the SHORTER the lifespans, the more new/next generations, can whine ;

'we didn't do it'

Expectations CAN be higher, than that.

WILL, be higher, than that,

while past-burying types tried to convince us,.. & still are?.. that Thargoids might not be intelligent.

Yeah right. Wake up and smell the burning-human-flesh, liars.

To the billions now seeking your targets of revenge/justice, for the worsening if not also initial causing of the war, and perhaps also previous war with the thargoids,.. seek them out VIA,.. behind,.. those, who would 'testify', on their surety that thargoids are not intelligent, or similar claims - while MudLarks in Achenar were decried as deserving the Federation's intervention,..

... there we saw ... what-then? - HONEST belief, HONEST 'testimony', that thargoids are un-intelligent?

Extricating likelyhoods from that, suggests INRA broke up, because of the differences between the two, superpowers within it, not the supposed 'END' of Thargoid capacity - at least hesitations about their return were not also used to completely bury the history - although that might've already been by-the-time that INRA had split, and those assessing the reputation the Federation would EARN, had already started to plan their PR and information campaigns and propaganda / lies-for-the-future.

That is the risk, that ending up DEPENDENT, on capitalists, creates - risk 'management' , depends on apparent-legitimacy, while reality underneath it, can be parallel to one's sales-pitch, parallel to one's PRESENTED face for-the-public.

Deceit in politics is nothing new,

but diplomacy is a different game, with different rules, and different consequences.

What we are seeing now, is because, of that memory-failure, that childish reaction, to not want to have to face reality, with-only-ONE face.

Can we expect Thargoids to understand our SHORT-lives relativity, and chaotic-nature?

perhaps, but that won't mean they'll care-to tolerate it.

why should they have to?

Accepting our DISADVANTAGE, and reasonable-distrust of humanity, might be our only way to start to demonstrate maturity, in that sense.

Expect no-maturity from neo-INRA defenders,

Expect more MIS-representation, supposedly on your behalf, and

Expect logic that what happened to the Kingfisher, 'must' be the same as what INRA and the Federation/Empire,

'tried' in the past?

like hell - lets see the proof of that, if that's the case.

A below-one-page one this time. :)

What-leadership!

what-consistency!

Weeks, months? by now? and...NOW... the Kumos move en-mass, to help.

To again, exceptional-Kumos, who came BEFORE this only-a-incentive was planned, (for whichever reasons it turns out to be),

only-you, deserve the respect of all-humanity,

amongst -any/-all who didn't delay their aid,

who didn't prioritize-WHERE, they might help, over whether-or-not to.

btw,

Marshalling is of those ALREADY-under your command, or already-READY to fight for something - not a mere incentive program, or some would say bribery or mercenary pay-out, in a dubious context.

"Marshalling" SUGGESTS true or actual loyalty.

What does the blurring of the difference with that word-choice, SUGGEST,..

...of our 'friends' in GalNet.

Oh-so courageous! we might see in him,

what a 20th/21st century, courtroom-drama!

Seeing Tanner now discharged supposedly from having "served time", is itself debatable, when after-lives lost, the finger-pointing begins,

Yet as-now, in the social-CONSEQUENCES we-face, with many X times-more lives being lost, and not many yet within federation space, a few, local-factional System-authorities held systems,

Where? are the,

acknowledgements of failings , of our-host-federation-that-empowers-this-court,

that ;

Were it not for neo-INRA burying the weaponization arms/tech-grab now-turned political-spin, 'it-was-always-for-fighting-the-thargoids' rationalizers and spin-doctors, trying to pretend as though the thargoids 'might-not' be intelligent, while witnessing intelligent RESPONSES to our actions over the time we've met them, might-not? ;

The entire? most-of? the situation even-exist?..

...and-so focusing on individual insubordination in the context of mass-conspiracy to conceal, kidnap and experiment on fellow-humans, conceal the truth from the public for 300 years, set up and murder or try-to, people like Jameson and all the victims of Black Flight - literally murdering you for just exploring around and discovering something by-chance, even, [https://elite-dangerous.fandom.com/wiki/Black_Flight] and other crimes, is utter-hypocrisy ,

especially considering that the 'might not be intelligent' self-delusions, tries to bury a basic reality of simple-BEHAVIOURAL-observational based communication, that does not require language, or communication-channels per se,

and that all-throughout the 300 years,

we've had AT-LEAST-THEM, to communicate with;

VIA demonstration,

VIA 'moving-back',

VIA wider system-permit blocks on Thargoid territory to prevent further-trespass, etc, etc,

Such 'communication' Has in fact ALWAYS BEEN possible, all-throughout the claimed periods in-which less 'effort' was supposedly spent than recently in the also similarly dramatic attempt of the Kingfisher's martydom, 'to communicate' deliberately in the face of the reprisal-fleets we now face.

In looking back at the reason for the official-allowance of the communication attempt by the Kingfisher, one might assume was only 'reasonable'-desperation in our hypocrisies,

but considering that intelligent? adult? professionals? within the federation and empire, INRA, the Club, and other influential bodies, managed to do LESS of such simpler and UNIVERSALLY UNDERSTOOD language-of-movement, or language-of territorial-claims-by-prescence/flag-planting/whatever, or language-of demonstrating social-flexibility, by returning stolen tech, destroying guardian-tech dangerous to bio-mechanical organisms / banning their use/adoptions/incorporation for diplomacy's sake, could've been done to send-a-message, all-throughout those 300 years,..

instead of potentially-unnecessary 'official channels' inflexibility, in other words. Since when did establishing 'official channels', matter MORE ?, than 'sending a message' via whichever seemed to MATCH, the intelligent response?

It seems to me at least, that there is a current, 'this-is-reasonable' excuse making process going on, for dependency-drama lowering of the bar, or lowering-of-social-intelligence-standards and trying to reduce-scrutiny into responsibility at larger-scales. trans-GalaticPower political-long-game, purposes.

Perhaps something as petty as superpower-hegemony.

Did we NEED Ram Tah to emerge, to identify that guardian tech was amongst Azimuth BioC.'s stuff in Hive Mind? From a non-involved person's POV, why was that supposed to be significant?

"Attract" ... explains-nothing. Clearly incomplete.

More withheld? or just ignorance?

Having revealed that guardian tech was REASONABLY-dangerous, would've inferred REASONABLE demands-from-humanity, to not further proliferate it.

Could it be, that a demand WAS SENT to humanity? ( perhaps in naivety/fair-ignorance of humanity's total disunity and tendency to play-with-intrigue and seek personal advantage over our own safety/reputation? That's not to blame the situation we're in on-thargoids reasonable-ignorance of humanity and how badly some handful of INRA or other private interest scum might've mis-handled and buried something so important-TO humanity, it's to point out, that that would-FIT, with the only-basic-level of description of thargoids behaviors, but-not conjecture on their REASONS-FOR those behaviors. )

Having to ADMIT, that bio-mechanically evolved but-retaining individuality with strict social order evolved-species are rightfully fearful of consciousness-blurring or 'leaving-behind' one's bodies type transcendental tech, is as i said last week, not unreasonable - what remains in human caution & wisdom to not allow it to go too-far, is the retention of the ability to disconnect, to un-plug, and still relatively-WHOLE anatomy - UNlike the guardians, we've learnt from their mistake - considering that that potential is even MORE of a reason to try to demonstrate to the thargoids that we HAVE ACKNOWLEDGEMENT OF THE RISK IN COMMON, and in reality ALREADY recognize the risk, or from a cynical-POV of theirs, if this is the case, humanity's not-YET gone-over the cliff of-no-return, in relation to the value of continuum-in-identity, or, not giving-up your sense of who you are entirely.

Surely within thargoids, there must be a sense of drone vs. queen vast differences of senses of identity, and drones most of all, would be by our standards/experience, the-most-aware of a similar feeling - while strict social-order is something that changes-the-context of a organization's or species's acceptance of a diluted or de-inviduated sense of identity, to be fair to humanity, we have not FAILED to recognize the risk they'd be concerned about, should it be able to combine with things like nanotechnology, or extreme automation, on in this case within this hypothetical, bio-mechanical organisms risk of being controlled by another form of invasive micro-tech - interesting point to note at this point, at no point have we noticed any thargoid tech, which-INFESTS, other things. By comparison, INRA/the Federation/the Empire's utilization of the fungus INRA weaponized, DID - even without guardian tech, we may well seem like little more than dishonorable, muck-throwing monkeys, having replaced a handful of what primates often do, with one with a mushroom growing out of it.

Impressive stuff, humanity! give yourselves a round of applause!

But seriously, a behavior of a micro-tech, that is LIKE an infectious/infestuous biological organism, is just-as-much a risk, to NOT-have-to accept BEING-SPREAD, by an otherwise responsible neighbor.

THAT, might be the true reality behind the war between the thargoids and guardians, and here we are, having learnt the lesson about not losing-ourselves-to sims/collective consciousness, but having-NOT learnt our lesson, about being considerate for your neighbors.

Because the federation were ACTIVE SUPPORTERS of Salvation, it's an obvious damage-control attempt to try to distance themselves from Salvation, the parallel, simultaneous, support of Azimuth CONTINUES, while we're now being shown the DRAMA, of after-lives-having-been-lost distraction, about Tanner.

now good folk,

Pity-poor-tanner, he didn't realize how SHALLOW the people were, behind the cover ups - instead of now focusing on Aegis, or other REAL organizational unification / federatING, conferrING, into a confederation against the thargoids,.. they have begun finger-pointing for the by-now tiny-fraction of lives lost at HIP 22460, while literally BILLIONS are being slaughtered.

No amount of would-bes in relation to something SO LATE, compared to what we could've done differently in relation to reasonable threats to bio-mechanicals, would then mean diddly-squat, if our conflict has ended up as inevitable as the guardians, if they-too, chose to be inconsiderate, if this is the case. Who threw the first stone, would become a matter of at-least recognizing a different KIND of stone, BEFORE any debates/decisions about it to be or not to be thrown. Avoiding talking about it's risk TO thargoids, avoids all responsibility, avoiding-admitting that it'd be a stone ABLE to be thrown, is like avoiding that the code on your home-defender gun case, in being 1,2,3,4, might be too simple for your child to guess at.

A similar simplicity of logic, has been applied to the 'non-connunicado' thargoids - perhaps they expected some BODY LANGUAGE first? or,.. perhaps at a extremely fundamental level, that all that ANY two species meeting for the first time,..

...POSSIBLY CAN, expect of each other?

Similarly, did Ram Tah focus on TRESPASSES of the guardians? could-he even attempt to answer that question, with what data he had? History is written by the winners, or in the case of what we know from only having 1's side of the story, if we cannot know that the guardians did-not trespass, they might've dismissed the same social-norms and courtesies as we have,

both possibly,.. 'so-what!' angry-teenagers, yet to've had to recover from a spear in the leg, when underestimating how important territorial boundaries can be. The claimed repetition of aggression, needs to be explored in finer-detail, and corroborated, and re-framed in terms of possibilities-that-REMAIN - rather than just replying on a handful of expert reviewers and analysts - what reason to we have to trust the guardians' commitment-to COMPLETE pictures in their own records?

They were a highly advanced civilization, with a lot to be proud-of - why should pride, or at least simulated-anger, have necessarily-not-been-possible, (and so their records DELIBERATELY left-incomplete / avoiding painting the-whole-picture) when we know ourselves, that emotion is still very much so possible, in virtual form, rather than only in the mostly-biological.

Without the Federation's support no-less-than-any-of-the-other active-supporters of INRA, Azimuth, and Salvation, in having been given too much free-reign rather then being only CONDITIONALLY-supported-UNDER-supervision / only CONDITIONALLY-worked-with, NONE of the consequences since then, would've happened.

Resources were placed IN AZIMUTH'S hands,.. much in the same way that the same mistake keeps being made by some but not all in the federation, when it comes to Corporations serving, rather than so-called 'corporate government' ... after the mycoid weapon was developed, arguably-succeeded and created space & time for us,.. the truth could've come-out, or at least MOST of it, from their POV,..

