I'm not asking this in bad faith of course, I'm an efilist too. I'm just curious to know to how our brains differ in contrast with a normie's brain. That being said, i would also appreciate if you commented exactly what you were diagnosed with. Thank you in advance!

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Can you have friends who aren’t efilist? What are your requirements for friends . I hang out with someone who is an efilist and also conforms to the just world fallacy . I only hang out with him because I don’t have much people to hang out with him and I’d help him with things if he helps me but I don’t genuinely care for him because he’s not an efilist

If you'd like to join and come chat, drop a comment or a DM, and I'll add you. I am an efilist and I would like to discuss ideas and make like-minded friends.

Recently I've noticed that another trendy AN/EF argument is that it will eventually become the dominant ideal of human society, due to its efficiency and logic.

Meaning AN/EF will eventually win over the minds of most people.

Do we have any proof to back this argument?

Does the efficiency and logic of extinction make AN/EF universally desirable, eventually?

But how?

I started off from childfree, veganism, to antinatalism, nihilism, absurdism, promortalism and then efilism.

And then I came across non-duality or advaita vedanta, which essentially says reality is an illusion and the self alone exists, thought that was the truth for some 3 years.

Now back to efilism because I realize it was just another narrative of the mind.

Though I pondered upon efilism as a cope for my trauma induced childhood, the claims made with this approach were indeed a valid one and not to be neglected from a rational, factual standpoint.

Yet I tried to find meaning through some pseudoscience nonsense made up by lonely nerds back in the stone age. Lately, I've been studying evolution and though i don't know quantum physics and its laws of reality being a simulation, what I do know is that everything complex and unaware of our being is the result of millions if not billions of years of survival.

We are just monkey but with better reasoning capabilities.

And the way our minds are wired to go with the genetic purposes - survive and procreate, I don't see it turning into an all-favouring lifestyle for all fauna in this planet. Now I don't care about animals or plants or anything outside of my well-being, what I do am concerned about is how such a stupid, non-emphatetic morons get to rule the planet.

They contribute nothing and vast majority of them exist just for the sake of it - a very useless form of carbon is what they are. Better dead than alive.

I have, in my prior lurking here, seen a great many people declare themselves to be at once extinctionists and determinists.

This strikes me as logically inconsistent.

If things are the only way the can be, have been the only way they could have been, will be the only way they can become, this would include life, people, and suffering.

Each conscious mind both had to come into being, and had to experience the suffering it did. All suffering is rendered inevitable and unstoppable.

To be an efilist while being a determinist is akin to protesting suffering while in Hell.

That's about it. Yeah there are plenty of bad moments. Yeah there are plenty of bad days, days where nothing cheers me up. Days when I cant find a reason why I should finish the day.

But, when good happens, I feel happy. When I spend hours drawing and a piece comes out that makes me so proud that no one else but me can make it, that makes me happy. When I watch a good series that touches me in my heart, that makes me happy. When I go on stage for play productions and through my performance have the audience have an amazing time and to have them tell me I did an amazing job, that makes me happy. To spend time with people who I can feel open and alive with, that makes me happy.

When I started actively looking to make myself happy, instead of waiting for the happy to get to me, my life became so much better.

Not sure why I'm saying this, maybe to convince myself, but, I'm happy to live. I'm happy to dream, Im happy to create and make art that only one person in the world could create, I'm happy to spend time around people that make me smile and feel alive.

I'm happy to wake up the next day. That's about it. I don't get efilism, I don't get wanting to end life, I don't get always looking at the negatives and to never enjoy the positives in life. I don't get it when something bad happens the reaction is "life is all suffering" instead of "something bad happened", and I don't get it when something good happens people here don't even perceive that instead of enjoying the moment.

All living beings come into existence without a choice, because before existence it is impossible for any choice to be made, as there is no existing being capable of making a choice. All sentient beings are created without a choice, and they will inevitably experience suffering to a greater or lesser degree, and they will inevitably die.

Sentient life developed the capacity for suffering as a result of evolution by natural selection. Organisms that experience suffering have a better chance of survival because suffering motivates them to avoid danger, protect themselves, heal themselves, and seek what they need to survive.

If life didn’t exist, there would be no suffering, because suffering requires the existence of sentient life. Without life, there would be no wars, no death, no torture, no genocides, no mental illnesses, or any other form of suffering. If humans stopped procreating and allowed humanity to peacefully go extinct, all human suffering would end. The nonexistence of life is the nonexistence of suffering.

The extinction of all life on earth is inevitable, due to the natural life cycle of the sun. The increase in the sun’s luminosity will have a big effect on the earth’s climate. Eventually, the sun will become a red giant and expand, making earth completely inhospitable. Even further in the future, the sun will eventually die, as all stars do, and thus will be completely incapable of supporting any form of life dependent on it.