NONE of it was!!

and now, we face a second impasse, where literally hundreds of years of preparation we COULD've been doing, has not happened, does not exist in-this-timeline ... because of the selfishness of those directly responsible for the secrecy and the criminal aspects of early-INRA and Azimuth, and especially Black Flight.

The FSD or something like it, may well've been developed earlier, too, if a sense of URGENCY about thargoids return,.. WAS,.. rather than was-not, in the public's mind - instead of seeing the vast POTENTIAL, of a mobilized and fearful public,..

The public-of-humanity was demeaningly UNDERestimated like vulnerable children, lied to, it's trust betrayed especially by Black Flight, and now we're being asked to LISTEN, to the same authorities, with the same skin ... defending the same identity, as those that betrayed us, and broke-our-trust in them.

Why should we?

Check this obvious shite, from Azimuth ;

“Sadly, I often come across such simplistic blame-seeking from those with limited comprehension of the issue. The plain fact is that nobody could have predicted the Thargoids’ excessive reaction to our activities in HIP 22460. The Proteus Wave was deemed an acceptable means of ending the war, approved by individuals with far more military experience than Salvation could claim.”

"excessive" - the 'plan', the sales-pitch, with salvation, that drew the suckers in, was literally to disable all their ships within our Galaxy.

If someone tried to do that to us, when would our punishment to them, be "excessive"?

And yet he talks about limited-comprehension.

The obvious limited social-comprehension on display here, is just the latest, of a series of KNOWingly-false-presentations of uncertainty-about thargoids, such as the "no-one's really sure if they're even intelligent or not" ones, where the PRESENTED 'opinion', only APPEARS, to be presenting a potential version of reality, with less-RISK in it, than really exists.

THAT, is typical of both corporations, democratic politicians, autocrats & similar, and over-proud Imperial retainers/royalty, alike, when looking-back, the decision making was-with risk, and then how much they knew, COULD BECOME an issue for them politically.

And that, is also exactly what we're seeing being futile-ly being attempted to be avoided here, when it comes to not only HIP 22460, but the much larger number of systems, loss-of-life/assets/production-capacities/infrastructure... everything,.. that we are now seeing being lost as a result of their reply.

ADMITTING, to social-REALITIES, is perhaps the only path to honesty there, but don't hold your breath. Corporate governance, rather-than corporate-service-providing-UNDER-true-government, isn't likely to shift it's position to humanity-wide collective better-planning necessitating risk being more broadly speculated on, rather than supposedly "reliable" fact seeking.

The simplification this suit is trying to make sound reasonable here, is that prediction, future-telling, is not possible. It is. It just requires continual de-mystification, so that excuse making scum like that one, do not get to limit our conversations and debate, in terms of supposedly reliable concrete information.

Ironically, never-gambling as they would put it, ON the less-concrete,

is ITSELF, a gamble, in the bigger picture / overall-tactics.

If the secrecy around the original trespassing of humanity into thargoid territory, and early tech-grab SELF-INTERESTED advantage-gainsaying, between the Empire and the Federation mostly, had-not-made-us the aggressor in the first place, the continued secrecy in terms of what-ELSE, was being risked, of our potential RANGE of prospect-future-relationships with thargoids that COULD've been, would not-now, be needing to be so dismally attempted to be covered up by those who have ruined any such preferable neutrality, or even eventual cultural-exchange. Similarly, if we had started along that path, but then still-discovered guardian tech, if they responded to that with aggression, the MESSAGE, would have again been CLEAR.

Denying such INTELLIGENT RESPONSES, does nothing to improve our position, nor improve own own understanding of what has ACTUALLY happened, and what-was-gambled-upon.

They could at least ADMIT to what THEY THOUGHT, we 'needed to' gamble upon.

i.e. the further away from your initial duplicity/self-interest you are, the further away people's 'still-fresh' memories in their minds are, in this case several hundred years? far too much for most if-not-all. Hence as we are now trying to take collective responsibility for our future in relation to them, it's simply most-likely too late, to ever get-back to a diplomatic opportunity, and as we collectively realize this, then the ultimate blame will become more apparent - it would come as no surprise for instance, to see that the shares/ownership of Azimuth, have long-since left the hands of those responsible for the initial political/diplomatic mistakes (the trespasses, the tech-theft, etc)

Escalating the demands for Azimuth to be forcefully taken over, so that they do NOT have their own self-led direction, will perhaps be our only,.. 'we-did-this-right' claim once all the dust has settled. But no amount of attempted blurring-the-lines, scale-of-impact-from-consequences downplaying, or other risk-&-consequence attempted weaseling-out, of admitting that that the response we are currently seeing, WAS DUE, to our own escalation, and not theirs, will ever make WHOME, amongst us, in our DISunity, threw-the-first stone. Trespass could've been ignored/dismissed/tit-for-tat-de-escalated. Tech-theft, could-not - WE BECAME, a threat, to the thargoids.

i.e. Literally as simply, as, who-did-what-first?

All social realities of harm-against another, can be measured by that a-step-back perspective.

If just-one, of the club, was to grow-a-pair, and reveal how much WAS-predicted,.. ( apparently impossible, according to this Azimuth suit - yet THEY planned on predictions a long time ago - what does that reveal!! ) ... we would be starting to see just how much has been being-planned on predictions,..

'non-concrete's,

and therefore WHY, words-as-hollow as the ones coming from this suit, should never be co-adopted as norms, or likely group-expectations, or whatever else, amongst other similar entities, or our politics at a larger scale.

The only thing i got from it, was they they're wanting to make ONLY hip 22460, potentially be admitted-to, seem reasonable, while the SOCIAL CONSEQUENCES, somehow-not.

THAT, is social-reality. admitting to what REALLY happened, as a result of your actions, even-if not specifically known. The specifics of INTELLIGENT responses, to threats, is not outside, our ability to predict - so his words are clearly nothing but desperate 'conversation-changing' failed-damage-control. Pathetic.

Forced-corporate-takeover of Azimuth as an irresponsible-corporate-citizen / criminally-liable private acting ON OTHERS assets/personals/property/life , then see where we can go, from-there.

It is utterly hypocritical, to claim that the future cannot be predicted, when that is EXACTLY what was claimed, when it came to the supposed history-of-aggression between the thargs and the guardians (then-inferred could apply to us).

I'm not saying that history is necessarily wrong, it could be true, but it more than 'convenient', for companies like Azimuth, whose funding and very existence, would not exist, if it were not for past-gambling on a non-concrete, in our predictions of what the thargoids might do to us.

i.e. THOSE predictions,.. WERE non-concrete, and yet we acted on those!

==================================================================

For all we know, the guardians might've been being irresponsible with their nano-tech/cyber-integrations, and the first TECH-threat might've actually been a tech-controlling-biomechanics one, that the guardians dismissed as something they had a right-to-do, but might've actually been the first dangerous escalation between the two.

Here in Utopia we have some experience with the flak that comes of potentials of too-much integration, and i'm pretty sure, i'm not the only one willing to admit that it could go too far. If the thargoids-aggression was real,.. so-too,.. might the DANGER, of the guardians LEVEL, of automation, and 'moreso-machine' choices, rather than 'moreso-still-organic'.

Disproove THAT-one, Azimuth, i'd like to see you try.

Long story short, as-welcome as Winters words are,

we shall see how much effort is SENT, in an organized-WAY, from the Federation,

compared-to

from-smaller-groups,.. ARRIVE, on their own initiative.

A bit of history, reveals more about how well the federation has been able to consistently COMMIT, to nurturing or curating, what they've already created, as both the Galactic power with the oldest pre-formative connections to older org.s , authority, & human identities.

far-enough back, before the FSD emerged, colonization was slow, RETURNS in a financial sense, must've been a immense-gamble, and a massive commitment in terms of personal sacrifice as-well-as monetary sacrifice, colonists literally sacrificing DECADES of their lives, to their claims. Human colonization is by no means legitimate in any universal sense, but COMPARATIVE claims, by subsequent federation thieves, remain even-more illegitimate by-contrast. The systematic theft of huge amounts of property, while replacing it with basically whitewashed or money-laundering laundered new ownership, to not create, but STEAL, much of the wealth that exists in the human core as well as within the federation, remains both more than a stain, but also an indicator of who within the federation, when INHERITING their personal wealth, are no better than older (and supposedly superseded) concepts of the combination of inheritant law & personal-property with more complex structures - in other words, some of the AIMS of the Empire, in not being content with legal minimalisms of personal property and wealth concepts (and the consequences of LAWS in relation to them especially inheritance/wills/title, etc), were despite however unsuccessful compared to newer networks between corporations and governments/banks, still better retainers of the concept of not-LEAVING too much to-chance - meaning, in situations like the leadership/political-capital/good-planning -void, created by the Birthright Wars, from Utopia's perspective, we can only look on at what COULD've been the result of ... well ... ANYthing rather-than-nothing, in the wake of the new corporations' arrival, unsurprising risk-shifts, and presumably mass-liquidation, or conversion of their stolen assets INTO new value in the currencies presumably then already-watered-down at the time, the supposed 'value' of the claimed speed of development that the corporations might bring, to then bump-up the value, and by-then the original gamblers on the Birthright Wars, no-longer OBLIGED to have to CONTINUE TO OWN, the assets they stole.

i.e. trying to avoid whatever CONSEQUENCES, would occur in a LONGER TIMEFRAME, than might appear to be a risk, in the immediate - if getting in there, stealing, and then SELLING, soon after the values had gone up, but BEFORE uncertainty started to cause new-owners to think-twice and stop buying, those behind the criminality of the BR Wars, likely sold everything they could, and started to avoid continuing to own anything NEAR political strife.

After the emergence of especially the Kumos, but also our own rejections of remote/foreign ownership, it was far too late, by-then,

to ignore whether or not those that had PLANNED the BR Wars, really knew what they were doing, or-not, in a sense of a RESPONSIBLE political-belligerent.

it is in THAT context we now have, even without having-to address ultimate replacing-the-old-with-the-new attempted rationalizations of the BR Wars' claims,..

...the-perspective, of being able to see what TOO-RAPID-a political transformation on the SCALE of the BR Wars can cause, or perhaps transformations too much of a 'wiping-of-the-slate' can cause, despite whichever best-intentions of whatever few good people amongst all the simple thieves, actually BELIEVED, in the 'good'pretext of the BR Wars.

Having NEVER REALLY HAD PROOF, of what inheritant owners might've done,.. it was always speculation/a-claim-of historical experience - in reality, even monarchies change their minds as new threats/issues emerge.

Now huge amounts of Black Markets are the norm around the areas more heavily affected by the BR Wars, and the dismissive-politics of the impact of them (without at least wealth-distribution as-happens in many of Utopia's communisms & cooperatives), is pushed by those with a general sense of independence, but little sense of the long-term consequences of desensitization-to a lack of law & order.

It is in that LONGER GAME context, that we aim for something better, and Winters is not the first leader to recognize it - if the maelstroms were wreaking havoc amongst Kumo space, there would be sympathy, but would there be more at-risk / more-valued, in what could be lost, if they were left-unaddressed to devastate Utopia?

Especially since INdirects, from political-neglect, spill-over into one's neighbors' realms. One only needs to goto those more aware/perceptive in LYR, to find people who also-appreciate what-we-do-not spread, while still reasonably-uncertain about-what we do aim, to create.

If AXI has leaders of any similar caliber to Winters, they could perhaps recognize, 5 things;

1 The alliance will help LYR, and visa-versa. The first maelstrom arrived there, but LONGER-SIGHTED decision making, might be needed to protect what might become valuable to HUMANITY, especially anti-thargoid R&D. Utopia is one of those concentrations of science, in relation to them. Perhaps not so much manufacturing, but both are necessary.

2 The Empire, is both already by-far the largest superpower and-so least deserving by a simple measure, of help from outside itself! That is ofc not saying Empire citizens won't be suffering,.. it's to say they've likely got the most TO-DEPEND on.

3 The Groms are not under attack by the maelstroms, at least not yet,

4 That only leaves us and Kumos, and they aren't either. ( i should at this point also thank Kumo Cmdrs who've also excelled themselves, and what many might assume of them, in choosing to come to fight the tharg.s outside their territory (if Winters is an excellent-Fed, then you are excellent-Kumos))

5 While individual independent systems outside Utopia will suffer just as much as ones inside, if Utopia's VALUE is arguably worth more than random systems out in the black, as harsh as it might sound. to say this, there might be individual systems within Utopia, that AXI could choose to assist trying to defend, where there is more at-risk from the combination of it's economy type especially, high tech & industry especially, at a time of MAKING THE MEANS TO COMBAT thargoids, and Utopia's developmental/research/inter-dependency focus.

Many such systems exist inside & outside Utopia, but again the-decider might be that Utopia cross-SHARES it's developmental aims, it's 'hive mind' (well the limited-reality compared to the myth), can DO MORE, with the same size world better-connected to-us, to-it, than a similar sized world independently out in the black, might-not.

Yes, * palm up * ofc that sounds self-interested, but it is ALSO TRUE, in terms of where Utopian-TECHNOLOGY is yet-to've reached, and-so also in a real sense, the collaborative & hive-mind like potentials OF more separated systems are arguably less-so.

Sometimes on the other hand, isolation, and silencing the chattering-monkey voices in one's head, can facilitate more creativity, but if needing to CONCENTRATE scientific efforts, especially-collaboratively during a crisis is the name of the game, then it's fair to say we've GOT the best trumpet to-be-blowing, even if it sounds self-interested when we do.

shrugs

Inventors simply unplug, when needing to inside Utopia, and then re-log back in, when re-connecting - however much more isolated-inspiration might arguably come-from systems out in the black rather than under a Galatic Power, is not something humanity as-a-whole can depend on being-able-to-be-concentrated, in a short-time, in a crisis like this. Already-interconnected minds, naturally STAY connected, as they react to whatever attacks them - it's not a time to further gamble on wasting too much, on micro-independents that will not contribute as much as other potentially more critically-needed/valuable systems, that might/will. Tourism systems, for instance, are likely to be the least supported EVERYwhere. Similar practical logic please AXI! You're more than welcome!

Back to Winter's wisdom/humanity/excellence here,

Seeing the benefits of aiding a competitor and/or especially enemy, is never something to-assume will happen even in the worst of crises,

But, not all competitors/enemies are the same, and often some if not also many are only enemies when it comes to some issues and more like as-has-been wisely chosen in this statement from Winters, neighbors rather than enemies.

Neighbors-then, that get used to years of the by-products, embitternesses and neglects, of the Birthright Wars and the needed stabilization/care subsequent to them when perhaps peaceful-TRANSITIONS could've been chosen instead,.. which are everywhere in our neck of the woods,.. have DESERVING social-expectations, were, one's neighbors,..

...responsible-neighbors, more specifically.

At whatever end of this crisis may-come, there will be plenty of proof, of what kind of neighbors, we HAD.

IMO, the largest of the by-products of the BR Wars, is arguably, the entire Kumo org. and Galatic Power, or i should say, the conditions in-which they EMERGED.

It would be attributing too much, to say that the federation created the Kumos, but if humanity wanted to see en-mass, what corporate neglect can-cause, compared to other experience in government & rule, then it HAS-seen, more than enough of exactly-that, not-to keep making the mistake, of gambling on corporations ruling, rather than serving, or in more modern terms, providing service/s.

============

And-yet, that is also, exactly, what was chosen, with Salvation, or more broadly, Azimuth.

Utopia's REASONS, to treat corporations neutrally, and conditionally, exist for good reason. never doubt that, at-least. o7

While the approach of the Stargoids is without a doubt, in not-knowing exactly what they are yet, something that could and perhaps soon will, be both hostile and already-clearly a response to Wycherly's grand-cock-up,

It is one thing to want to counter hesitancy in military ranks, or in mercenary-irregulars, when perceiving a threat to commitment, or to the appeal to fight,

It is another, to deliberately paint all not of the same mind as you, with a single brush ;

[https://www.elitedangerous.com/news/galnet/xeno-peacers-reject-prediction-war]

Perhaps that article was researched with a lot more detail from a lot more pro-peace activists / advocates, than only those 3 quotes,

but of what we have been shown, only the first, ACTUALLY addresses potential hostility, in saying, "...they (Ram Tah/Palin/Tesreau) have offered no hard evidence", and "...I don’t think we should be using her (Seo Jin-ae's) vague instincts to inform official policy"

Not even the second statement there, disagrees,

'that the Stargoids COULD-not be hostile' , or something IMAGINED, like that?

Pay attention to grammar, Galnet,

might-not, does not mean the same thing, as will-not,

could, does-not mean necessarily-not (either) - it is a recognition of possibility for whatever it was used with - sometimes only one possibility, sometimes multiple.

What Bernadette Wells says she believes, neither represents us all,

nor FOCUSES, on CONTINGENCY-readiness ;

i.e. being ready for one thing, while preferring-another,

'although-not-getting-your-hopes-up' , OR

'not waiting on faith', or similar.

THAT, is what most pro-peacers expect.

Who is Bernadette Wells? A old 20th/21st century CIA tactics, stand-in perhaps?

An ACTOR, having leanrt her part carefully,

to be an 'example',

for all to see? (as-what all pro-peacers would-be, or 'are' )

"rejects-predictions"

Is NOT what she said,

even if she was such a psy-ops means-to-an-end.

And it's not what most pro-peace Pilot's federation Cmdrs say, either. A few distant scientists, do not represent us all.

Yet this typical scapegoating article by Galnet, tries to suggest that singular-LY, 'peacers',

"reject predictions"

I don't, and i'm a peacer. AND a fighter, when it comes to Thargoids.

Since-when, were all pro-peacers, necessarily as one-dimenstional as those behind this article wish us to-be able-to-be-seen as?

Cmds, never see yourselves in a SINGLE light, like those behind such articles, and such military-political rhetoric, want to pressure you into either-of , -of.

They wish to try to impossibly reduce the complicated to the simple, or at least, present their own would-be levels-OF complication thought-through, as complete, while often actually being capable of-recognition-of, those arguably within a group, ALREADY painted with a different brush.

Arriving late, the General turned-amateur graphitti artist, tries to make his or her level of perception, seem-more-pragmatic by it's simplicity,

But in reality, it is only a seeming-similar, act, for-the-grunts, for the low-levels-of-rhetoric-required votes.

Many of you, had BOTH ;

A potential readiness to defend humanity, AND a desire for any peace that might've been possible,

not just-one of the two.

Considering how-LATE this (official) communications attempt is, and-considering how-CLOSE-to the tharg arrival of their response-TO, our attempt to cripple all their ships in the Galaxy,

Which SHOULD be hostile, really,

One might also wonder if this 'attempt',

is actually an attempt, to scuttle FUTURE peace-attempts/diplomacy-attempts,

In knowing that it probably has almost no chance of success.

i.e. attempts COULD've been made in the past,

but ONLY NOW, have those wanting to set-up future peace failures,

'allowed'-the-attempt-now.

There is precedent for such tactics.

i.e. A policy might've / might exist, to only allow / only support attempts, WHEN-KNOWING that they don't stand much of a chance of succeeding,

to INDIRECTLY, facilitate more political-capital / reinforce rhetoric, create opportunities to point the finger / create scapegoats, etc.

COST? to those wishing for more war?

One/a few senators, a few hundreds of millions, or tens of billions perhaps, however much,..

GAIN?

Many ending up believing that peace was never possible, or never will be.

A lie about the past,

and a 'example' for the future,

staged by those who-also created the hostility we are likely about to see arrive in the core systems, and earth itself.

Even in this moment of likely FEAR,

of what will happen as a result of their dishonorable-gamble with Whycherly,

They seek to scrabble for political ground, in this case mere inches, from a helpless opponent, or more accurately,..

...from someone NOT-PLAYING-their-game.

What is gained?

You'd be revealing of what you are, moreso than succeeding in making all peacers seem-the-same.

I hope i'm wrong about that.

=============

Even so,

Did that thought, stop at least this pro-peacer, from helping it's CG?

no.

Genuine attempts, or measures of sentiment, even if in situations of entrapment,

are still recognizable within fractions, proportions, of humans,

then even-just-that, could be useful to give Thargoids the idea that even when betraying / entrapping ourselves,

that there is genuine WILL, outside the paradaigms, outside the pictures-painted BY the conspiratorial-scuttler, those who would entrap fellow-humans / tactically-scuttle peace processes / try to hijack movements, etc

While no-doubt with little time to care for our politics / self-organization / leadership, when according to Ram Tah? was it? they're in a civil war / factional dispute, and would probably struggle to know HOW to 'mutually-garden' some humans, had they the TIME, especially, to do so,

Assuming this attempt fails, it (the above 'will-to-try' of those who gave the attempt a CHANCE, however doomed-to-fail it might turn out to be) might at least give them pause for thought,

about WHICH-humans,..

...to-target.

If those high-up within Utopia were the type to pray, it'd probably be for-that, if anything.

How much? needs-to-be-said, to raise the level-of-demand of recognition of what Azimuth are trying to do , by trying to portray-themselves as somehow 'still' able to be responsible , were they for instance, having-used ACTUAL,.. VOLUNTEERS, is probably debate-able,..

... but wow - trying to pretend as though one of your illegal human experimentation kidnapping victims, would be better-off ... THEIR-welfare ... under your 'care' ... is little-more, besides designed for shock-value,.. little-more, than trying to lower the bar - trying to get into YOUR heads, dear-reader - trying to get you used-to , familiarized , de-sensitized, etc to being inconsiderate, rationalist of criminal-process, that itself, also risks further-escalations with the Thargoids. Although no actual laws bind either species to conduct / rules in relation to each other, being asked to accept that kidnapping-FOR human experimentation, can be turned a blind eye to, is a mistake in terms of expectations of morality that causes the external observer to judge-US ... as the evil/enemy, the deed-committer, to then act-against.

If the thargoids have any significant detail, about our ethics & HOW Azimuth got their 'volunteers' , they will not hesitate to see-THROUGH the depressingly re-occurring , re-emergent , false-hopes,.. of self-deluded human-value 'freedoms' of opinion, acceptance-or-rejection-of-morals/principles , and everything else, that generally facilitates EXCUSES, when we already know-better. It's even comparable within Earth - one does not even need to get 'perspective' , via aliens - an Ant colony, for instance, does NOT delude-itself, with individualist supposedly-valuable ... 'values'.

They're more like IDEALS. Have INdirect value, but are not actually what we tell ourselves they are, and do not create what we like-to-pretend they do.

The 'ideal' with Azimuth has failed so many times, yet even-still, the lies about the supposed 'success' ... of the original fungus get vainly-maintained despite what we know , which may well turn out to've been little more than an Unsuccessful, premature waste of a weapon that could've been used at a time at which we could've consolidated other gains we could've made against them - no-one ever really "knew", that we didn't stand a chance without it's immediate use - knee-jerk vs. keeping it in reserve, in other words ... and that's even-IF, accepting the premise that we(humans) are the victims.

If the original humans that incurred / tresspassed, were NOT actually, never-simply ... 'humans' ... but actually PRIVATE INTERESTS,

then THOSE private interests,

are the thargoids'-enemy.

If we can ever ask them to somehow ignore what has been done in humanity's name ... in the name-of, humanity,.. then will we ever get the chance, to help THEM, get the recognition THEY, deserve, of the original trespasses / protection of technology (IP, commercially - at higher level it's more like any-PRESENCE of technology) ... that we expect of ourselves all the time... yet there was not even any PAUSE,

to think about whether or not someone else's technology, does or does not BELONG to you, or no-one ... unlike say, the Guardians.

Theirs, by our laws,.. were up-for-grabs / reverse-engineering / imitation.

THAT difference, ironically, could've facilitated peace against the Thargs, decades? a hundred? years ago?

all that needed to be recognized, was both sides claims - neither owned guardian, nor would the Thargs have reasonably been able to ask us to not use it should we find it NOT on a claimed WORLD ... territory ... but say,.. in a stray, lost guardian ship, perhaps, and all we needed to be told, was where not to RISK becoming the Thargs enemies, by dis-regarding their claimed territories.