The extinction of all life in the universe is inevitable, due to the laws of physics. The predicted future Heat Death of the universe, also known as the Big Freeze or the Big Chill, is based on empirical evidence. The predicted Heat Death is based on the second law of thermodynamics and the continual expansion of the universe, which lead to the outcome of a universe where all matter and energy is evenly distributed so no more work can be performed, and the temperature of the universe will be just above absolute zero. Other theories add unnecessary complexity that is not supported by any empirical evidence, and thus the Heat Death scenario is the most widely accepted prediction of the fate of the universe by scientists.

The existence of life is temporary, and eventually all traces of it will have disappeared. The universe will be devoid of any subjective experience, and will only consist of objective phenomena for the rest of eternity.

If people don't wanna live, they will not.

If people wanna live, they will.

If people don't wanna procreate, they will not.

If people wanna procreate, they will.

If people think life is not worth it, they will hate it.

If people think life is worth it, they will cherish it.

It doesn't matter what we think people should or should not do, because at the end of the day, people will do whatever they truly feel like doing, because they can't help it, everything is determined since the big bang and will be determined till the end.

But there may never be an end, google the Big Loop Theory.

Every desire is subjective, the universe has no law that dictates what you should or should not desire.

We can try to philosophize and moralize, but people will continue to diversify and do whatever they personally feel compelled to do.

There is no logical, reasonable or rational conclusion for anything, that's not how the universe works. There is only what you are deterministically compelled to do.

Life or no life, we don't really have a choice, we can't even choose our own intuitions, let alone the fate of existence.

Maybe life will cease, rejoice, maybe it won't, bummer. The ONLY thing you could do is to be another cog in the machine of determinism, helplessly feeling what you were made to feel.

Choice is an illusion.

Morality is determined.

To live or not, to exist or not, is entirely out of our control.

Fatalistic and pessimistic? Sure, if that's how you feel about reality, but reality has no reason to make you feel good, it will be what it will be.

As far as I understand both of these thinkers, Schopenhauer considered pessimism as an evolutionary wrong turn. A mistake, that will be corrected over time by natural selection. Pessimists usually don't spread naturally, as most of them consider breeding to be immoral and some of them even consider spreading those ideas to be unethical. Because pessimism is not genetic and spreads more like a disease, theoretically, humanity should become more resistant to it over time.

On the other hand, Zapffe seemed to posit, that anti-natalist tendencies are the zenith of human thought. Although he deemed it unlikely, he seemed to think that if humanity were to stop limiting the contents of its consciousness, we would succumb to the truth and eliminate ourselves in "great epidemics of madness" as he termed them.

Is efilism a destiny humanity denies, or a neurological disorder that spreads through logic and language? I'd love to hear Your thoughts. I'd also appreciate some feedback if anyone has objections to my interpretation of both thinker's words.

If there was a big, red, "destroy all life" button, it seems most efilists would be ready to press it.

But what if, instead of just life, the button destroyed the universe in its entirety? Does that wrinkle affect anybody's answer?

Obviously it won't matter to me whether the universe still exists once I'm dead and gone, but the idea of collapsing all of existence just to end my own suffering feels off.

Some philosophers focus solely on minimizing suffering, even if this implies the total absence of pleasure.

From this perspective, one might think that, on an individual level, suicide is the best way to minimize suffering.

However, this assumes that there is no reincarnation/rebirth, meaning it assumes that after death (for example, after the suicide), there is no new life filled with suffering. If we are reborn into suffering, this would mean that suicide does not guarantee the minimization of suffering (for instance, if I commit suicide and am reborn as an animal being skinned alive by hunters, how can one say that my suicide minimized my suffering?). It’s even possible that we are reborn hundreds of billions of times into suffering.

This is why it seems that the question of reincarnation/rebirth must be considered by these philosophers. Therefore, I wonder if there are arguments for or against their existence or non-existence.

A little additional note: I find an interesting model could be that rebirths are not so different from ordinary life. That is, currently, my mind is constantly changing (my sensory perceptions are constantly transforming, being born, disappearing, being replaced by new ones), so one could imagine that "death" is merely a radical transformation of the content of our mind. One could imagine that at the death of the human body, my mind can no longer contain human perceptions produced by my human body, and that the human perceptions I had are replaced by new animal perceptions produced by an animal body that has just been born. Death would just be a radical transformation of the content of the mind, much like, from moment to moment, the "auditory perceptions of the music I am listening" are transformed (although less radically).

Moreover, given that with matter (which is not chronologically primary), "nothing is created, nothing is lost, everything is transformed," it does not seem unreasonable to say that this principle applies to minds (which are also not chronologically primary).