Again, communication was key,

and whatever communications have been attempted, if any, are either being kept from the public, or at least their METHOD, not exposed to public SCRUTINY, so that we could all see where we might be going wrong.

Such as having to use some kind of animal-intelligence / plant/insect-intelligence FILTER, or 2-step translation process instead of expecting literal speech/writing/alphabets like ours ... the ... HOW, not whether or not to try.

The pushers of the ... 'humanity-comited-no-trespass' argument, still CHOOSE-NOT to expose thargoid territorial claims, if they in fact have been communicated,

but it would be suggesting too much, to go straight from their abscence under the public-eye, to a conclusion that they do exist and aren't being leaked BY those who would have an interest in then prooving that we didn't at-least trespass.

i.e. those wanting us to all focus on the present, rather than still-current logics like that, don't want you thinking about BOTH the present AND-the-past - they only want you to think about the present.

Is there a clear, publically-revealed, path to peace?

no, so the HOW might reveal-it rather than it being-known and now-only needing to be GOT-TO via different 'hows',.. we might need to work out the how, rather than who... or,.. when,.. or where,.. but does that mean that there is none, just because those wanting to bury the past and not draw a line in the sand, for the Thargoids to not-cross, while decimating those kept-inside the lines we might draw?

no - choosing to draw a line in the sand, will at least demonstrate to the Thargoids that we are willing to ADMIT the mistakes that've been made, should they desire to become, a 'constant gardener', in both their interests as well as ours.

Clinging to atrocities like Azimuth, will NOT lead to any such recognition of human flexibility, which by comparison, they might be SURPRISED, we are capable-of.

Hence why WHO ... is, important,.. when it comes to who-represents humanity?

well no-one at the moment,.. sorry!... etc,

but long-term, if WE, don't even respect the supposed representations of human-interests / approvals-of-action / technology-steals of the past,

then WHY,

should thargoids, when it was THEIR technology, that 'we' would've been 'choosing' , to steal?

That's exactly the difference we must keep remembering - it was NOT,

'humanity',

it was some if not all of the Club, the Aegis-superpower backed in-house private interests, at that time, mostly facilitated by the federation and empire? ( correct me on that one if i'm remembering it too narrowly )

THAT difficulty, for only a few of the superpowers, that the Thargoids find themselves probably struggling-to-understand, should not REMAIN a jeopardising sort of escalation too-high above the capacities of the smaller powers, to ever be able to feel like they can act on - how about a PACT, between ALL the OTHER powers, never-involved in the original experimentation, weaponization, tech-theft and demonisation in the media, agree to neutrality temporarily, for as long as the forced-jeopardy-OVER-humanity's OWN right to represent itself, remains.

Clearly in RESPONSE, to the proteus wave attempt, we get this

"Thargoids’ aggression toward humanity".

[https://www.elitedangerous.com/news/galnet/fears-rise-thargoid-expansion]

"aggression-towards"?

after humans have just tried wiping them out of the Galaxy?

Time to go back-to-school, general - aggression is of who struck FIRST, an aggressor is whome STARTS a conflict / strikes FIRST.

Is there any point in TRYing to explain that to fednecks?

One of the problems expected when Transcendental Tech was developed, was that there would be many mutually-annihilative concepts, memories, beliefs, and at a raw level, memory-neuron-complex precepts before interconnection,.. meaning, everyone's neuronal complexes would not be the same, even for similarly developed ones for the same thing, and when both are exposed to each others' conflicting / contradicting experiences, one-if-not-also-both, cannot continue to stay the same in boths' minds.

example ; The experience of say, wind, could be significantly different in one person's mind compared to the next, connections to things in one's mind completley absent in the next's mind,.. so-then over time, as people shared experiences through TT, although there would still always be differences, at least the chance at remembering someone else's reasons-FOR connections to other complexes that one would otherwise not have any of, would at least become a CHANCE - a psychiatrist remembering something from a patient 50 years ago, might only have a distant single-neural-connection to something they didn't understand from some of the disturbances their patient suffered back then, but it turns out to be just-enough, for one day with a current patient, something concerning to ring-a-bell, and the doctor scratches it off their list of concerning-behaviours , and the current patient is allowed-out,.. etc.

The-certainty that some incompatible-complexes will not be able to mutually-exist as-true, or at least without-doubt, in those exposed to each-others' memories, experiences, perceptions & reasonings, teaching, etc, meant that either preferred soft-TTlearning or potentially-forced TTlearning, would become possible within a relatively reliable base of mutual-annihilation for things like delusion, over-conceptualisation/self-identification, self-aggrandisment, megalomania, and even common cockyness, just to start with some obvious ones - arrogance-WITH-reason (a cocky rally-car-driver with a perfect record), compared to temporary-confidence-DESPITE-self-doubt (a problem-gambler)(temporary forced-false-belief).

As a natural & logical extension of the purposes of encouraging-eliminating such counter-productive neurological snowballs,

things from the past that are CLUNG-to that have-had indirect harmful neurological development have to be actively-detected and denied - or worse ;

ii) ones that-still encourage harmful in the present, or seem like a explination of it's prescence (your hallucinations are visions from-our god! etc),

iii) or even worse, ones that are KEPT-going, auto-self-reinforcing, via supposed instruction from idolised figures from the past,.. their, either i, themselves-pushed harmful concepts/beliefs/neurologies, or ii, others misportrayals of their harmful concepts/beliefs/neurologies portrayed & mis-portrayed over-time to the point of absurdity and outright fraud, and the re-writers' OWN interests, escapisms, and conveniences of a single story, or a history, changed, whatever original history or importances from some individual either forgotten, no longer valued,..

( or perhaps the value was important at the time but looking back seems less significant than other things then focused on by those RE-portraying them - classic greek mathematicians, for instance, remembered for minor quirky, inventive, or behvaioural peculiarities, while SEQUENTIALLY, without them, no-one can say how far-back we'd be set as a species in terms of where we are now - somewhat like a time-travel premise science fiction setting, where a critical development is delayed by the time traveller, and when they return Earth is unrecognisable - when significant figures' point-in-time, is now so long forgotten, or only some things from their time are estimatable, that even-fewer bother to spend time guessing as to exactly what did or did not exist IN their time, but neverless end up UNhealthily spending time thinking that being able to do so, will grant significant perspective on remaining words, lessons, wisdoms,..)

...whatever - clinging emotionally to scraps from someone else's life, instead of paying attention to their own.

The difference between hypothetically valuable archaeology, anthropology, or similar, and by comparison, outright-obsession with archaic figures whose wisdoms are now of limited relevence,..

... is now starkly-contrasted & clear, and TT is a furthernig means to an end in that sense of being able to firmly say-no to hoped-for perpetuations of value from the past, that have too much dependence on Earth-developed contexts, opportunities, and whatever else, that DEPENDS, on their relevencies simply BEING, suited, to where they were developed / found-advantageous / beneficial-to-society / whatever.

That being said, without getting into a anti-religious rant,

And also-without getting into how religion has had it's time of prominence, dominances, oppressions, and abuses of self-claimed-authority, absurdities like 'knowing' that one's confidence in whether or not one's role-in, or organisation deserves-authority, is 'god-given', as-evidenced by supposed 1st-person 'experience' , never substantiatable, but spoilt-brat unable to be DIS-proved - spoilt-brat immaturity-DEFENDED, utter insanity, to've ever been relied upon as METHOD , for determining who-best to take on roles of responsibility - humanity at least started rejecting that long in our past, but remnants of the ARROGANCE, remain, especially in falls-short-of-admitting-to-the-right-thing admissions, weak-statements, and now that they're suppressed, simple inclusivity-APPEAL, to try to appeal to one's desire for unity, or harmony, to get more TRUST, despite how much we KNOW we should not trust religions from the past - actually still relevent/useful wizdoms kept, in edited-upon-edited smaller-and-smaller versions, the books SHRINKing in size, as times go on,.. maybe, OK, sure.

[ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kW_uhFAb8kQ ]

.

But no,.. still-staunch-defenders of everything they ever-were? Wake up.

The already-defeated, in that sense, amongst(most) religions, now seeking to appeal to our desire for harmony, via total-inclusion,..

... as naive as the teacher who lets the voilent student back in with the rest of the students because of their own confidence that they were being genuine in their shame, not just, putting-on-a-face-for-the-teacher - EQUIVALENTLY ... who honestly trusts the far god cult even THAT-much? They have no INTENTION, of even staying-amongst the students in the same class, equivalently - 'I'm leaving' ... instead of 'You're going to have to be removed from the room'.

Why-WAIT, in other words, in false-hope, instead of breaking them down psycho-analyticaly and treating them like they should be - I cannot and would-not speak for Utopia, but i sure as hell know which kinds of institutions i would send them to rather-than foster, -them, in-Utopia,.. in order to bring about harmony - it would NOT be taxes-subsidied start-up religious-communities - it would be little more than forced TTlearning parallel with some research into what is appealing-TO them, as they're being indoctrinated / made to FEEL like they're a part of a community while abandoning the rest of their ACTUAL community when going off on some wild-goose-chase.

Religious exploration is one thing, but IRResponsbility-of-the-mind being turned a blind-eye to in the name of harmony to this EXTENT, is even arguably-neglectful on our part. If supposedly so-valuable freedom, has nothing to hide, then WHY would it transition INTO a situation of neglect like that? There would be nothing to have to answer-for.

So similarly, how can Griffin possibly think that the Far God cult is simply "lawful" ?..

her words : "...We must also remember that it is a lawful institution,.."

...simply? based on whether or not they appear to-only abide by current laws in terms of spreading their madness where they are welcome to try-&-fail, presumably by worlds where any tourist will have to spend money there while-there, regardless of whether there for pleasure, business, or things as dated as pilgrims or whatever from religion.

[https://www.elitedangerous.com/news/galnet/far-god-cult-praises-alien-victory]

It is one thing to be able to point out their evasions of breaching the law WHILE in human-laws-controlled-spaces,

But it's another, to end up indirectly-implying that they're neccessarily legally-intended/intentional OUTSIDE-scrutiny.

i.e. we have NO IDEA, what they might've been up to OUTside our human-laws-controlled-space , underground, etc, etc

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.

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Don't bother reading any more, if you don't want to bother with a hypothetical. :D

Personally, the coincidence in-time of their activities when the Alexandria was sabotaged/interdicted, is enough for me to wonder WHO the-Witch / Salvation could've been bargaining-with at the time, if what was left of Azimuth, might not've had the manpower to do the raid on it while it was stranded inbetween worlds, and it would not surprise me if the cult were part of that raid and perhaps got some of the Guardian tech, Wycherly perhaps thinking that using them was a harmelss gamble if sooner or later after defeating the thargoids, whatever the cult had done with it's share, would not matter.

The possibility of thargoid spies or spying technology discovering the cult, could open up a range of possibilities in terms of how the cult could be being used BY thargoids, if they've already contacted them / might be controlling individuals.

What if,.. this catastrophe with the attempt to use a thargoid site as a wave-generator, has been partially orchestrated by those CLOSE to Wycherly, from that possible previous-co-operation with the Alexandria, and the spies / agents of the thargs were already AMONGST Azimuth, or perhaps a support crew or something, and got close enough to be able to send back info enough, that the thargoids KNEW it would fail, but they let it happen, so we would again end up doing the grunt-work for them in COLLECTING guardian stuff into ONE LOCATION again,

and then after the dust'd settled, and humanity had turned-tail and run, as we have again,

all they had to do was salvage whatever remained of the collection of guardian artifacts/tech we'd conveniently collected FOR THEM, unknowingly, or simply destroyed it.

I can't remember a single time, that when we've been collecting Guardian stuff into one location, that it's been successful - there was a data-collection delivery to one of the engineers, once, before they released a new item, guardian SLFs, i think,..

pfffff... maybe it's the conspiracy-theorist in me,.. but it seems like we're taking the SAME STUPID mistakes with collecting guardian stuff into SINGLE locations, for then, something to go wrong, and for the thargs to end up taking it all.

As pilot's-federation pilots, how might we be able to STOP this pattern? ( guardian-tech-colelction into single-locations ( even-if my theory about the cult is wrong))

it looks like the leadership of the superpowers, are all mad-gamblers ATM, how can we convince them to create CONTINGENCIES?

small caches,

backup manufacturing undergrounds,

material reserves,

whatever.

?!!!

Things like that should ALREADY be in their tactical plans.

Instead, we heard about larger-ship shortages, a few years back when a plan to build more got interrupted, i.e. what happened to RE-STARTING that,

and now are witnessing of all things, HOPE-driven gambles with prescious guardian tech, from (mostly?)men who should know better.

It's the equivalent of a museum director, getting all their rembrant and picasso and michaelangelo and whoever else's original paintings, putting them all in a pile on the roof of the museum, just-in-case it might attract a flying-machine brilliant michaelangelo flying-machine VIA the air, or something equally-as-ludicrous - it rains... oh, we should've thought that might happen, what a disaster - there is CLEARLY a risk in having guardian tech/relics collected ANYwhere, when we already know that thargoids are attracted to emissions they can detect / have structures within them thargoids scanning tech can spot easily. The ONLY safe way to ensure we can protect what we can salvage from the guardians, is to keep it SPLIT into many multiple smaller caches, presumably also buried deep underground so that tharg's scans can't find them - instead, we're treating them like some kind of DISPOSABLES?

Set aside your desire for a big-bang for a moment, if one is so naive enough to even believe in the the big-bang ... set-aside, ALSO, your common everyday big-bangS plural, and try to imagine what thargoid / xeno-archaeologists must be thinking everytime guardian tech is RISKed like this - they've not just seen one small museum go up in flames,.. they've seen a human-galaxy-wide immense, immesurable bonfire of them go up in flames, quite possibly estimating how much in % terms of remaining guardian tech there might be out there,.. and how much in % terms, we've just thrown away, on pipe-dreams desired to also-validate the mistakes/culpability of the past illegal/immoral projects the superpowers / 'The club' were a part of.

Oh-great, there goes another 5% of all guardian relics to find, if one day we needed a single item from all that was just lost, to decode some new shielding or weapons system to stand a better chance against the thargoids... what we've just witnessed, is in-effect, a 1-in-20 chance that we've just destroyed it ... for-nothing!

I Think i'll give-up archaeology, and take up beekeeping or something, and magic-mushroom myself to-death - why bother, our leadership is so stupid, we're doomed, we might as well not-bother.

Salvation may well be a-mere interloper, somewhat like a un-intelligent insect to one of these ; [https://youtu.be/5CXTZ75tKbU]

( NOT that-that implies that all insects are unintelligent )

At least, this will teach the superpowers a lesson in the QUALITY of the people they listen-to / get-advice-from / depend on, if nothing else.

Our current actions

For easy merits, pick up dissidents with our power contact at Eyharts Enterprise in the 32 c Piscium system and deliver them to Tanner Settlement in Polevnic. It's the fastest way to get the Enforcer Cannon.

Vote for consolidation.

No systems need preparation for this cycle (spreading publicity material).

If you want to help Utopia, pickup dissidents at the systems in the fortification tracker and take them to Tanner Settlement in Polevnic. The priority order is top to bottom and left to right.

News around utopian space

It was a very intense dissident-racing week! Utopians all over the galaxy try to beat each other’s score on the reeducation leaderboards, hauling thousands of dissidents from the control systems to Polevnic for a more peaceful and prosperous Utopia! Still, many unknown utopians participate anonymously, if you’re one of them, join our communications network so we can register your fortification score!

What we call “dissidents” is just what other societies know as "delinquents" or "criminals". Instead of being jailed, enslaved or executed, they are arrested with the utmost discretion, in order to minimize social disruption and protect the privacy of dissidents. This must not be confused with a kidnapping.

Our moral enforcers are responsible for taking them safely to the Sim-Archive facilities, where they are processed for reintegration into utopian society. This processing is done through advanced simulation technology that is used for the purpose of teaching them empathy. The process of re-education is in general mentally exhausting, but leaves no permanent damage. It is not something different to which many of our citizens submit voluntarily, so as not to forget the difficulties that the most unfortunate outside Utopia go through, and what the dissident’s victims went through.

This way, we have the most efficient system of rehabilitation in the galaxy. There is no jail, there is no life imprisonment, there is no death penalty. What other communities spend on inflicting suffering and misery upon their own citizens, we invest in happiness and wellbeing, making them functional members following their own dreams and passions for the glory of Utopia. As Dr. Saeed McNamara once said, "Criminals and dissidents aren't evil – they've just become disconnected from society. We've proved time and again that seeing the world through the eyes of others, through technology, can be a healing experience."

But not everything is perfect and building paradise demands work, we have a famine going on currently in Azalai so food shipments there will be very welcome. There’s only medium pad markets there - mind you - so a Python/Type 6 will be better suited than a bigger ship. We also have reports of civil unrest in 12 Persei and Havanth, with bandits attacking our workers and scientists. Help is needed to put down by more primitive means of bounty hunting those who refuse reeducation by the use of violence.

​

https://preview.redd.it/82mugvzm1xf91.png?width=1920&format=png&auto=webp&s=5700c3274c65acecb32e9fcb785255c153d0d57b

A little one this time, not-to occupy your time, so-close to the attempt by Salvation & Azimuth & their supporters,

"...Show these alien-loving traitors that they are on the wrong side of history."

[https://www.elitedangerous.com/news/galnet/azimuth-condemns-alien-loving-resistance]

One word. Indiscriminate. Or, another,.. Xenophobic.

Hostile-Xeno-reactive, or something,.. that might be confusing but fine, (some meaning lost in doubling over wordage, but gets BACK to BEING-reactive)

but,.. IN-discrimination? "alien-lovers"? i.e. ALL aliens, good OR bad?

Typical. Who was that? someone at Azimuth - their head of strategic operations.

From at least some's POV, non-communicative, hostile aliens, sure. Reasonable/rational.

But "alien-lovers"?

In time, it is INEVITABLE, that we will come across other aliens, who we DO have compatibilities with, and whose social-expectations are more universally-understanding as any civilised should-be,

when that day comes, will HUMAN-Xenophobes, still be influencing our decisions?

They might want to be, but when trade, exchange, cultural blending/head-banging, whatever you might want to call it, becomes possible withOUT any kind of one-must-dominate-the-other bull**** paranoia, you can bet those interested in benefitting from such exchange, will not be towing the Xenophones line, and the money will be on peaceful exchange / accepting-risk.

Change in inevitable - interceding self-neglecting or self-destructive change,.. such as insularisms, and self-delusions when it comes to impossible-concepts, like ethnicity-purity, or species-purity, (both are transient in time/evolution),..

... might by-argument be allowing-risks of outside influences when we don't know the risks of those influences, but the same exists in the macro, as-does in the micro, in terms of possible futures - being the kid in kindergarten, in the corner, sucking his thumb, from fear-of-strangers, is no way to DEVELOP, or MATURE.

SO tentacle-love me up! Alien-girl, with the surprising number of appendages! We primates have been doing something not all that much different, for a lot longer than mere human homo-sapiens 'only-the-latest' self-delusions and tiresomely-perpetual 'internal-self-discoveries', per losing-our-tails not long ago!

It's perhaps at-least unlucky that the first species we've come across, either feared us enough to start attacking us, or, now has practically no-chance of ever forgetting/forgiving our crimes against them, depending on which is the true history.

Contrary to what Rademaker has said here, if it is eventually revealed that we were the aggressors, and tried to steal, exploit, and choose-to-believe convenient-lies, there will be no trust-of-humans going further into the future.

Why-then, should everyone else?

Ideally the version of events claimed by INRA and older interests was true, and the thargs were the aggressors, and our choice of desperate measures the first time around, will seem as rationalisable as the choice of a NON-biological superweapon this time around,

but is it not presumptive to assume that that version of events IS neccessarily, what happened, and that we're not being stringed-along (string of false evidence) into thinking that we're defending ourselves?

defending yourselves in-response to one of your victims defending-THEMselves in previous reaction to you,

is not simply 'defending oneself'.

It's more on par, with some cocky bully gangster from a martial arts film of the 20th/21st century, provoking a fight and then simultaneously trying to act the-injured-party.

See through it, and you can easily see how the superpowers and past-INRA/Azimuth supoorters, could STILL, be-being mis-lead by those with even-more reason to lie than those back-in-the-day, realizing they'd already-not-had the authority to act in paranoid presumptions of need. Some if not all of The Club [https://elite-dangerous.fandom.com/wiki/The_Club] ... could well be implicated if that does turn out to be true, and clearly a different stance / readyiness is needed - the readyiness to be open to a positive result, instead of closed-minded, only-seeing presumptions of grand-plans-against-us, from any aliens we meet.

It might turn out to've been only their presumption that we had similar grand plans against them, that caused the initial conflicts.

Having the maturity to know when-to-stop fighting, WILL NEED to be something we at least learn how to do, even if at the moment, conditionless blanket-generalisations, like "alien-lover" ... get thrown around like it's some colonial wild-west where neither legitimacy of the imperialist, nor equity of crimes against-the-other, existed at first.

The reason, why who-struck-first, MATTERS, in the macro, as well as the micro, is because of larger-identities or political-identities risk - as in ... that exists COMMONLY, in both human and alien civilisations, no-doubt.

Perhaps not in thargoids, but somewhere. The arguable risk that the thargoids accept in having too hive-minded or too-heavily-concentrated a leadership/command structure, might be a valid criticism of risk, but that does NOT make them the aggressor by-default - if we were trespassing hundreds of years ago, who's to say that HUMAN INCURSION, was not simply being-responded-to?

When one comes across someone else's hut in the forest/jungle, one cannot just mindlessly wander into someone else's territory, and not-expect a response, like some starving child, 'reasonably' expecting to be taken care of by an adult, or a frat-boy casual kitchen-fridge opener, 'reasonably' expecting that no-one cares who's-stuff-is-whose.

A chain of denial, will NOT vindicate us - it will incriminate, and condemn us, as IM-mature, or yet-ready to socialize, in kindergarten terms.

We've moved on from sucking our own thumb, into stealing from other kids backpacks and lunchboxes, and are not having to be chased down by the teachers before being spanked.

I for one, would prefer a-spanking-of-my-own-choosing if you don't mind, INRA/Azimuth / supporters-of.

Change is inevitable, so should having to MATURE the **** up.

By the time that becomes, at a dinner party,.. well, sorry INRA/Azimuth / supporters-of, but i'm off to a private-do, with others who'd also prefer spankings-of-their-own-choosing with social aliens,.. the whole scene, does not get somehow 'lead', by the anti-social in the room causing a problem - by contrast, the party breaks up, and the police have to be called, and Johnny has to spend another night or two in lockup, while the spanktards, self-gratifying as their might be, at least get-some.

Equivalently, might Johnny in lockup, then prefer the company of his cell mates? Well, that explains a thing or two.

Our current actions​

For easy merits, pick up dissidents with our power contact at Eyharts Enterprise in the 32 c Piscium system and deliver them to Tanner Settlement in Polevnic. It's the fastest way to get the Enforcer Cannon.

Vote for consolidation. This is very important!

No systems need preparation for this cycle (spreading publicity material).

If you want to help Utopia, pickup dissidents at the systems in the fortification tracker and take them to Tanner Settlement in Polevnic. The priority order is top to bottom and left to right.

If you want to get in touch, please join our communications network: Discord channel. Some reports are classified and only delivered to registered Utopians.

News around utopian space​

Our expedition to gather materials was a success! We saw many beautiful places while farming crystal trees out in the black. It was very relaxing after such busy weeks.

We had a weaponized 5C expansion from Li Yong-Rui last week, the expansion was very bad for both powers and with the hard work of the powerplay community as a whole we were able to put LYR into turmoil. Unfortunately, that was the only way to avoid that expansion.