This is not an anti efilist post, I'm actually quite promortalist/ efilist myself ( I don't like it but it's the truth, and I strive for truth.) with that being said I don't understand what I'm going to call "new age efilism" (2020- now). I found this sub back in early 2020 and back then it made sense: life is terrible and evil, it should not exist. No sentient being should procreate, pleasure is evil and not good in of itself and red button talk. But now? I have no clue what this philosophy is about, what it's actually views are, or what the goal actually is, because I'm still not convinced of extinction. This is coming from good faith ( as I know I'm usally an ass) I'm here to learn and understand. Please let me know what the main idea is

American society really doesn't want to talk about or acknowledge suicide. It isolates the suicidal and causes them even more suffering. Even speaking about it can get you locked up involuntarily in some institution. I think that's a great barrier to the normalization of assisted suicide and the discussion about suicide in general. Having suicide more in the public consciousness would ultimately reduce suffering by reducing the stigma around it and letting people be open about the topic without being shut away in a hospital. More people could opt for a way out with dignity with medical assistance surrenounded by loved ones instead of the grisly alternative.

How would you go about normalizing the discussion surrounding suicide? Or do you think trying so would only be in vain? I'm curious to know.

Life on earth evolved in a way that requires suffering, but can life outside of the Earth come about with different rules, or will it follow the same blueprint due to entropy?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZkF1-xMzlw

I know this was posted 3 months ago in this subreddit but I think I'll need to repost it as it seems that not much of people (especially those who should see it) have seen it.

It's all about a reproducing fucking molecule damn it. Will somebody prove that it's not about a reproducing molecule, that our oldest living ancestor wasn't just a reproducing machine and didn't do it on purpose? It didn't say one day I'm going to now cause the chain of events that will create zillions of life forms and they will evolve over billions of years! It didn't make a judgment, say, this is a good idea, I think I'll do this; No, it farted, it just shit, all of a sudden it reproduced, it's chemistry finally got right just happened, it reproduced and in its copy of itself reproduced and its copies of itself reproduced and there the game started. But it didn't initiate, there was no finger, no intelligent finger poking at first event, looking over and saying "ah this is great now I can watch the chain reaction of horror" and go through four billion years of tyrannosauruses and all kinds of shit of eating each other and the whole mess. IT'S A HORROR STORY. It's not a fairy tale damn it, how come people have to keep turning this into some sort of golden unicorn, puss in boots, happy ending kind of crap? It doesn't have any of those things in it, it doesn't have any elements of that. It has this crazy ludicrous prospect where it takes 20 years to finally grow a brain and then you figure out that you're not going anywhere, you're going to a grave! 'What the fuck'? You're gonna, you're gonna, fucking start rotting, you're gonna decompose over decades, you'll take you decades to do it and then you're gonna die and be in a grave, that's your destination. This isn't magic, fantastic design, IT'S CRAZY! You mixed all this consciousness together, it comes out to a big brown ugly pile of shit. For most people it's mediocrity and work, tedium and backache or headache or some other kind of ache and misery here and a complexification there and the chores and this. It's a lot of bullshits to this thing living and we have it good! I mean we have it sophisticated and cleaned up. We're not living out fucking there, I mean come on people, just insane this nonsense. We keep contriving this bullshit, these excuses dude. Say this all makes sense, it's all of design, we're going somewhere, we're accomplishing something; and we're doing nothing we're doing the same thing over and over and over. We're just chasing tail, literally chasing tail! There's nothing to be accomplished here. You're just driven by desire; desire pushed into you; built into you by nature and the conditioning and your culture and all the rest of this crap, of so much of it is subjective crap. The crazy people are running the nut house. It's really the way the world is and if you're rational enough to see the truth, yeah you're going to be in a minority and it's a sad fact that most human beings are just caught up in the chase; they're just rats in this stinking maze. They won't slow down for 10 minutes climb up the wall and take a good look around and figure out where the fuck they are; no they're just too caught up, they can't resist, they smell the cheese and they just keep chasing it. I mean that's all we're doing; built on that stupid design, that stupid DNA molecule; consumption and reproduction!

98% of people's existence is only comprised of creating more problems via breeding, carbon footprint, suffering footprint on animals, enviroment, other humans etc. We really are just need-machines, endless fodder for the death machine called capitalism/consumerism. Even if one problem gets fixed, three other will appear in its place due to our endless, insatiable needs and desires. It's such a tragedy that we spend all our existance doing these primal, cockroachy, self-serving stuff, how litlle we think about why we are here, whats the meaning of it all. When we do we either come up with baseless, total bullshit answers like religion, or when we finally understand that it is pointless we quickly forget it and attempt to drown the bad feelings in carnal pleasures, rather than do something about it.