Currently, even in turmoil, Sirius C.E.O. is expanding to Chnemine. We got in touch with their community and they do not want this expansion. We therefore ask for players (specially from other powers) out there that need some merits to oppose this expansion to help out everyone's ever-neutral neighbor, and for the benefit of powerplay in general. If you have any doubts about this operation, it’s better to join their discord and ask them yourself. I also ask FDev to please fix powerplay (at least avoid 5C from happening).

We’re enjoying our freedom and watching carefully the happenings around Salvation and the superweapon being built at HIP 22460.

https://preview.redd.it/x0eqavwjvzc91.png?width=1920&format=png&auto=webp&s=079f86d4493e272e2c8e9cce2ad09f89e7a016be

View from Ada-Rhodes Research, new fleet carrier of the Utopian Workers Party, at Utopia's service.

This ; [https://www.elitedangerous.com/news/galnet/federation-targets-narcotics-syndicate]

is why Utopia has drawn the line in the sand, when it comes to surpassing our past, and learning-to-discard the supposedly beneficial 'balance' between illicit-tolerances and degrees-of-prosecution, which for as long as the rationalisation has existed in humanity, has been a constant source of corruption, hypocrisy, distrust, and self-destruction - we see this temporary action, could applaud it if we wished to,..

... but then afterwards,.. after the end of this one, know,..

...that the federation will go strrraight-back, to business-as-usual with their pact with Kumo and behind-the-scenes unneccessary hostility even towards neutrals that had the past gone differently, could've been it's allies against the mass-slavery of the empire.

How can each well-intended federation commander, look themselves in the mirror each day, and while-KNOWing that this supposed balance is supposed to still-work, that by it's very nature, is a DELIBERATE under-policing, DELIBERATE only-for-appearances way to make law while simulteneously pretending as though you respect the decisions of your fellow citizens when their actions risk other members of their community,

that that-'freedom' ... to-take-risks , is actually against the INITIAL premise, of a responsible-citizen, and the premise, that democracy does ANYthing, to ensure that citizens will actually BE, that,.. actually DO, what the ideal one would,.. is nothing but a fantasy without any mechanism nor contingency, to ever add-to a government's ability to prevent what wide-scale lack-of or breakdown-of CONTROL, over one's impulses, causes,.. while the supposed ethics of freedom are still spoken of ever-without the full picture which includes the neglect towards members of one's community, in not having enough PARALLEL checking when it comes to addiction.

Utopia has-no, nor would claim,.. exclusivity, in what-could prevent addiction from becoming AVOIDED as it does in such freedom,.. implants, neurological therapy, whatever,..

... but... it is AMONGST those who aim to create something better, and with good reason - each time HONEST federation citizens and commanders look themselves in the eye in the mirror and KNOW, to at least try to understand the choices-of-others, when it comes to not-accepting the lies-about absolute-freedom, or things similar to it - they are an example of WHY those able to gain perspective on how to do better than democracy, have, and continue to try to make something better, do-better, for prevention, rather than pretending as though one can rely on false-hope.

We should be patient, with such - demanding understanding, is not our way, but being as-entitled to open, admissive, debate, rather than equally-as-in-denial state-secrets 'competitive' , is something we CAN, demand, both by social-reality reasoning, AND, by knowing that sacrificing a little, one's society can gain so much more, by not succumbing to the idea that sacrificing ANY, freedom/s , neccessarily means worst-case-scenario chain-reactions, or sequential-abuses of power from more centralisation of it, or other differences that supposedly 'make-all-the-difference' (between democracies and other forms of governement) - there has NEVER been any 'perfect' democracies, since they simply cannot exist, since all peoples are different, and what is important to one, is worthless to another. The illusion of consistency or homogeny in democracy, is itself, another pitfall to avoid if one truly wants it COMBINED, with other things - hence why systems that are ALREADY PRODUCTS of exactly-that, precisly-that, combinations of it, acknowledge, and try to deal with the reality, that some are better than others AT PARTICULAR THINGS - and so you will get more wise and expert decision making, by giving those with more of a reason to know something better than the average person, MORE-say, if not also exclusivity. Whether or not a society goes 100% in that sense, in-also choosing exclusivity or not, is something Utopia would not force either way, since inflexibility and stagnation in politics is also a dangerous thing,.. but,.. to pretend as though all men are born equal when it comes to specialised functioning, always-was and still-remains, utter vanity inamongst wishful-thinking, which were it ever to come about through eugenics or something, would ironically no longer be something needing to be remembered - the irony of an abscence of something THOUGHT-an ideal, sometimes contrasts when it's important to accept LESS-than an ideal, else lose the perspective needed-to-value the thing desired - like 'chasing perfection' - i.e. the desire fades / dwindles.

Because however, that can also be argued to elicit the need to force those maintaining the supposed morality of putting up on a pedestal a future-to-never-actually-reach while also MIS-USING the supposed value of that (non-existent) attaining as-a-justification FOR SOMETHING ELSE,..

... humanity has erred, in relation to not only democracy, but it as well as other things never thought-through well enough in the first place. It's as-though democacy was always a MEANS, not an-aim-unto-itself.

What 'something else' (s) ... are we asked to accept, as a result of things like the pact with the Kumos?

slavery? hmm... they do-do, a lot of that.

where's the consistency guys?

Utopia's NOT the empire. Remember that next time you're pretending, that all non-democratic systems are 'all-the-same'.

Yet-while you simultaneosuly rationalise-away your integrity for the sake 'temporary measures' like thinking !!

If establishing prioritisation had become the order-of-the-day decades ago, when finding allies against the slavery of both the empire,.. AND Kumos,.. had not been so staunchly thought-irrellivent, thought not-needed as though BOTH could be defeated without needing friends,..

... then why is human-space still the way it is? with the empire still around, Kumos still left un-surpassed/denied, and even the Alliance, not worked in partnership-with more closely, UNTIL both the empire and Kumos are dealt-with once and for all?

Change. That's why. Reluctance to change, that makes 'the inflexible' break, and 'the careless', forever incomplete.

Utopia is to FORCE, the incomplete, to face what they avoid,

and repair after-having-broken, the inflexible, so that they become-something they thought they could not.

how long that might take, is anyone's guess, but without significant diplomatic and legal gestures and consequences of aggression agreed-to , and rogue federation pilots working-with-Kumos chased down and dealt with, detainted, condemned and barred from influence within the federation, many will see them as little-better if not no-better, than any other power, that also accepts-less, also-accepts indiscriminant-freedom X capitalist-greed , or empire's conveniences-of claimed responsibility - while feudals and theocracies remain small, and-LOCAL, and only tolerated in Utopia while abiding by their own obligations TO-do, better, democracy's middle-ground of negelct, will also never get any better.

Both must keep being denied, until something better, replaces them all.

All those that suffer under the comings & goings under the hypocrisy of the federation AND/OR empire, & neglect of other careless, 'moderate' powers, are something that we can proudly say we never see the same of, under OUR protection, at least at that SCALE of failure. Small emergences-come &-go, but temporary hedonists, sadists, and less-purposeful types WANE,.. while the desire to create something better, grows - keeps attracting MORE, rather than the disdain-of-the-pointless, inevitably doing what it does, especially to the delusional in their ambitions - seemingly endless, are the number of tiny especially anarchist PMFs, that have come & gone inside Utopian space, that had grand plans for dominating the universe, and similar bollocks.

If there's anything other powers should honestly-recognise within us as-neighbours, it's that we don't-acccept-any-truck with that kind of pointlessness, while more deliberated,.. with-a-point,.. politics, is by comparison, welcomed and even encouraged.

While it's dissapointing to see so many well-intending Imp.s waste their time with the large-scale, local-protectionist mandates abandoned,.. and imperial loyalty GAMBLED UPON, in a not totally dissimilar sense the the federation gambles on would-be(s) of unity-in-democracy ,

it's MORE than merely dissapointing, to keep seeing that obsessive inflexibility from those we have more in common with, when it comes to the INtolerability of slavery.

This purge of the Red Family, is a rare example to be applauded ,

but it's amongst a systematically utterly-rotten, wealth-disparatively-encouregant cancer of hypocrisy amongst humanity, that SHOULD be able to be CHANGING, per the continuation of the Inheritance Wars' END. perpetual bleeding of feudals by the hudsons, cannot continue forever.

What replaces it, and what will BECOME of the hudsons, is yet to be seen, but what they WERE, at this time, will not be so-easily forgotten, when WERE-they?.. of supposedly ideal governance,.. things like this purge of the Red Family, would never've been NEEDED in the first place - the Federation could've made ALLIES, however temporarily, with other powers also opposed to slavery and INdiscriminant-freedom, and perhaps collectively realized, that they are NOT as absolute about freedom, as they THINK they are. The 'honest' freedom lovers in Kumo space, only get their minor acknowledgement in-amongst everything else that can forever be heaped-upon them irregardless of the drop-of-honesty amongst their pool-of-blood-&-tears. Advocating freedom INdiscrimnately, while THAT CLOSE to Kumos, cannot be ignored, when all of humanity, can see what the PRODUCT of indicriminant freedom, creates right next door. To simplify, going FURTHER-AWAY, from absolute in Kumos, is to further recognise that one CAN risk a little more,.. were one then still reluctant to give it up if assuming it's not worth the trade-off.

That, 'trade-off' , benefits citizens under Kumo rule, does it?

Our border, against that-insanity, remains as denying of the careless, as does our political refusal, to-PRETEND, as though democracy is good-enough when we know it isn't,.. but it is not easy, to be asked to accept that something that usually only grows when profiteering and heedless population irresponsibilities, put people at RISK, and knowing that most cannot or will not look back to the past, for explinations of the present, to that extent,.. comparable with in history, good SOCIAL PLANNING, if not also social-oversight/moderation being insisted upon by the state.

It's not EASY, to be fair, to ask someone who thinks that anything-LESS, than-total, freedom, becomes a betrayal of what one wanted-in-combination-WITH freedoms, that people are more flexible in that basic concept, than they think, but it IS easy, by comparison, to point out that what was MEANT to be a progressive REPLACEMENT, in the Inheritance wars, cannot remain in LIMBO, or somehow SUSPENDED in time or something, with no end in sight, while ironically, as we know, hudsons INSTALL feudals, just to be able to exploit them.

At times, they putin more feudals, than the Imp.s do.

Which is the worst imperialist?

Without wanting to guess-too-much about Salvation's gambit here, we're at a potentially crucial/critical time here ;

==============

1 To choose between the presumably-only-temporary cooperation with Salvation, & risking of false-legitimisation of Azimuth,

===

2

Or to thwart it, cross our fingers and hope that we can develop means-for-defence on our own as Tesreau suggests,

Risking any change in thargs speed-of-development & adjustment to our tech,

(which by comparison, any widescale crippling of tharg fleets, bases, and motherships, might prevent or at least delay in-the-immediate ( in our scale of time ( it's been suggested that their slow rate of change suggests that they might perceive time more slowly or especially when 'hive-mind-thinking' (verb-noun), unlike individual tharg pilots when designated to fight in real-time) i.e. for us, if we're arguably faster at development and innocation including in both defence & attack, that Salvo's attempt at-least might slow them even-further, giving our inferior numbers more TIME, to react to incursions in smaller number, presuming they then could not attack frequently or as-frequently as they have been))

===

Whether or not as he's claimed, he'll be able to,.. "...eradicate the alien threat not just from the system, but from the entire galaxy."

...might be enough, for some pilots to decide to go with that attempt, for a variety of beliefs ; (these are the main beliefs i've come across) (most Cmdrs hostile-towards thargoids fit into 1 or 2 )

1 The-belief that they were always hostile, and humanity is innocent-initially.

2 The-belief that regardless of whether or not SOME humans were aggressive initially or not, they're hostile IN-discriminately against us and so can't be made-peace-with ... when mistaking us as creatures of centralised(supported)leadership and so 'all-guilty' of any initial aggression and the development of the biogenic fungus, when in fact we're not - we're DIS-united as a species, and so ethically/morally deserving of being dealt with on a case-by-case basis (that does not neccessarily counter an argument BY thargoids (or any other species we might encounter) that we are dangerous / hazardous / intolerable , their OWN arguments for that would remain-valid by-their-measure, but it does mitigate-down WHICH-humans, should be targeted in response to at-least the biogenic weapon if-not-also any initial aggression by humans ( if it was us that started the whole thing - for all we know, Azimuth might've been acting on greed, not fear/aggression of the thargoids, or, worse, one of the powers being after an edge-against the others. This could now be already-extended (in their minds) to all-humans in a position of being able to hunt-down and prosecurte INRA and those risking making and using such a weapon - ie. we've HAD TIME, to punish our own))

3 The-belief that they're clearly hostile NOW, as-a-result of our aggression and opportunism, but like in n.2 , aren't differentiating between WHICH humans to target, ( and/or have had to stumble their way through our (unfamiliar) social systems, languages, organisations, whatever,.. even-if having tried / still-trying,.. and that-that has been problematic for them even-if only a secondary consideration, whereas at the same time, their overall-diplomatic situation has-ahd-to remain hostile at-least tactically, and while they don't DECALRE their intentions, we're unable to know-clearly who amongst-us are being (then-legitimately) targeted, even-IF they have been discriminate, i.e. you need to COMBINE proper DIScriminate-hostilities WITH at least minimal-diplomacy, for the other party to be able to respond to your needs. If the thargs have never done that, then HOW could we ever-agree on who they want-punished for the crimes against them? ( i.e. diplomacy will fail, even if 'offerings' were given if we tried to work out WHO to punish, to've appeased them (INRA & Co. would've been a good start ))

4 The-belief that the Oresrians & Klaxians split, has indirectly caused several things which complicate our position, but, if-instead of CIRCUMVENTING us, in pursuit of the faction fleeing, the pursuing faction has decided to attack us as-well, or, if the fleeing has attacked us in-order to make us THINK that the pursuers have, either way, we've got a hostile faction to-react-to. ( this belief obviusly, would not neccessarily-neccessitate hostility towards BOTH, if diplomacy was possible with the other, but if that's the case, then why haven't EITHER established communications with humans? (the few that i've spoken to beliving this, assume the fleeing faction is DISSMISSIVE, essentially, of our fate - is inconsiderate/callous about "trying to use as as a sheild", etc))

...

===

...but,

... Should any beliefs amongst these, be-ENOUGH, to justify anything on the scale of the first INRA biogenic weapon?

This wave Salvation's describing, arguably sounds like a machinery-/ships/installations/tech targeting device, and not-neccessarily a LIFE-targeting one, so depending on what it does, the ethics of it will vary,..

===

... And why-the-shift from defensive-repulsion, into galaxy-wide aggressive crippilng?

Surely after this, there will be no-doubt in THEIR minds, as to whether or not humans are hostile as-well-as-dangerous, at least some of us, anyway.

What chance will there ever be-able-to be, for understanding between NON-involved, NON-already-guilty human parties, and whichever-thargs might one day care, (hypothetically) about the difference-between those who are, and those who are not?

If that kind of consideration is a PART of Aegis's reasons-for-reluctances to cooperate with Salvation, then i suppose there is probably a small degree of appreciation deserved for whomever amongst Aegis considered that worth taking into consideration as a FUTURE chance to-leave-room for, but trying to convince those fearing the thargoids in-discriminately, un-differentiatingly,.. (seeing them as all-the-same ) ... while they've been on the backfoot against the thargoids for so long, was obviously always going to be a difficult task for anyone who tried.

It seems a shame to me, that the difference between DEFENCE, and offense, is not being highlighted at the moment, in terms of the ethical/political conseqences of the superpowers un-mistakingly kill-or-be-killed intent - put simply, what-IF that's not the case? What if we do NOT know, that their intent is as-absolute as we think it must have to be? we know that they and the guardians fought over territory, the Ram Tah discoveries showed that, but does that neccessarily-equate to the same approach towards us?

One very good reason why it might-not, is that the guardians had become complacent/placid when protected by their sentient AI, while we by comparison, remain more in-control of it, and able to change it, without the blurring of the lines when it comes to which parts of guardian civ were the guardians themselves, and which were the sentient-creations then evolved themselves, into new life?... and our ability TO change it,.. utilise it,.. maintaining a DISTANCE from what does our life INCLUDE,.. comapred to that blurring of the lines,.. means we hesitate less, to create dangerous technology, when seeing technology as more of a tool, or means-to-an-end - make no mistake, the thargs after this will have no doubt about whether or not we're more machiavellian / underhand, than the guardians, and that means LESS likely to want to even consider peaceful boundaries, territories, etc.

Some of the superpowers have also shown no-respect for territorial claims BY the thargoids, in a similar sense of thinking it not worth considering, while they might still be assessing us in terms of wondering if we could abide by a treaty.

Whatever happens, it's a much greater shame that neither side has emphasised giving it a TRY, compared to presumably, thinking about what the other side is-thinking, such as with territorial breaches, if for example, the thargs ASSUMED, we would understand what their barnacles MEANT, in terms of social-norms - i.e. humans-know, that we-know, that they would have to leave our stuff alone, for us to not take it as hostile ... oh they haven't respected it,.. we're not going to have any truck with a premise that they didn't KNOW what barnacles meant in terms of claims, WERE we to respect each others'.

Finding common ground, MEANS expecting such reasonable expecatations of another intelligent power, and changing one's behaviour accordingly. We've arguably not even TRIED that. The equivalent for drawing a line in the sand,.. means MEANS-of-communication first,.. and UNTIL that's established, common needs are commonly understood, at least. (a lion pride moves into a baboon field, acting as though they're not SEEing them, while smelling them, but knowing the VISIBILITY of them will not be enough for the baboons to know-definitively that they've been smelt - weeks later, a surprise attack on the lions in the night, is then whinged / roared-about for weeks after they're chased out of baboon territory, as-THOUGH, it was a surprise - the cats have a false drama-queen about not-SEEing them - while the difference between seeing and smelling, was seen-through - to some extent LIKE that, we did not have-to've-had, formal communications, to have at-least shown respect for their territory and PROPERTY - being disunited / stubbornly-individualist has betrayed our collective-fate from even so far-back as the start of our interactions - perhaps humanity's reluctances to form something of a kind of hive-mind, parallel to our own, will be our downfall, if other species with BOTH (if thargs are arguably TOO-hive minded - TOO-centralised, withOUT significant individualism) , demand better than ONLY-one-or-ONLY-the-other , and do a better job of punishing us for it, until we recognise it,

individual Admiral Tanners,

individual INRA directors acting without our approval/authority ... WHAT are we? )

.

.

.

============

Personally, i'm within one of those 4 arguments above,

but i'm also, still inclined to not-trust something this extreme, when we still don't know enough about their potential INTERNAL positions towards us, social-reluctances/philosophy, whatever else, that might CONFIRM the doomsaying in relation to them ,

If Tesreau was wrong about not-using Salvation,

but would be right,

about being able to DEFEND without unneccesary aggression, as-would other leaders including ex- or current Aegis,

then perhaps that's a more cautionary / 2nd-chance approach for peace, if we can keep chasing them off with Salvation's disruptors, and keep adapting them or make something new, if they try to go-hostile again after becoming resistant/immune to it's effects - i.e. although they might develop such immunity sooner than you might imagine, when/if we-would-REMAIN MORE ABLE to develop another weapon, or other defences,

then why is the panic button being-pressed NOW?

Sometimes it takes a few successful blocks on your sheild, or chasing off of their raiding parties, before your enemy can learn to respect(or fear) you , BEFORE diplomacy is tried as-then-thought neccessary

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ObhH_hAKou0]

By rushing into this, we're not letting that neccessary TIME, take-place, even though we SHOULD be able to feel confident, about them fearing our bio-manipulation or technological-innovation potentials - if your enemy already fears some of what you can do,.. and knows that you can MAKE MORE of it,.. then you should be confident WITH the fear you can create, and at a minimum, try to subdue them back to the diplomacy table, if they would not expect that you would be willing to give it another try.

This Proteus wave prospect, seems like nothing but another absolutism, withOUT any other pathway OUT, of whatever remnants of thargoids might remain in our galaxy ending up with nothing but bitterness & hate towards us, in whatever scattered remnants might then evolve in ways we don't expect - underground, for instance. If hundreds of years later, they develop some biogenic weapon and unleash it when we've relaxed, what's to stop them from claiming that we've a PATTERN-of behavioural-extremes?

They wouldn't be wrong. This one despite not targeting their life, will still cause huge amounts of stranded-in-space deaths, many queens? killed, affect their politics, etc... are we even sure WHICH FACTION of the Oresrians and Klaxians, it's centered-on?

I would not be surprised at all, if it's a massive-flop, only cripples some of one of the two, the remaining underground aren't as badly affected as Salvation wants,.. and come back with even-more reason to see humans as a threat, ( And where's the declarations about-WHICH? this wave is more likely to affect? ) & angers/scares them more permanently, if-not-also causing the other to fear us if they don't already, and potentially cause them to UNITE against us, to set-aside their dispute until we're defeated!

If it works, the scattered ones we find, i'm sure, we'll pity, but neither will we have, 1 a guarantee that they won't be able to develop another bioweapon of their own and (further ones might be better designed) , 2 any idea how many in reserves they might have ELSEWHERE - like if they're from another galaxy, or a parallel dimension, etc.

There's also no guarantee that Salvation would make any more reliable ones either, especially if after premature declarations of victory/defeat-of-the-thargoids,.. he's dragged kicking and screaming with the rest of Azimuth into custody to face all the charges we won't be able to ignore. Some would want to chase-down the survivors before they could develop anything that might threaten us, but if he's locked up, and Azimuth made-transparent and shut down for good this time, he nor Azimuth, will be-there, to be able to get access to whatever early information we might ever get in early-warning, if ever getting any at all - they'd be have to be dragged out of their cells, and be asked to do something they might not be so keen-to, after being locked up for decades. We're gambling a lot on this, and if it fails, what was a hidden conspiracy with INRA, will not be so hidden / limited-to-conspirators, this time around - all three superpowers will be able to be addressed BY surviving thargoids, should diplomacy ever develop - if this is the catalyst to getting to that point, then it might be seen as the best chance we've had, since biogenic weapons are NEVER tolerateable, and obviously INRA knew that,.. but there will still be TRUST ISSUES, after any peace/amnesty is established.

Perhaps a series of thargoid embassies might one day keep-the-superpowers-honest, but considering how some within them have conspired to create INRA in the first place, and now are more-wholly and openly backing Salvation regardless-of-how-extreme his plans, the same finger-pointing to conspirators, will not be possible. It will not only be the smaller powers that will develop concern over how decisions are being made supposedly always 'on-our-behalf'.

Tanner's tech-grab clearly wasn't.

Our current actions

For easy merits, pick up dissidents with our power contact at Eyharts Enterprise in the 32 c Piscium system and deliver them to Tanner Settlement in Polevnic. It's the fastest way to get the Enforcer Cannon.

Vote for consolidation! It's easy to do, and very important for us.

No systems need preparation for this cycle (spreading publicity material). Get into our Discord (link below) if you want to discuss about this.

If you want to help Utopia, pickup dissidents at the systems in the fortification tracker and take them to Tanner Settlement in Polevnic for their enlightenment. The priority order is top to bottom and left to right.

If you want to get in touch, please join our communications network via: Discord channel. Some reports are classified and only delivered to registered Utopians.

News around utopian space​

After a month of intense work and planning we're happy to announce that there is a new commune in the GCRV 2743 system! We initially aimed for Nurundere, but found overwhelming resistance from federal-backed local forces. We have since then chosen to retreat to GCRV 2743. This system actually had been part of the Utopian Commune before. Besides the rising slavery and drug dealing, many ex-utopians embraced us in memory of better days. Today Utopia welcomes back the citizens of GCRV 2743 and vicinity!

In light of recent galactic events, we now focus on preparing and protecting our now more than 200 billion citizens and the people around the Marlinist colonies for what's coming next. With desperate superpowers backing Salvation's provocation of the Thargoid race and unethical testing of dangerous weapons of mass destruction, humanity is at a delicate point in its history. We're going on an expedition to gather materials for engineering of our ships so we can protect our people and our cause for a better future. It’s open to anyone from any power or faction, if you are interested in joining, check our communications channel above.

News from outside Utopia

In other news, the conflict between ZYADA and the FUC (Federal United Command) is still very active. The federal powers failed their expansions, Zachary Hudson expansion was prevented, and Felicia Winters' three expansions also failed (they didn't receive much federal support though). On the other side, Zemina Torval lost the weaponized - against Hudson - expansion attempt to Pollux. Grom for his part, managed to conquer Muncheim after a huge merit snipe.

Nurundere was successfully prepared for expansion by the president Zachary Hudson, again, in what looked like it was going to be a preparation-race for the system against Yuri Grom.

This week, Senator Torval is attempting another weaponized expansion against Hudson in the system LHS 184. Meanwhile, the federal powers try to expand to 4 systems: Hudson to Nurundere and Winters to HR 4130, Dongkum and Hou Yangk.

Our diplomacy: Utopia remains as a neutral power in this conflict between the superpowers.

Picture of the planet GCRV 2743 A 5. New headquarters of our utopian commune for the system GCRV 2743.

Our current actions

A lot is going on with PowerPlay right now. If you want to get in touch and help us organize please join our communications network: Discord channel. Some reports like these are classified and will only be delivered to registered Utopians.

Vote for consolidation! It's fast, easy and very important to do so.

No systems need preparation for this cycle (spreading publicity material).

For easy merits, pick up dissidents with our power contact at Smith City (go to "Contacts" in the station services) in the Bletani system and deliver them to Tanner Settlement in Polevnic. This is the fastest way to get the Enforcer Cannon.

If you want to help Utopia, pickup dissidents at any of the grayed systems in the fortification tracker and take them to Tanner Settlement in Polevnic. The priority order is top to bottom and left to right.

Combat pilots can help us with the expansion to Nurundere. Expect fierce opposition from angry slavers and smugglers. Crush them. See more below.

News around utopian space

We are seeking to open a new commune in Nurundere to offer the truth of Utopia in the region. Instead of soldiers, fighters, and pilots, we will bring what people need: better standards of living, dignity, healthcare, and the end of brutal slavery and oppression. Our objective is to protect the weakest and realign the wicked, to construct the perfect society and bring peace and harmony. Our abundance was - after all - created for everyone.

​

https://preview.redd.it/z9q4xm4z57391.jpg?width=1920&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a59c15965eb6d3c38f3a4ea6fa3d41fe9f7318a7

Please feel free to-add-to this quick reminder,

but upon reading the latest Galnet article about Alba Tesreau's concerns-of-potentials with Salvation, it's quite irresponsible in practical terms, to ;

"... I urge the superpowers to halt their collaboration with Salvation ..."

[https://www.elitedangerous.com/news/galnet/new-discovery-links-azimuth-inra]

​

I couldn't help but notice the similarity with what closER supporters/creators of Aegis were saying back when the technology-steal attempt by Tanner was sold-to-the-public as for-humanity, with the Federation seeming to be acting like some kind of galatic policing agency, Tanner not even speaking-FOR it, so while he was arguably mis-representing it, we were left with another reminder of why to scrutinise-WHEN the federation claims to be doing something supposedly in everone's interests,

This time, notice the proximity in-reading, of the 4th-last, 3rd-last, and 2nd-last paragraphs, before the conclusion-like abrupt ending of the article - no postulations that Salvation might be someone who LEFT INRA because of disagreements, or an ethical-split with them, no possibilty left-open there, in the article, that while we should keep distrusting INRA, that this person might be different by comparison ;

​

“...I urge the superpowers to halt their collaboration with Salvation while this new data is verified. "

"...INRA’s activities have since been denounced by the superpowers as illegal and unethical. "

"...Aegis has warned ..."

​

in other words perhaps?,..

trust-us ... we're still the ones to be trusted ... here's some conjecture about someone who COULD be something we'd like you to fear,..

( so we can go-BACK to the hunt him down & steal-his-stuff proposition? )

​

----

​

WHILE ;

THIS, is what was discovered about the superweapon - basically a massive DISRUPTOR ;

radiation, yes, but biogenic spread/mutation risks?

​

NO.

​

[https://community.elitedangerous.com/galnet/uid/61bc639f33cc6e11ad79652d]

​

---

​

So back to the title of this post,

"...what are we really talking about, with Salvation?"

​

---

​

Well... NOT, a genocidal biological weapon, that is and was illegal at the time of the 1st Thargoid conflict, that's for sure!

Instead of pointing out the DIFFERENCES between INRA, and Salvation,

Tesreau, is just grossly-associating by-proximity in the article - the words, the sentences, being literally-close-together,.. that Salvation could mean more of the same, re INRA.

​

is-it-not?.. already likely, that someone who has done the OPPOSITE

of INRA's decision to-not spend the time

on something more technologically-responsbile,

​

...an INDICATOR?,..

...that Salvation is different?

​

or perhaps , is at-least reformed / regretful?

( i.e. any prosecution of his participation can-wait? or maybe a kind of amnesty could be offered, so he can keep doing his work WHILE being monitored by independent observers?)

​

Oh-no,..

none of anything like-that,..

just, total-fear-knee-jerk.

thanks-a-lot Galnet / Tesreau ,

​

... just smear him before you even know anything of any past-mistakes,

and go straight to a prejudist warning/urging,..

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...BEFORE knowing if there's even anything to worry about.

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---

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nono, just pay no heed,

to the STILL-IMMANENT risks of Thargoid attacks,

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when-finally, we have a relatively-clean / without-risk by-comparison, technology, that could probably already be being mass-produced, & improoved-upon!

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Has Tesreau been living in a cave?

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And one even potentially capable of modifications-in-anticipations of Thargoids developing / re-developing/designing their vessels, presumably through genetic modification -

these disruptors could possibly/probably? be-being developed , as-they(thargs) develop - to try to anticipate how the Thargs might change, and then already-be trying to counter it!

That's a real, successful, balancing of our chances,

When it was not long ago, that some were predicting humanity's collapse and scattering throughout the galaxy, if-not-also potential eradication BY the thargoids.

These disruptors may well be the first signs that we CAN give ourselves a fighting chance.

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What did we get from the Federation-core INRA by-comparison?

a CHEATING-chance,

dishonourable one, not-a-'fighting' chance,

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that has marked humanity irretractably forevermore,

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when they NEVER spoke-for-all,

NEVER-had the authority, the approval, to do so 'for humanity'.

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Accepting / poliferating fear-knee-jerk reactions to what may well UN-officially one of the last remaining perhaps-respectable exiles, or schism-departed ex-members, of INRA, if it does turn out to be true,..

... AS ... the same , as-other INRA,..

​

would be the height of stupidity, shooting ourselves in the foot,

considering what amounts of effort Pilot's Fed. pilots have-had-to go-to,

and just-how-desperate even the superpowers are, considering what they had to DEPEND-on.

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Utopia would of course want any ex-INRA to be investigated,

but it's another thing entirely, to assume-too-much especially quickly like this,

​

and end-up throwing away one of the few things that is giving us any traction against the weight that the Thargs have brought to bear on us!! w.t.f !

Our current actions

No systems need preparation for this cycle (spreading publicity material).For easy merits, pick up dissidents with our power contact at Smith City (go to "Contacts" in the station services) in the Bletani system and deliver them to Tanner Settlement in Polevnic. This is the fastest way to get the Enforcer Cannon.If you want to help Utopia, pickup dissidents at any of the grayed systems in the fortification tracker and take them to Tanner Settlement in Polevnic. The priority order is top to bottom and left to right.Vote for consolidation! It's fast, easy and very important to do so!

News around utopian space

As part of our anti-Thargoid plan for protecting the Marlinist colonies, we're having a little expedition to the Guardian Sites to collect materials and blueprints for guardian modules. We're leaving aboard the Fleet Carrier "A Very Smug Bean", located on our control system Hidar. We'll be leaving Hidar this Saturday (21 May, 3308) at 15:00 UTC so be sure to dock on the carrier before then. We'll stay at the system Vela Dark Region WT-R b4-3, which has a guardian site with module blueprints and is just 107.23 ly away from Vela Dark Region EG-X b1-1 which has guardian weapon blueprints. We will be back on Tuesday 15:00 UTC. Every player is invited to join and players of every level should be able to get the modules, so long you have an SVR equipped (and a fuel scoop if you want the weapons). The carrier is set up to sell some DBXes, Asps and some modules needed for the adventure and will offer fitting and shipyard, as well as repair/refuel. We'll be available on our Discord channel if you need any help or additional information.

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ERRATUM: Vela Dark Region DL-Y d83, moon 5 B is the place to get the modules, Vela Dark Region WT-R b4-3 has a lot of data sites which are a little hard to come by. We will keep the carrier at  Vela Dark Region WT-R b4-3 as initially planned since we're going there anyway.

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Our current actions

Much has happened since our last official report, two very busy weeks and many more to come!

No systems need preparation this cycle (spreading publicity material).

For easy merits, pickup dissidents with our power contact at Smith City (go to "Contacts" in the station services) in the Bletani system and deliver them to Tanner Settlement in Polevnic. This is the fastest way to get the Enforcer Cannon.

If you want to help Utopia, pickup dissidents at any of the grayed systems in the fortification tracker and take them to Tanner Settlement in Polevnic. The priority order is top to bottom and left to right.

Vote for consolidation! It's fast, easy and very important to do so!

For more information or to participate even more please join our Discord channel. We are currently evaluating all kinds of fun things to do for the future of humanity.

News around utopian space

Our expansion to Hidar was a great success! Many thanks to everyone that showed up to help and made this possible, including our newfound friends from the Night Wolves Corporation, The Leftist Gorillas, and The Coven. We're already in touch with pilots from local Dark Wolf Marlinists and many others to provide an immediate reaction in case of a Thargoid incursion.

In other news, the Kumo pirates started expansion at the system COL 285 SECTOR CY-N B21-0. This is a very bold move for a power entering a civil war! We can't let the people from this system and its vicinity fall into slavery and corruption, and for that, we're organizing wings to oppose this expansion. As we said in our last contact, no one should be left behind. Join our communications channel if you want to help!

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Remember to play fair, and always play on open if you're engaged to PowerPlay. Fly safe! o7

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When Marlin Duval vowed to get as far from Earth as possible, it was in the same spirit as Rishi Antal's pilgrimage to create the first Utopian commune and the Sim-Archive: to build a perfect society that would live in harmony. Both seek peace and progress without interference from the superpowers.

Following the recent public speculation of a Thargoid attack on Marlinist space, we Utopians decided to establish a support outpost and commune in the Marlinist-adjacent system Hidar to provide military and humanitarian aid to the Marlinist colonies. Our technology will provide the humanitarian aid to the civilians of the region, our enforcers will stamp out the slave and narcotics trade in neighboring anarchies, and our friends, Marauders Vanguard, will help defend the region against the Thargoids should the threat become real.

The creation of the colonies was a great cause. But contrary to businessmen like Li Yong-Rui, we are not interested in profiting over the Thargoid situation. The super powers only have enough resources to protect themselves. Echoing the past words of Simguru Pranav Antal, "We at Utopia understand their sorrow, their troubles, and we want to help." We are not here to interfere in the autonomy of the Marlinist colonies, but to provide ready support from nearby. We see the Marlinists as equals: brothers and sisters in transcendence. We are a commune, a cooperative, and our project, in the words of SimGuru Antal, is the advancement of our species through innovation and understanding to an inevitable point of peace and prosperity. No one should be left behind. All are invited to come to Utopia and share in the abundance!

To assist the Hidar populace in bringing the truth to the system bureaucrats, pledge to Pranav Antal this week and fight alongside the citizens of Hidar in the protests that inevitably spring up when the status quo resists the will of the people. Turn merits in at Gallavs, Chaimal, or any other Antal control system and join our communication network at https://discord.gg/puv35ek